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936 Worldbringer

About robardin

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  1. So Mraize's letter to Shallan in Oathbreaker Ch. 40 has a lot of stuff about the Sons of Honor, the madness of Heralds, and the nature and mission of the Skybreakers, all of which we've seen separate corroboration of. What doesn't ring quite as true are the bits describing Shallan's family. There's already a thread speculating about the true allegiance of Helaran and the source of his Shards. But what I've begun to wonder is exactly what group was behind Shallan's mother trying to kill her as a child? That group evidently knew there was a Surgebinder in the Davar household, which is why Shallan's mother and her "friend" tried to kill her as a child. That fits in with the Skybreaker mandate as we know it to have been at the time. So... Skybreakers, as claimed by Mraize, who thought he was the one "attracting a spren" in the Davar household, so tried to make him a Skybreaker? That doesn't fit with what we know actually happened, right? This was Shallan's "true memory" of the events that constituted her (re-achieving) the Third Ideal: Shallan then killed both her mother and her "friend" with her Patternblade. If they were Skybreakers, as Mraize claimed, how is it that Shallan then continued living unmolested for years with her father and brothers? Surely the "friend", if he had been a Skybreaker, would have had his failure to return and report noticed. And Nalan doesn't seem like the giving-up-after-one-underling-failed type of guy. Also, her mother's first action was not to go after Shallan directly, with her "friend" as backup or supervisor, but to confront and argue with her father, as if they ought to have been on the same page with this conclusion, with him being difficult about an unpleasant but necessary task. So either her father had also been a Skybreaker, who broke with them over this matter of killing Shallan and then somehow covered it all up such that they never followed up again, and then switched over to the Ghostbloods (perhaps for protection against the Skybreakers?).... Or they had ALL been Ghostbloods, with a reason at the time to want Shallan as "one of them" dead, whatever "them" indicated, and that her father managed to recast events to the GBs in a way to suggested "mission accomplished" or to convince them to take another tack. "She could be valuable to us in the future", or "I will keep her Light suppressed", or some such. Mraize had early on admitted that killing another Ghostblood, even a senior one, "is not forbidden, but it is hardly encouraged", and that "your family has a long history of involvement in these events." He also seems to know that Shallan Davar is a Lightweaver - and not a Truthwatcher, the other Order that could spin illusions to mask herself as Veil - by commenting on her being a living Soulcaster. And Helaran? the last time Shallan ever saw him, he'd returned to their house with a Shardblade, and did and said some interesting things (Words of Radiance, Chapter 19). He sees Shallan drawing, and notices that almost against her will, she began sketching "bodies, facedown, on the floor", as the charcoal seeped out of the texture like blood. He doesn't freak out, but crumples it up quickly and tells her, "Draw plants and animals. Safe things, Shallan. Don't dwell on what happened." He knows what she is doing and what it can do or represent. "We can't have vengeance yet... Balat can't lead the house, and I must be away." Vengeance? He blames his father, and not Shallan, for their mother's death. Right? But, he also doesn't want to kill Shallan. Hmm. He confronts his father with "his crimes", calling him a "vile corruption upon this house" and a "murderer" while putting a Shardblade to his chest, to which his terrified father replies, "You don't know what you think you know. Your mother --" And then as Helaran leaves, he says to his father, "Try not to ruin too much while I'm gone. I will come back periodically to check." Ruin what? This is still consistent with them both being Ghostbloods. A Family of Ghostbloods. Once. Who had some kind of mandate that his father derailed, but not completely. However, it does read like Helaran had gone "above and outside" boundaries known to Lin Davar to gain the Shardblade. The Skybreakers? Maybe? Or, perhaps, Shallan's mother was not coming to kill her, but to do something else with the knife. Like to carve the Ghostblood triple diamond symbol on her or something? That's a bit more of a stretch.
