HonorIsDead

Oh, ok thanks

Has anyone figured out who the man in blue and the lady in the crystal dress at the front of the book are? I figured it would be clear by the end, as with Honor and Cultivation who I recognized immediately, but I still have no clue. Anyone have any ideas? Did I miss something?

@Darkness wrath and cruelty aren't really the same thing, they're similar, but I wouldn't say they are so similar they would necessarily be the same shard @Spoolofwhool If the shard were manipulative and subtle he probably wouldn't have been high on Odium's list as he's not actually powerful, or he could be manipulated to think that leaving cruelty was for the best

First, I want to preface that this theory is not really based off facts. I was reading a post about Threnody and the "evil" when I came across I guy who said that he thought that the "evil" wasn't anything to do with Odium. He stated that he thought it was something more then a shard. This was a post from 2015 so they probably didn't know about the shard splintered in the Threnodite system. This however got me thinking, why do we assume Odium is the worst shard in the cosmere? Could there not be something more? If you think about Odium the emotion (hatred) it is incredibly powerful, but power isn't everything, subtlety and manipulation could be a far more powerful combination. Might there be a shard in the Cosmere that may not only be more powerful than Odium, but also wiser? I looked up a list of traits, and there was one that could be worse than Odium if it were to become its own shard: Evil. There are various words that could describe this attribute: evil, wicked, cruel. This shard would be more dangerous to the cosmere than Odium because Odium is often not well thought out, it exist with blurred vision and little fact, always pointing out what it wants to see in the world. On the other hand Cruelty is not hindered by the same tunnel vision, it is often very keen and logical, making precise and well thought out decisions, manipulating people and lacking compassion. Could this not be a shard? and would it not be worse than Odium. It could be behind the scenes at all times, pushing here and pulling there, getting Odium to do its work at the moment, but still being the puppet master. Thinking about it, it does seem reasonable that Odium wouldn't be the most harmful shard, the plot needs to twist a little and a more destructive force that has been waiting in the shadows would make sense. What do you guys think? Might Cruelty be another more harmful shard? If humans developed a cruel side, so must have Adonalsium, and Cruelty isn't really the same as hatred

that's my problem, my dad loves reading, but he reads non-stop and almost never rereads a book unless its about finance, that's why I want to do some shardic backstory and worldhopper info for him so that maybe he can catch stuff the first time around as well as order the books to get the most out of them, things I missed (I read WoR before Warbreaker and so didn't get that big cross over at the end the first time through), though thanks for the help, i'll consider using it if for some reason I notice something in oversleep's won't work @Oversleep thanks, I think i'll use your order, I read a bit more of the link but I think yours will probably pick up on the most. thanks

@Pagerunner thanks for all the suggestions, as I said it was a quick little intro and the fact that I wrote it just before bed might not have helped. I am grateful for the help and will take your suggestions into consideration if I decide to do a revised copy, many of your suggestions were ideas I also had, I was just planning on putting them in follow up texts if I got around to it (worldhoppers, different realms) as for the assumptions I added I am thoroughly abashed, though I feel most of them are not of huge importance, some of them ,I realise now, could lead to confusion in the future when new books with new information are released. thanks for the help, and i'll see about writing a better version also, side note, what order would you guys suggest a newcomer read the books in to get as much off the cross referencing as possible? thanks

Quick preface, I wrote this quickly one night as a way of introducing my dad to the cosmere, a way of explaining what to look for while reading with out giving any real spoilers. It pretty much sums up what happened to create all the shards we see running around the cosmere. let me know what you guys think, and if you have suggestions be sure to let me know. Its in spoilers because of length. Please let me know any suggestions you guys have.

