Tamriel Wolfsbaine

While a single Bands of Mourning will certainly open up conflict... I feel like Kelsier is a big fan of progression and he is after answers. So much tech and progression get made during arms races and war time. The existance of the tension between South and North Scadrial is going to propell them into the next eras for better or worse.

We really don't know enough about medallions to say. We know hemalurgy is as easy as finding a host to give up a power... I could totally see spikes becoming inheritance that is passed on. So far we have seen very limited medallions. It isn't quite as simple as "make medallion and gain power". It appears that medallions may be limited in what functions from a power you are able to use. Hemalurgy isn't limited in that sort of way. I think Hemalurgy and medallions are going to be used in concert with eachother in the future and I don't see the market for either of them ever going away. One of them will obviously be quite taboo and less accepted. There may be strict laws surrounding hemalurgy soon. As much as Sazed tried to hide it that art is going to gain more and more traction.

This might sound horrible, but I say if you are guilty of misusing hemalurgy your punishment should fit the crime. You get spiked appropriately and that spike can be used to better humanity... Okay maybe that sounds darker than I want. Let me try to leave more of an example. If there is no death penalty: Murder gets life in prison Muder for hemalurgy gets life in prison plus they get to spike out your innate investiture and you can spend life without a soul in prison.

This is great thank you for those WoB's. It answers a question I had posed in the cosmere discussion a while back also. So why don't allomancers just use 1-2inch tungsten ball bearings instead of coins? They can generate more of a push on them as the mass would be so much higher and with the way that the allomancer is going to be so much larger it makes sense that a mistborn gearing up for war should just carry some bigger ammo. My personal reasons for using coins instead would be the same reason so many law enforcement agencies moved to the 9mm from other larger caliber weapons. Higher capacity and you dont usually need the bigger gun against squishy targets. Why carry a few larger ball bearings into battle against enemies that wear no armor due to your magic allowing you to manipulate the armor they would wear when you can carry around a far larger amount of ammo that is just as effective against squishy targets anyway? A few hazekillers with wooden shields don't mean much against a mistborn who can choose to leave at any given moment anyway. As far as Wax's time in era 2... why burn steel when you can shoot guns anyway? That is just a different form of conserving energy. Use steel for mobility and let the inexpensive ammunition in your firearms do a lot of the work for you. Less likelihood of running into the "and then his stormlight/steel/pewter ran out" scenarios that are so common in the books. But that WoB does point to a larger, heavier projectile being a better option when facing heavily armored opponents. We just haven't explored a need for bigger ammo on Scadrial yet... guns sort of jumped past it. The more I think about it the more I would say Wax got extremely lucky with that jump. I envision steel pushes to be like shooting an arrow out of a bow. The force of the bow being your allomantic power, the weight of the object (or person's being moved) as being the broadhead of your arrow and the anchor you are trying to use being the shaft and spine of the arrow. Most pushes have such a great difference in size and power and a strong enough spine that they work out exactly how they are meant to when they are used. I think the bending of these steel beams is proof of just how unfamilure Wax was with the Duralumin. Not only a sign of how strong the push was, I think it shows that he was not expecting such force and power from the allomancy used. In order to get that effect he really needed to be way heavier via iron than normal plus have an influx of power that he was not expecting. The bending of the beams suggest that some of the energy from the push was wasted. Like shooting an arrow with a massive arrowhead and a weak spine is nearly as bad as dry firing your bow, the anchor almost didnt support him. In archery that comes when both the arrow head is to heavy and the power of the bow is too great for the spine. A heavy arrowhead alone and a heavier bow alone dont usually end with damaged arrows, but both together can lead to catastrophic failure. If the Duralumin splits the possible force between beams I would say 1 less beam and they would have surely shattered under that weight, a weight that Wax likely was not unfamiliar with using for jumps in the past. But had he been lighter, while the beams wouldnt have buckled and he could have gotten a better push, would he have had the ability to play with conservation of momentum to make the jump? Anyways, I am no engineer nor physicist so I really dont know if this comparison is fair. I do think that archery offers a better explanation for how steel pushes work than guns in my mind but I am open to that being changed. Maybe you could compare it to a really hot load being run through a chamber and barrel that just arent made for it (I fired a really hot .44 mag through my marlin a while back that a buddy had loaded up for me and it about destroyed that pretty lever gun). I definitely like the example used and pointed out by @PapaGeoff and it is a fun thing to look at. We don't see a ton of examples of steel or iron being used and the anchor almost breaking, usually it just does or it doesn't.