  2. Helaran may or may not have been an acolyte Skybreaker, as claimed by Mraize. I tend to think not. Why would they have "dead" Shards on hand, when as far as we can see, living spren find them an abomination? Or do highspren hot have such a reaction? We also see other Skybreaker acolytes from Szeth's POV, and they certainly aren't being given Full Shards as part of their testing. (Szeth being given Nightblood is obviously an exceptional special case, but he was kind of "pre-ordained" by Nale himself.) And given what we've seen it takes to impress Nale... What did Heleran do, exactly? But here's another thought that may lead to a better idea about Helaran: what group was behind Shallan's mother trying to kill her as a child? I think that is one of the biggest lies in Mraize's letter. That's a related but tangential line of thought, I'm going to start another thread on that topic (there doesn't seem to be a current one)
  3. Obviously an Allomancer would not be able to create an Essence Mark, as that would require someone from MaiPon on Sel to do; but as we see Shai do, it's certainly possible (though very difficult) for a Forger to create one for someone else. So it occurred to me that it should be very easily plausible that a Lurcher might have turned out to be a Coinshot, or any other kind of Misting, though "full upgrading" to Mistborn status would be a lot less plausible. They already won the sDNA lottery to be an Allomancer, so to speak, and have a stronger Spiritual Connection with Preservation than most other poeple; only the specific expression of that would be changed, where that connection point happened to lie, right? And if some types of Allomancers are indeed "naturally" (Harmonically) more rare or more common than others then maybe it'd be easier/harder to make a Mark to alter someone to that use that metal. For Twinborn, I'd think there'd be a crossing type of effect that made it more than twice as hard to change both metals instead of just one. Still, imagine if Wayne could stamp himself to be a gold compounder for a bit, changing just his A-bendalloy to A-gold, fill a bunch of goldminds, then go back to normal. He'd sure like that! But such a change would only be effective while the Allomancer was on Sel, wouldn't it? Where Allomancy would work, but he'd have to get there first. I once asked if Ashravan could leave the Rose Empire with his Essence Mark, or if it was bound by location to be close to MaiPan or the Rose Empire - or if maybe he could travel freely until it was time to re-stamp himself, at which time he'd have to be in the Rose Empire for the stamping to work. I couldn't find that thread again in a search (I probably misspelled his name or something). But I think the consensus was that he maybe could travel to the Cognitive Realm that way, but physical travel was likely limited to the Rose Empire? Based on there being a WoB of some kind that Forged goods like vases or furniture would not keep their form if removed too far from the Rose Empire. Still, it's kind of fun to imagine someone temporarily but regularly swapping powers without resorting to hemalurgy.
  4. Well Hoid does dye his hair black while posing as Wit, though he is described or seen as white-haired elsewhere on Roshar (swimming out of the depths of the Horneater Ocean, jumping into the mouth of a greatshell, etc.). Maybe he's not dyeing the hair, it turns black under certain conditions when he reverses himself in some way! LOL. (No way.)
  5. True, I suspect Copperclouds often become savants just like Seekers do; but I would think that day-to-day that means more of an efficiency thing than a strength thing. In other words, without being aware of the need to burn at a >1 multiplier when an Inquisitor was in the area (or might be), they would just be adept at either increasing the coverage of the cloud or making it last longer on the same amount of copper as the expression of their savantism. Most of the "flaring" of copper (which has to be consciously done, not as an unconscious reaction) would happen when they know or suspect an emotional Allomancer was working on them, to couteract the flaring of brass/zinc from the other guy.
  6. Yes, and I suspect an Allomancer flaring copper would still block out a double-Seeker of ordinary generational strength (didn't spike a lerasium MB/Seeker). But how often would a Smoker even think to flare their metal, except to extend coverage by area rather than concentrating the defense in a smaller one? We do see Kelsier flaring copper to improve the shielding against the Lord Ruler's massive Soothing, but that's a very special case. Yet another reason to keep the double Seeking nature of some Inquisitors on the down-low.
  7. There were 16 original Inquisitors, according to Ministry doctrine (as quoted by Yomen, anyway), and there were probably only about as many later on as well. Marsh killed several outside the throne room by removing their linchpin spike while they were resting (and not suspecting one of their own), and later, Vin and Elend kill three between them before she takes down 13 of them while she Ascended (except for finishing off Marsh, the only one left). Perhaps there even can only be 16 of them, and Ruin created enough to make up the tally to fill the gap left by Marsh's little murder spree. I think it's also as simple that even a hemalurgically doubled Seeker or Mistborn would still have to concentrate pretty hard to pierce copperclouds. Vin could do it (even without realizing about her earring), but she had to focus to do so, when she already had an idea that someone was using Allomancy in a given area and flared her bronze to Seek it out. A more general "sweeping" or passive type of Seeking probably wouldn't be enough. A lerasium Mistborn like Elend could possibly passively pierce Clubs' or Vin's coppercloud, even without a spike, and almost certainly TLR himself could.