At the moment i have just finished my second reread of WoK and one line started me thinking, i do not have the exact quote but it is a quote by dalinar in the first chapter after interlude two. To paraphrase it says that if there were a war between alethkar and vedenar, it would be so big and destructive, it would probably out shine the higherachy war where the ardentia tried to take control. To me this seems like overshadowing as it would cause lots of drama, and would serve odium. I have to go so i cant add more, but what do you guys think

ok then, @Nashan'Elin ignore my post

first of all, just to preface, I have never been in a relationship so maybe you shouldn't listen to what I say next, but based on what you said, it sounds like he may still like you too my reasoning: you said he has been asking about, trying to figure out if you like him, that's not really the actions of someone who doesn't like you back. Most of the time I've found that if someone doesn't like you back, but thinks you like them they will avoid talking about crushes with you and will never guess allowed that you like them in case you confirm it and they are stuck knowing it. the fact that he was actively seeking to know if you like him implies to me that he likes you, but is worried you don't like him back, so he mentioned having liked you (in the past) to see how you would react to him having a crush on you, but not going to far by saying that he does like you incase that scared you off. so my take on the situation is that you guys both like each other, you are just both worried to admit it, though probably for different reasons then again, as I stated, I have little first hand experience with dating, and i'm a hopeless romantic, so maybe i'm not the best interpreter I wish you the best of luck and hope you can figure it out good luck

that would make sense, as they would probably have inherited some of the intent of the original shards, that would work for both seons, who are devoted to their masters, and it would match what I have heard of skaze, as they could be splinters of dominion, influencing the the fordjel (however you spell it) to take of the world and dominate everyone, though I don't know a whole lot about skaze, so that could be wrong

you see him in TFE when kel goes to see an scar informant named Hoid (the name "wit" goes by) to make sure that nobody suspects that house renoux is a fake near chapter 16 also, i'm not sure how far you are in HoA so i'll put this in a spoiler, its not a huge spoiler, but still there may also be another time in the first era, but I don't know of one

WARNING: MINOR THE HOPE OF ELANTRIS SPOILERS I do not believe this to be true , as in The Hope of Elantris IMO this implies heavily that the Seons are a result of something the Elantrians do/did and that it can be replicated in the modern time, not just the once. While ashe seems uncertain he does mention in the past nearly every Elantrian had a seon, and given that the # of elantrians would have been increasing all the time, the only way for a constant supply of seons would be to be creating them some how, either as a by product or on purpose.

@asterion137 I don't think so, his brain doesn't seem to need to be intact/working in order to heal himself as shown by his fight with steelheart at the end of the first book when he crushes his skull in. If his brain doesn't need to be working, then his head doesn't need to be attached to heal. There are probably other examples of this though I haven't read the books since calamity. Also, prof would probably have a body fitting force field up 24/7 in a fight with other epics, kinda like the reckoners coats. finally I think he could still manage one in time to block whatever TLR pushed (Unless possibly if it was duralumin boosted) as he has blocked bullets and other things that move at incredible speeds before.

i don't know about that, he tried to avoid killing dalinar, he wasn't on the original hit list and he still didn't want to after, but he found it necessary in the end I suppose however you are correct, they are against each other even with the same goal, I suppose I was basing what I said too much upon "the enemy of my enemy is my friend"

I highly doubt that, there sprens despise each other so I doubt they could get serious, but that's just what I fancy, they are after all, opposite orders, though I suppose it might lead somewhere and then kal would realise she's been lying to him its a good theory, but I don't think adolin will do it, on the back of the WoK i'm pretty sure the description is something like: the radiants have returned, one will save them and one will destroy them, that makes it sound as though one of the radiants will be the champion for both sides, though my first guess would have been eshoni, who is after all being pretty much fully controlled by the everstorm/odium at this point as for the contract, I don't know what to say, it would work almost perfectly as you say so I can't really argue against it

yes, he does, but he's not an epic, hes something more along the lines of either a god or an angle nah, its pure insanity, he thinks he was sent by god to cleanse the earth inorder to do something like this he would need about a week to absorb sunlight, and even then I don't think it would "melt" prof fast enough, as profs power is a bit like that of Deadpool's or wolverine's, where they could heal back so long as there is one cell remaining. True but he could still send an energy blast at him and destroy any external metals sure hes got a lot of stamina but he doesn't have epic proportions of stamina (pun intended, i'm sorry) where as epics seem to become more and more powerful as they use their power, TLR's power would slowly decrease as the other epics became stronger and more determine, his only hope would be to win the fight quickly at the beginning, though with atium he could probably predict obliterations teleport and kill him, and he probably wouldn't fear steelheart and would win that to, I doubt he could beat prof Also, what are the circumstances of this fight? are these like gladiator fights for entertainment and they are stuck in the ring else they lose and their master will have them executed, or are they just fighting (its funny to think that even after all the hate towards people who say 'is steelheart cosmere' this would still be a possible fight since cosmere is steelheart as there are infinite other realities that megan sees and she could probably arrange this by pulling people from different ones including the cosmere)