I think the memories are confirmed to be Kelsiers aren't they? That said his lack of powers doesn't exclude him from using a medallion to store and even have someone else view. That isn't to say that those memories couldn't possibly be corrupt or altered. I just think that the presence of medallions in general give plenty of evidence for them being legit memories of Kelsier himself regardless of his power status.

Personally, I think Zinc is criminally underrated. More processing speed. Nothing more to be said. All of those small undervalued feruchemy metals are the ones that would make a survival mode type of character so awesome. Keeping extra breath, determination, warmth, sleep, and food or drink all open up the door to such cool character moments. The things that make surviving the cognitive realm hard would be trivialized by a well stocked up feruchemist. I am a bit of a fan of the YouTube channel Fandabi Dozi... he does a lot of survival stuff and I can't help thinking about a survival feruchemist with a big greatkilt and his metalminds going into the wild. As a fan of the show Alone I think what I would take as my 10 items. The greatkilt, a good length of rope and some fishing gear are 3 obvious ones. A set of metalminds would be the next. Determination to push through the lonely times. Some bronze so I can sleep away boredom and stay awaken during dangerous times. Bendalloy and gold are obvious. Cadmium and brass could be used to let you dive for spear fishing even in the cold. You could be down for a ton of time and not need to surface.

Oof. It has been a good 12 years since I read Mistborn. Yeah it is the stones. For some reason my mind thought that she braced herself against the stone and pushed with duralumin. But it was iron against multiple anchors I guess. Good catch with the duralumin. I think I misunderstood what was being said there. A duralumin push should split the power of the push and that makes sense. Duralumin on a single coin should be far greater than duralumin pushing a bunch of coins. That does make more sense. Who knows how much steel Wax had for that duralumin push anyways. It could have been a ton. I do think that the iron feruchemy still likely played a large role in making that jump but there is a world where he simply had a chunk of steel all being burnt at once. I still don't think the Steel beams would bend without iron feruchemy in this case as a stronger push with no opposition would simply throw him further faster. As for the steel being split between multiple beams. I would like to think that the bigger the metal you are pushing on the more force you can generate. Perhaps that is limited only to normal steel pushes.

Exciting to potentially see an engineers thoughts on this. I have to ask about Vin and the scene with the horses... In my mind I always viewed steel as burning per push. Each different line offered a different push. If you push on more lines you burn more steel and you generate the same force on each line you push regardless of pushing on a bunch of horses or a single coin. I really need to reread some mistborn because until reading your post I had never thought of steel as having a limited amount of power split between multiple objects. As I mentioned the scene where Vin duralumin pushes on the horses makes me want to disagree. As well as every scene with multiple coins being used. If using a handful of coins allows for multiple projectiles that all work wouldn't this theory allow a single coin to be shot at far greater speeds and with far greater force? The doors in front of the well of Ascension when Vin duralumin pushes them open. Why would she push on them both if that split the force? Pushing a single door would double it and be far more efficient right? I would be curious if you have specific examples of it working like this as I really don't remember it ever being described as less power when multiple pushes are happening at once. @PapaGeoff I imagine the duralumin push combined with his iron allomancy might be what explains it. I really, after so much effort, don't understand the whole conservation of momentum thing. In my mind this example is the closest thing to rocketing off there is in the book. The jump was impossibly long and I would like to make a case saying that it was impossible even for a duralumin steel push unaided by iron feruchemy. If Wax was far heavier and he pushed it could explain these support beams or whatever bending. If Wax then instantly stored as much weight as possible I feel like conservation of momentum could explain the ability to make that jump as it would have taken far more force to get him airborne in the first place. Is it that cutting your weight in half would double your speed? Either way we know steel is only half of his tool kit. And we know that in order for Vin to break the doors she had to brace herself. I think those beams could only be bent, even with duralumin, if Wax was bracing himself (without pewter he would surely die) or he was tapping a large amount of weight to push into them with and use the conservation of momentum to get that extra umph to get him to the ship. The jump should not have been possible and Kelsier had already spoken of allomantic steel being garbage over water (even knowing he has no allomancy that just makes sense).