  8. Whoa, that particular annotation never sank in properly until you bolded it for me. They don’t realize it, but the Lifeless are far more aware than everyone assumes. Clod in this book is a foreshadowing of that... Where we elsewhere learn that Clod is a reanimated Arsteel, one of the Five Scholars that went way back with Vasher and thus also a Returned (in life). Now remember that the way Vasher dealt with the Lifeless horde set upon the Idrians by Bluefingers' machinations was to send his stone-bound golems to destroy them. Unlucky.
  9. Oh, Sweet Harmony. I guess we should be glad that ReLuur the kandra was not named LuNaar or GibBuss to further this awful "ha ha they don't get it in-world" effort at punning.
  10. Well put. Or as I like to think of it, Kelsier is kind of the inverse of Ralph from Wreck-It Ralph, where as the villain of a cabinet-style arcade game, he gets reassured at one point that "just because you are a 'bad guy' doesn't mean you're a bad guy." Kelsier? He's definitely a BAD guy, like John Shaft (shut yo' mouth!); he's a complicated man, but no one understands him but his <brother?>. That doesn't mean he's a "bad guy". But it wouldn't someday preclude it, that's for sure.
  11. The whole "interference" thing about why mixing genes for Allomancy with Feruchemy resulted in Ferrings or Twinborn highlights something else, too: that a "Fullborn" like Rashek is extremely unnatural and could only happen when a full Feruchemist ingested a lerasium bead or effected a direct Spiritweb twiddle while Ascendant, then de-Ascending back into a mortal. All of Rashek's oppression of the Terris and attempt to weed out Feruchemy for hundreds of years via extremely controlled "breeding programs" that isolated the Terris bloodlines from those with Allomancy, actually served to keep (full) Feruchemy alive, even as it made Feruchemists much more rare than before.
  12. Marsh made a comment about how Harmony, by his own rules, had to allow for Marsh to have a different opinion on things like giving Marasi the hemalurgic notebook that Spook had written, even though he's easily capable of taking full control of Marsh at any time, Ruin-style: "Harmony has particular views about how things must be done. I do not always agree with him. Oddly, his particular beliefs require that he allow that." And those "particular views" differed exactly on the topic of passing that information on, which the kandra later relay (that in Harmony's view, Spook shouldn't have written that book, nor Marsh brought it back to light). But he then also comments that Wax "is doing my brother's work, and that is something I feel inclined to encourage", which is intriguing to look back on after Wax's talks with TenSoon and Harmony in the next two books. Does that mean that Kelsier had previously acted in a Wax-like role of "the Ruin's Hand of Harmony", as TenSoon described as being how Harmony viewed him in Shadows of Self? Or that Marsh was in cahoots with Kelsier (and apparently still is at least in sympathy with) in doing some kind of work that Harmony disagreed with, but felt compelled to allow? In any case, based on their past mortal friendship, I would like to think that at Harmony at least has eased Marsh's constant pain from the hemalurgic spikes. Not sure what that would entail, but c'mon, he's a DOUBLE GOD, hemalurgy is "his power" how, as would be "preserving" him from the pain of it, right?
  13. Yeah, and constant pain from the spikes, as he described at the end of book 1 after Vin offed TLR But it does seem like Marsh has not only kept his spikes, he's replaced the one he was missing when Sazed Ascended (the one missing eye spike that Vin pulled out that he was still missing when he killed Elend), and he may even have acquired a spike or two he didn't have before (presumably by harvesting them from dead Inquisitors, as ghost-Kelsier had noted to Spook that they had a "little pile of Inquisitor spikes and nothing to do with them").
  14. Yeah I had been assuming it was Honor until I wrote that post, then I suddenly realized that "the Parent" could mean either non-Odium Shard on Roshar. Hmm.
  15. His being able to renew spheres with Stormlight wasn't a one-off thing he was able to do at Thaylen Fields; afterwards, he also "overcharged" Kaladin for his flight first to Kharbranth, then to where Skar and Drehy had hidden out with little Gavinor. When the Stormfather commented that no previous Bondsmiths he'd bonded with had been able to do this, Dalinar noted that he was something new: "Honor's remnants, your soul, my will." Odium counts him as having Ascended, and he had formed Honor's Perpendicularity. (And presumably does do every time he renews spheres or overcharges a Radiant with Stormlight, if on a lower scale.) So is he "Honor Enough" now to count as The Parent who locked the Oathgates from the Cognitive side? Or was The Parent in question another Shard (Cultivation)?