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  1. Vax

    The Vax that Ati is talking about could be different from the Vax that Khriss is talking about. That's the basis of my point. I think we can agree, that if they are different things, then the naming is not coincidental. Given the circumstances and the two speakers, it seems like the Vax that Ati mentions predates the Vax that Khriss mentions. We know that the Vax that Khriss mentions is a place. As Ati-Vax predates Khriss-Vax, we can't assume anything about Ati-Vax from her statement. I.e. A implies B, but B doesn't imply A. That leaves only the situation in which Ati says "Vax?" which I've argued seems like a person's name.
  2. Vax

    Just to be clear: I think it is safe to assume that Vax is currently (Ars Arcanum time of writing) at least a planet (or of planet-like significance, like the only habitable city on a planet, or a habitable sub-astral more significant than the Ire Keep in Secret History, or the largest continent on Yolen). However, circumstance is important. There is a Washington street in my city. If Benjamin Franklin is saying "Washington" there is a solid chance his is talking about George Washington. If I say "Washington" there is a solid chance I am talking about the street in my city, or the city in my country, or the state in my country. This example speaks to exactly how Vax could refer to a person at one time, and a place at another time. In fact, I could even be talking about George Washington if I was to say "Washington." This further muddles the certainty that Ati is referring to place-Vax vs. person-Vax. I do definitely agree that Khriss at least was referring to a place when she wrote the Ars Arcanum. I don't agree that her writing proves Ati was talking about a place.
  3. Vax

    You're right, forgot about that one. Same issue applies that it may have been a person, not a place. I do think Ati probably realized that he was on a subastral. That doesn't imply that he was addressing Vax based on the fact that he was on a particular subastral. Again, it doesn't seem natural to me to just address a place when you appear there suddenly. Like I wouldn't say "White House?!" if I was transported there instantaneously. If Abraham Lincoln was right in front of me when I appeared, I would probably say, "Lincoln?!" It might be true that he believed that he could link the subastral to an individual; and that individual would possibly respond to a summons. That points me an ascended individual. Either that, or we are back to talking about a name applying to both a person and a place (with an implied link). It's also very possible that this was just a poorly written piece of dialog which didn't take into account the natural reaction of a person to appearing suddenly in an unknown place. It is a relatively early Sanderson work. I tend to ere on the side of Sanderson knowing exactly what he is doing though, and his coy-ness about calling Vax a place makes me think that there is more to it. If it is just a place, I'm guessing that a continent/place on Yolen is possible. There is a little bit of background here. Not to get off topic here, but Ati and Leras seemed super close friends (with a possible romantic angle, which is how I choose to read the situation). So while we can safely assume any gathering of 5+ shards implies Yolen; I think that just the two of them travelling around together and encountering a place or person called Vax before creating Scadrial is also possible. There is definitely a WoB which says that most of the shards wandered around before settling down.
  4. Vax