Yeah healing kind of kills the fun here. My mind goes beyond that though. Thinking prosthetics I start thinking 6 million dollar man. Not just a matter of having some invested item to replace an arm or a hand or whatever but something created via the magic systems to act and perform better than a hand or an arm. Again the ropes Vasher awakens to lift him up onto ledges or lower him down. They did it effortlessly. Awakened limbs are likely better than non augmented limbs. Heck they are likely better than limbs on stormlight. Healing is busted in the cosmere and it is hard to argue with that. But for those who don't have access to healing they could be augmenting and creating prosthetics that go far beyond what a normal fleshy limb could do even with all of the cosmere arts. Flash back to (Alcatraz spoilers) All really neat visuals and really fun ways to use the magic that likely won't need to be explored because cosmere healing overshadows all. With limitless power on Roshar and 2 classes that literally can raise the dead (except for beloved characters who Brandon wants to die for dramatic effect). I really don't know how anyone would need prosthetics. It would be a complete shame if somehow the surge of regrowth usage were to become monetized...

I am genuinely shocked that this thread was started yesterday. After having the YouTube algorithm heathens send me a "Lie's of P" short and then binging more than a couple game play videos (though I don't play any games anymore) I couldn't help but immediately wonder how I could place a character with that asthetic into the cosmere and have it be functional. I really like @Duxredux point about Roseite. There isn't a ton of information on it but I assume that if the artwork of twinsoul sitting cross-legged inside of the roseite golems torso is legit then the Aether has perfect qualities for acting as a prosthetic... being able to move on its own it could absolutely function as any limb. Things I wish I knew about roseite would be this. When roseite is used to make something does it require constant flow of water to maintain it and work it or is the cost frontloaded enough that maintaining it is trivial? The Kandra point is great. For my purposes (lies of P arm stuff) It makes perfect sense to have a kandra with metallic truebody mixed up with some steampunk-ish tech going on to make sweet arms. Awakening is another one I really want to explore with this. I think awakened shirt tassles becoming as hands plus seeing ropes lift persons up and over ledges is prefect proof that Awakening can do it easily. I have had visions of ramping that up with the 9th heightening and using a bunch of steel cables and ropes as Doc Ock arms. Even thin cables have insane tensile strength and working loads... at the 9th heightening it wouldn't even just be long metal limbs for carrying you around and fighting for you but you could also forge the inner section of the steel cable into long thin daggers and the outer pieces of cable to lay over the blades as an awakened and invested sheath. This would give you access to longer limbs that are awakened metal plus awakened blades hidden in the cable wraps. The breath cost might be high but they could likely carry you around as limbs plus be extra arms and shields to bat away even shardblade attacks all while concealing awakened shardblade daggers. You could use them to run up walls hold on to the ceiling... break your falls... With awakened rope you could un wrap the last few inches of ropes and create fingers and hands for the ropes too. For a whacky combining of powers... Awakened ropes with roseite grown up them and able to be shaped into whatever you need. I don't know how well this would work but if a golem was able to form joints enough to move around I don't see why there couldn't be some roseite / awakened version of an Iron Spider suit with the instant kill command... roseite spikes and points growing off the ends of the ropes and the awakened ropes acting on their own to stab/ punch any enemies. Get yourself bendalloy compounding and you have unlimited regrowing roseite armor / weapons / prosthetics. Not to mention a time bubble of awesomeness that lets you fine tune the commands and a god adjacent character whispering into your mind what they want you to know. I imagine that any of the Aethers would be beyond happy to give a bud to a bendalloy compounder. At least I picture them as being thirsty and greedy. My head cannon is that they want the water at least as badly as the user wants to use the power. (In fact my head cannon has Silajana coaxing Twinsoul to use his powers the way Nightblood wants to be drawn.) Anyways very likely I am far off topic now. I would imagine that other systems could do more as well and potentially do it better but this is the limit of my readings so far and the systems I went to as I googled: 17th shard invested prosthetics.