IIRC he isn't really against the radiants, they just happen to be undermining what he's trying to do, he heard the death rattles, figured out something terrible was going to happen and decided to unite the people of roshar, just in a very different way than dalinar, its a bit like how both Dalinar and sadeus want to protect Elokhar, they just have different opinions on how they should do this, leading to their disputes I believe that hes seeing the future like preservation could, he uses his intelligence to see all the possibilities, then picks the one with the future that he likes best and follows up that by reasoning more and figuring out how to manipulate everybody/everything perfectly to create the version of the future he wants, hes not so much seeing the future as making educated guess' about it and shaping it through his actions that said, that's just my theory, we can't really know since IIRC the power came from the nightwatcher

Welcome to the shard have an upvote and enjoy being able to add your random theories to the forum now, hope to see you putting out interesting theories soon

also, most of the problems TLR fixed were ones he created, the mists were snapping people so he moved the planet which caused most of the problems seen in TFE, the ashmounts were to stop some of the extra heat, the people were physically changed to live with ash, the plants were changed to live with out light and so on, quite a few of the problems he solved were just quick fixes to the mistakes he made while trying to fix things. Though he did prepare for a post death apocalypse which was definitely one of the best things he did for his people and a very smart move. I agree he was probably one of the smartest, if not the smartest non shard holder on scadrial at the time, however saze is probably smarter, what with everything he knows from his coperminds and the fact that he (I assume) can kind of see the future like Leras could, though you can't really compare them since a) harmony can't do all the much incase he pushes the balance between ruin and harmony too much and ends up splitting, like Adonalsium, and b ) saze is a few shard holder, not to mention he's holding 2 shards, not just one, where as TLR was only a sliver and that was only the power of one shard

now, follow up question, what do you THINK (keyword think) happens when you burn Lerasium and duralumin? this would probably be a waste, because you'd already need to be a mistborn, or a duralumin misting to begin with. I would assume probably nothing, or that it might give you something like ferauchemy as well

very well, I had a reply but i'll move this back to the topic I feel that shallan isn't really going to do all that much in the library, sure she'll start looking, but things are too hectic for her, she has to deal with the GBs, be one of the only KR around at HQ when the everstorm fully hits the world, she needs to stay in relation with Adolin and practice entering shadesmar, there's just too much for her to do, I think she'll only have a brief time in the library, either near the end to find the answer to some great problem, or in the beginning before she gets distracted, I think BS will save the real investigation for Jasnah or at least for a later book, maybe book four, it seems too early for them to learn any REALLY valuable information

Do we have a quote that says hes a KR or was that just an assumption I made? cause I thought that was the reason idk, we have no idea what trillium does, or he might have used a type of medallion type thing like the spear head, only more advanced, he is from Yolen after all

she did to begin with, but at the end of WoR it just seemed like a really unnecessary risk to take even jasnah offered a better one after 2 seconds of knowing the issue, she could have asked for help, simple as that yah, they are, but I find myself cringing the whole time, knowing that she is 100% gonna mess up at some point and lose the trust of both the KR and the GBs, its to easy to make a mistake in the scenario she put herself in. yah, they are a cute couple, and I don't think there will be an Adolin, Kaladin, Shallan love triangle, it could NEVER work, their KR orders have never gotten along for a reason, which should be evident in their drastically different personalities I agree, the information in the library (or libraries) will be important and probably very interesting, but I think it should and will be Jasnah or Renarin who does the discovery there, as she is the real scholar and well, I don't really know what Renarin is but I know there are books involved the secrets of the cosmere seems like a bit of a stretch, but the secrets of their world, the Highstorm, the shattering of the plains, possibly even the reason why odium chose to come after honor and cultivation, might be avalible P.S. Sorry if I sound argumentative, I just wanted to state my opinion and play devils advocate, which are both important while theorising

WARNING WoR spoiler To each his own, I just can't stand when she makes decisions like joining the Ghostbloods or stealing jasnas thingy ma bob (sorry i'm in a rush and don't know the name) when there are clearly far better solutions and I agree her scene in the chasm was amazing