    I'm not sure we know that 3 is correct. We do know that at least Ati interacted with or knew of something called Vax at some point (probably before Scadrial). I do agree with 4, except for the major part. It may be major however, we just don't know. Seems likely that it is an invested place at the very least. On 5, it is worth noting the time differential. Ati was not sane until he was separated from the shard of Ruin. He is unclear on how much time has passed between his arrival on Scadrial and his death. I think I've mentioned it already, but it would be weird if you woke up in an unknown place and just shouted "New York!" That makes me consider that Ati thinks he is addressing an individual. Given the time differential, we could be dealing with a place named after a person (who could be a shard/invested and still alive). Last thing, I think we have a WoB stating that Vax is not Hoid, but if it is a place only, that doesn't mean much.
  5. I added some extra stuff in bold. I tend to think that Odium doesn't have the win completely locked up and has just been waiting to show off how in-hand the situation was. The biggest reason for this is that is isn't interesting. It makes for more interesting writing when we have more equal footing. We definitely haven't seen all of his power, but I think we have seen a good amount of it. It's possible that this is basically proof that the Honor blades did not give access to functionally infinite investiture. Or if they did, Honor controlled the flow as to not open himself up to direct conflict with Odium. With the kind of power you correctly state they would have with functionally infinite investiture, it seems unlikely they could lose. So maybe we should look at it like that?
  6. This is the passage you mentioned I think (she repeats this thought to the Stormfather, but it is the same information). That betrayal seems unconnected to the changing of forms, but I suppose that it could be the betrayal, or part of the betrayal, that is mentioned in the Song of Spren. This is not correct. The Gods of the Dawnsingers were, probably, Cultivation and Honor. We don't have a direct statement, but we know that The Stormfather, the Nightwatcher, and presumably the Sibling (or the spren of stone), were not quite sentient before the arrival of Honor and Cultivation. I have a hard time believing that they could have commanded the Dawnsingers. We have no evidence that the Dawnsingers were not aware that Honor and Cultivation were present and guiding the three spren, if the three spren did directly address them. In the Eila Stele, they refer to their gods, and to spren, stone, and wind. They aren't saying the spren, stone, and wind are their gods. And in the passage with Eshonai directly states that the Stormfather was not a God of the Listeners at least. The Gods of the Listeners were their ancestors, and by extension Odium (the Listeners feared their gods, and worked against their return. They did refer to them as gods however). To me, it seemed the Dawnsingers worshiped the spren of the planet before Honor and Cultivation arrived, and then worshiped Honor and Cultivation. There was a lot of years between the arrival of Honor and Cultivation and the arrival of Odium. The wiki at least explicitly states that Honor was a god of the Dawnsingers. I doubt it. They still used forms without power after Odium arrived, and those forms were taken during the Highstorm. The Everstorm didn't even exist, so they had to change forms during the Highstorm until the arrival of Everstorm. It is possible that the only reason we see Parshmen change during the first Everstorm is that it was restoring their identities. I.E. They were in a form before the False Desolation, and when BAM was imprisoned, they turned to slaveform. When the Everstorm arrived, they returned to the form that was still part of their identity (more accurately, a form that was part of their parent's identity, or one that they had become marginally closer too during their years as slaves, or just a random form). We don't have any information that a Parshman can change between the common forms during a Everstorm, only that they can ascend to become a fused only during the Everstorm. We don't know how long passed before the Listeners regained the ability to change out of Dullform, but it was only about 2000 years (according to Jasnah) between the current day and the False Desolation. I doubt they were formless for more than 100 years, since living in Dullform for that long in the danger of the Shattered Plains would kill them pretty quickly.
  7. That's a rough comparison to swallow lol.
  8. Pattern, Syl, and Wyndle. Not as big on Ivory, but we haven't seen him as much. Nightblood is also there (although it isn't his only appearance, I like him better with Szeth than Vasher. Vasher never seemed to take him seriously as a consciousness, but Szeth treats him as more of an equal). The spren don't get enough love. To me, these kind of characters are what makes the SA great. Lot of books have magic, but only some have magic plus a glowy/shapey/viney/inky/smoky friend that comes with.
  9. Seems likely to me that he'll be doing that or something similar. Honestly, Zigsil asks Kaladin a bunch of questions in OB about how the radiants are supposed to work, and I was a little disappointed we don't get some resolution on that. There will have to be some discussion on what their place in the world is. Now that we have multiple radiants, we'll hopefully see some different approaches being tried.
  10. Ya you're right. Either way it'll be a long wait. There are two semi-conflicting WoB on the subject of when this information will be revealed: versus Both are old, and both are vague.
  11. I'm not sure I understand you. The Listeners change form in a Highstorm, but that practice doesn't seem to have stopped at any point (except during right before the recreance). And the listeners we followers of Honor and Cultivation for thousands of years before humans arrived. When did the Stormfather betray them?
  12. I've read through all the WoB on Heralds in the Arcanum. He pretty much RAFO's any question that he is asked. He even expanded on that once and said that "He doesn't want people paying attention to them yet." I like this discussion, and the other one about how the heralds were killed, but the speculation might be premature, since we wont have anything 1st person for another 5 books (Shalash and Taln are supposedly books 9 and 10 I think). Thats like a decade of waiting before the speculation is resolved.
  13. It think we are due for a Gaz and or Vhatha POV chapter. I'm hoping that this POV would help clear up some of these changes. Honestly his changes is pretty similar to the bridgemen, and we bought into those because we got to see all of it happen. If we could see it referenced in a POV, we could at least assume that he went through a similar change offscreen.
  14. Oh for sure. I'm pretty sure they do it cause it's super metal. And the heralds seem like they are pretty metal.
  15. Well, we do only have 2 stanza's. We probably will get more in SA4, since we have a Singer focus. I'm not sure those two stanza's give any actual information beyond speculation. They were written by a singer. Just because they are old doesn't mean that they had anything other than opinion. We can safely assume two things: 1. The stanzas are important, as they are written into WoR (irl WoR, not in-world) while other things aren't. 2. The singers (I think assuming this was a general consensus among the eventual Listeners at least), had the opinion represented by the stanzas. Line by line: But it is not impossible to blend Their Surges to ours in the end. This indicates that it was at least thought to be possible at some point. It has been promised and it can come. Someone, at some point, told the singers that this was a possibility. The general tone implies that this promise was supplied by a credible source. Or do we understand the sum? We questioned not if they can have us then, But if we dare to have them again. This is the most important line to me. It implies there is fear or trepidation about bonding spren. Beyond that, there is fear that the promise they will eventually bond spren could be a cause for concern rather than celebration.