I can totally see an allomancers box of gobstopper sized metal balls all with layers of different metals. I don't think you need the duralumin core. I believe that all of the duralumin would burn itself away even if it does preserve the other metal. If all the duralumin is connected it would most likely be a waste. But as @Trusk'our said I think multiple beads would work best. What metals are best used with duralumin? Probably would only need a few of these beads made. Some alternating duralumin and steel others alternating duralumin and pewter or iron or the emotional allomantic metals. Maybe time bubbles with duralumin could do a thing? My big question would have to be this. Duralumin gnats can still burn duralumin right? So even if you reached a point where all of your ingested beads were duralumin only you could just burn a couple of those layers off. What if you placed a slice of metal in between the two of them that can't be burnt? Or some other food safe option? And then you alternate sides. Or just a metal that is often burnt but not always on say tin, copper or bronze. Using a ball bearing of steel and duralumin again with copper being the middle divider. DSDSCDSDS This would always allow a section of steel being available for each section of duralumin and leave you with a commonly used metal in-between. Heck if you put aluminum in between you could always purge your system following a day of use.

So I was just throwing together a bunch of numbers and got a ton of decent data points for different ammunition as well as hammers as found in @therunner and my conversation Spheres vs Shards. Kaladins fall is still the most energy I can come up with. Not by a ton. The shardhammer at 100kg, as well as the 700 nitro and 50 BMG are all right behind it with hot load outs (just like a hammer can be swung slower or faster the ammunition can be loaded differently) all of these come out to somewhere in that 20,000 joules range. Being a forged in fire fan I also calculated out the biggest sword they ever made. It weighed 15lbs only but landed that ~6 foot blade length and I feel it is a good comparison for the shardblades we see most commonly in the dueling arena. I had it swing at 40m/s (thinking shardplate would enable you to swing it that fast at least) and got about 5400 joules. And assuming a parshendi club generates 1600 joules and the slings do just under that I think this might work. In my efforts to make sense of all of this I fell back on my old gaming habits and tried to remember those years tanking in various MMOs. In WoW there are 3 or 4 main concepts I think could be combined to explain most of what we see shardplate do. First off, the HP bar for a person wearing shardplate is really actually just stormlight and what makes living plate a cut above the rest is that they are a raid teams worth of healers combined with the tank so that plate will likely suffer far less in the long run. There is a good argument to be made that living plate could have higher base mitigation as well but it we push that too too far we break my brain further. So onto a bit of my theory (decided I wanted feedback before I deliver it in another thread): Like a shield in the MMO plate has a specific amount of damage that simply never gets through. I think 1500 joules or so is a spot that is arguable for what we see in world. Anything 1500 joules or less is going to be wholly ineffective. So long as the plate was fresh and had not sustained a large enough hit yet. The plate could be carrying a 75% kinetic energy reduction at that point. The first time the plate gets hit it lowers the damage reduction threshhold by an amount. Maybe the next hit only needs 1400kinetic energy to start to make those cracks. As well as weakening the large 75% damage reduction down to a more manageable amount. So give the plate a 10,000 kinetic energy threshold hold. It starts out absorbing 1500 kinetic energy minimum without issues and lowers all other kinetic energy by 75%. Your 20,000 kinetic energy kick, guns or shardhammer are only getting 5000 of that energy through. But at 50% broken the plate now only has a flat mitigation of 700 kinetic energy as it is losing structural integrity and it is fragile enough that it can only block upwards of 50% of the next blast. That gun can only do 10000 to it. Here we hit a snag. I think the plate will always give you one last hold. All overkill on a piece of plate gets negated by the outward force of the explosion. Shardblades are magical and avoid all damage resistance by the plate. So that first 5000 energy blow damages close to what the first 20000 energy shot or kick does. Plus it would allow the parshendi hammer time parties to make sense as well. I think it works fairly well considering the fact that it is powered by stormlight. More stormlight like in the case of radiants could heal back and as it heals back it will gain its resistances again proportionally. Your big hits still have devastating effects while bringing a 20000 joule hit in line to make sense with the 5000 joule strike of a shardblade against full plate and still stopping the 1 shot potentials. It probably needs a bunch of tweaking but it is the only way I can make sense of what we see in book. Kaladins drop kick didnt specifically say he broke 4 different pieces of plate just that it cracked in 4 corners on the back and not at the point of impact. I kind of picture it as cracking at the edges as the plate tried to absorb the energy but a Shockwave hit where it wrapped around the guy and cracked at those corners. Now for some in world justification for the mechanic: It is the spren making up the plates moral that allows them to be so efficient. Large hits break moral quickly but many smaller hits will also wear it down. As they take a massive blow they see failure more and more just as they would if 3 guys surrounded them smashing over and over. Stormlight directly feeds their moral and thus you have healing plate. Their last ditch effort when dropped to 0% moral is to violently shove back one last stand against the thing hitting them before breaking fully. Investiture resists investiture and all shard blades cancel them out. Only think I can't wrap my head around is why everyone wouldn't just carry living shardhammers if this is anywhere near correct. I guess if it works in this way nothing can get more than a 1 shot. A living shardhammer could do it but the overkill rule limits it to 1 piece or whatever at a time. For normal non shard weapons you would need 40000+ kinetic energy to destroy a single piece of armor in 1 shot. If you can land a hit on multiple pieces of armor they simply divide the damage dealt amongst themselves.

