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wannabeninja

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  1. Hey everyone Firstly, I think Adolin has really shone in this book. However, as the story arc between him, shallan, and kaladin unfolded I saw that Adolin’s role in this three way relationship as not as shallan’s fiance/boyfriend. Rather he was an emotional anchor for BOTH Shallan and Kaladin almost a babysitter of sorts. Remember throughout this book Shallan has slowly degraded in her DID as she continued pushing uncomfortable thoughts into the back of her mind. Kaladin’s reservations about the nature of warring with voidbringers culminated into a extremely severe bout of depression/ptsd caused by the most horrifying circumstances. In both of these cases Adolin was there to pick BOTH of them back up and keep them going. Such as keeping up to make sure Kaladin was keeping up with the group after entering Shadesmar, or helping Shallan regain herself (or at least a semblance of herself) whenever she was having a bout of extreme DID. However, Adolin seems to only be able to help them deal with the “symptoms” of their problems not the “source” of it. With Kaladin, if Kaladin were to ever “freeze” he would be there to help pull him out of it however, when it comes to dealing with Kaladin’s anxiety and and depressive episodes he is either is oblivious or probably doesn’t know what to do. With Shallan we already know that Shallan is using him as essentially a mental haven whenever uncomfortable thoughts or her DID are starting to overwhelm her however, although he tries to talk to her about this issue she always just brushing it off. To me this shows that Adolin is a GOOD FRIEND who wants to and can occasionally help them, however, he doesn’t truly understand what they are going through and can only relate so much to not just shallan but also Kaladin. Secondly, my theory that Shallan and Adolin are going to break up/”divorce” in the next book is not because of a personal distaste of the Shadolin ship (there are some great scenes in OB like when Adolin starts teaching Shallan about fighting with a shard blade and the dinner scene at the beginning of the book) but rather feel their relationship is not going to last because of one major thing. This wedding has established that Shallan has essentially connected and equated her relationship with Adolin to her delusion that “everything is alright” when it is clearly not. Her relationship with Adolin is now directly tied to that delusion. So when she confronts that delusion she will also have to confront her true feelings for Adolin and they are probably not as she initially thought. However, this brings the other point that people think this will cause angsty Love-Triangle Drama. However, I think that this break up might be more amicable. Adolin has had a surprising streak of always taking things in stride, it will definitely be disheartening and sad but not drama-filled. I think that the Shadolin ship will ultimately be a learning experience for Shallan, a lesson that will help her realize herself. That’s also why I think it won’t end with Adolin dying, because if he does then it takes all of the agency of Shallan’s story away and nobody wants that and I’m pretty sure BS is a good enough author to realize that. As dalinar said at the very end of OB “A Journey will have pain and failure...The knowledge that we will fail. That we will hurt those around us...if we accept the person we are when we fall. The Journey ends...To Love the Journey is to accept no such end...The most important step a person can take is always the next one.” Dalinar learned this lesson at the end of this book and I think Shallan is about to have a very interesting yet familiar lesson in the next one. Lastly, maybe it’s just me but everybody seems to think the Shalladin story seems to be just some side plot attached to the overall story arcs of Kaladin and Shallan. However, after reading the books several times I’ve come to realize that the Shalladin arc has actually been there from the very beginning. The Shalladin story is very much heavily tied to Kaladin and Shallan’s story. There’s a duality between them that’s been there from the very beginning, especially when it comes to their respective love lives. In the Way of Kings we explore Kaladin’s first childhood romance with Laral, a young lighteyed girl who lives with her family in a small estate in the countryside (boy doesn’t that sound familiar). With Shallan we have her first experiences at romance with Kabsal, a student ardent studying in the schools of Kharbranth (where was Kaladin going to again before the whole Army debacle?) Both of these romances were short-lived and ended in tragic ways (Laral ends up married to Roshone, and Kabsal turns out to be an assassin who dies in his attempt at Jasnah’s life). The second book we get more overt references to the duality between Kaladin and Shallan’s story. First there’s the slight nod to them riding the same cart into the shattered plains. Then Shallan becomes betrothed to Adolin. Her second romance. From here, although we got glimpses of it in the first book, we start to get a more solid picture of Kaladin’s previous relationship with Tarah. Kaladin’s second romance. Then of course there’s the chasm sequence. Finally OB, Shallan’s relationship with Adolin starts to get more serious, and we suddenly get a straight up vivid flashback to Kaladin’s relationship with Tarah as he tries to deal with his feelings for Shallan. From all these observations this has shown me that these two possibly have/or can have a deep connection. They’ve shared extremely similar life experiences and you can tell that it’s there when they interact with each other (at least it is from how I interpret it). That’s why I have grown to like this Shalladin ship so much. @PhineasGage pointed out that a big theme of Stormlight is symmetry. Not only do we see that in their respective back stories but that actually has reinforced me more towards thinking that I think they will end up together now. One of the biggest unexplored factors in the Shalladin relationship is that we haven’t really seen if Kaladin can connect with and help Shallan on the level that she helped him. Yes Shallan has connected with Kaladin and helped him. Kaladin refers to his relationship with shallan as “A lightening of burdens,” she doesn’t “fix” Kaladin’s depression and deep seated issues, but she does make it more easier to live with. She's taught him that maybe always being "brightlord-brooding eyes" isn't the best way to go about ilfe. That's what she showed him in the chasm and that lesson has culminated at the end of OB Kaladin learning that it’s okay to be happy and that there can be brightness in the world. Kaladin has grown as a person from his relationship with Shallan. How does this relate to the theme of symmetry? Well like I said in my last post I think Shallan is about to have a very familiar predicament to us readers in Stormlight 4. Stuck between two Oaths she can’t keep slowly killing a spren, with the way she is right now she’s probably going to need some help and to talk to someone who’s had a similar experience and I think it about time Kaladin’s going to return the favor. Perhaps a chasm-toned sequence where the roles are reversed? Many people seem to be disappointed by the way this romance has panned out but for me I’m excited. I feel that what many people thought as simple side story that ended abruptly without resolution in this book is actually a slow romantic burn that began from the very first book and is going to span the entire first five story arc. That what seems like an abrupt end with no answers is actually a crescendo like turning point of this story. I may not have changed anyone’s mind about this issue but nonetheless, for me this is why I can’t wait for Stormlight 4… P.S. i know that the Shalladin story is probably extremely trope fillled but with that line of thinking you’re focusing on the destination remember the journey is what makes it interesting P.P.S. My wishful thinking theory is this leads to a Radiant battle couple
  2. Oh I see. If that's the case though I wonder what caused Honor/Cultivation to choose humans over the native parshendi. Or why the parshendi didn't first go to Honor/cultivation before resorting to Odium...