Moved this whole thing to a different thread I mentioned you in.

I guess that all depends on if I get any powers from that place and have the knowledge of how to use them. If I was just a total random person being dropped into a world with no powers I would probably choose Scadrial. Elendel has been saved from Autonomy and it seems there will be some peace for now. I imagine they have indoor plumbing and some really bomb resturaunts to eat at (thinking A and F tin using chefs should do a bangup job with their flavor profiles). Plus there is so much wonder to explore. If I could enter with a single breath I would choose Hallendren. Because I really want breath. In fact the idea of waking up somewhere random at the end of a book... hows this: I wake up in Hallendren, I remember nothing because I was murdered by lifeless an hour ago but now I am brought back as a returned. Done and Done.

I wonder what shardhammers are made from. I guess it wouldn't take a ton of volume to hit those weights with one seeing how much exponential growth a sphere has as it gets bigger and bigger. I assume the shaft must also be made of a fairly durable metal as well. At what I would imagine is a 3 inch in diameter shaft. (I believe it describes it as bending and becoming useless for Dalinar at one point.) Given that the energy gets to such bonkers levels when thinking about the size of needing 2 people to carry it I think it is another instance of Brandon going with the rule of cool and in writing it sounded awesome but it is really hard to explain yourself afterwords. If a 60kg shard hammer does less damage with a strike than Kaladins drop kick I wonder how it was that only kaladins legs broke. He honestly should have popped into a pile of goo. I really don't know how to accurately calculate a hammer swing but 60kg at 35m/s would be 36700 joules. Far above the 23800 you estimated kaladin used. Again I have no idea how to calculate a 60kg hammer as it isn't as simple as all of the mass hitting at once like a ball being thrown. But the hammer cracks a piece of plate where Kal broke 4 right? I see the shardhammer much the same way I see Dalinars catching the chasmfiend. It makes plate look incredible and rule of cool is awesome. But then we find out chasm fiends have a spren bond to make themselves magnitudes lighter than they should be for their size out of necessity and want to breathe. Saying 2 people needed to carry it to him could have been largely in part because of the terrible balancing issues a hammer that large must have. Like moving a super awkward piece of furniture. Not saying it couldn't be that large but it would be very difficult to move a hammer shaped that way even if it was half that weight. Anyways I am trying to process how the plate might work out and I think I may have an idea but I will make a new thread to grab more eyes. I think 22 posts back and forth between the same 2 people may be less welcoming when I know I have gone so far off topic.