  3. Favorite moments: Oh Crap! Moment: When Kaladin was about to go all crazy on the invading Parshendi in the Kholinar Palace only to realize that he recognizes them... Funny Moment: Lopen making the second Windrunner Oath (sometimes the stormfather can be a real penhito hahaha) Awesome Moment: The entire final battle at Thaylen City. All of it. Most Emotional Moment: "You can't have my pain...." (Talk about darkest before the dawn) Favorite Character: I felt Adolin really shone in this book. I thought he was an ok character from the last two, however with this one I really started to like him. Hoping for that edgedancer status haha.
  4. Hey everyone, So i Don’t know if this has been pointed out but now that we know that the Desolations were first started by the Humans invading Roshar with Odium as their first god. Who was the Oathpact originally intended for? Was it for the humans or the parshendi? I originally thought the oathpact was an answer to the desolations from Honor and the radiants were a response to the oathpact with spren copying it. Does this mean that the heralds aren’t the original people in the oathpact? Were they originally parshendi?
  5. Hey everybody longtime lurker first time poster, So my view on the whole love-triangle issue is that I don’t think it’s actually settled. I don’t think Shallan has fully committed herself to Adolin as what is implied by the wedding. The reason I think this is the case is firstly because of all the hints throughout the book that have already been pointed out by many in this discussion such as shallan’s lack of accepting the multiple personalities as being a part of her or, in this particular case, the lack of any real confrontation/resolution about her feelings for Kaladin. However, what I like to point out is that remember that in this book we learn that oaths (like that of committing yourself to someone) are only as strong and solid as the person’s meaning to them at a spiritual/deep level. That means that you can have as much fancy fare and decoration as you want, but if you don’t have true meaning behind the oath you’re making then it doesn’t really matter. It’s not meaningful. Dalinar and Navani were fully invested in their commitment to each other at the wedding in the beginning of the book and I think Shallan’s wedding is partly to juxtapose to that scene. Where Dalinar/Navani’s wedding is a true commitment although it was extremely informal with only close friends and family, Shallan’s commitment to Adolin isn’t true although it has all the extravaganza of a stereotypical wedding. There’s also a lot of red flags during shallan’s pre-wedding scene that hint that things aren’t going as they seem to be. Several others have already pointed out the odd things in the Shallan/Veil/Radiant conversation. However, something i also noticed is that the wedding ritual itself might have a red flag as because it is done with Vorin Traditions in mind, Shallan was to paint a prayer glyph for meditation and burn it in the brazier but she never actually completes it. That I think is another hint that Shallan might be jumping into this decision without, well, meditating on it. This brings me to the prediction that in the next book will be spent as essentially the climax to this story arc where Shallan will have to confront all of these problems. Mostly because I think she is going to start “killing” pattern like all of those years ago. The reason I think of this is going to happen is mostly because it follows the ongoing duality of Shallan and Kaladin’s story throughout these books. With this wedding Shallan has just put herself into a situation where her oaths clash with each other. Just like in Kaladin’s predicament in WoR where his radiant oath to protect clashes with the oath to join in the King’s assasination plot nearly killed Syl. Shallan’s predicament will be where her radiant oath to be true to herself will clash with her oath of commitment to Adolin. That also leads me to predict that ultimately Shallan and Adolin will technically go through a “divorce” in the next book. I think this partly because a running theme in Stormlight is the breaking down of classic traditions as the world enters a new age with new traditions so what’s more radical breaking down of classic traditions than a dissolution of a Vorin marriage when there really hasn’t been one before. Mainly however, it’s because I feel a part of Shallan’s growth is accepting the fact that she might not love Adolin as much or in the way she initially thought she did. And Although some here have pointed out that Sanderson holds the sanctity of marriage pretty personally, I believe what he’s going to point out here with is that what’s important is the Oath/vow you make in the marriage not necessarily all the ceremony and extravagance of the marriage. Now does this mean Shalan will leave Adolin and then go to Kaladin? I’m really not sure here. I admit I am of the Shalladin ship, however the only thing I can honestly predict is that some resolution between them will be met whether they decide to just stay friends or actually start a relationship or whatever. (I think there will also be tension here on Kaladin’s side as I predict Tarah will return early on next book and the possibility of a reviving romance will be an ongoing issue with him.) I apologize for such the long post but this aspect of the story is honestly one of the most intriguing parts of the story for me and after reading all these theories and the constant re-reading (i’m pretty sure I’ve read this book three times now in the span of week lol) It really urged me to post this. Thanks for reading.
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