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Everything posted by Jofwu

  1. For Illumination, good point. My gut feeling is that you're taking "various waveforms" far too literally there. But if you can produce sound, then I suppose you could produce waves in water. I'm not sure how powerful those could be... That'd take an awful lot of energy compared to anything we've seen. I think you're taking the Ars Arcanum descriptions a bit too far. We don't have much evidence for what those actually mean. But perhaps.
  2. Well, Illumination can create anything. I guess, based on what Shallan did at the end of OB, maybe you can give your illusory waves some kind of substance. But I wouldn't consider that any interaction with actual water. Transportation = Elsecalling, which so far as we know is just the ability to enter Shadesmar from wherever. (and maybe teleportation?) Nothing about adding motion to physical things.
  3. Mastery over water? I'm really curious what this is referring to. Stormlight isn't Avatar: The Last Airbender. It's not like there's a Surge giving "mastery" over each element/essence. I expect many Surges can interact with water, just as much as they do with any other substance... It's possible Adhesion works with water. Khriss thinks it's related to "atmospheric pressure", and it's only a small jump from there to manipulation of pressure in fluids in general. (so... when are we going to get a Windrunner to dive into Aimia's underwater caves?) Don't see any reason why Gravitation can't be applied to water, though I can't imagine what the use would be. Division superheats water to steam? Abrasion makes it a better lubricant? Obviously it can be Soulcasted. And we don't know much about Cohesion and Tension, but why not? So it's probably just Progression, Illumination, and Transportation which are irrelevant when it comes to water.
  4. I want Maya to be revived (mostly at least), and would be disappointed if she isn't. I don't feel as strongly about Adolin. I was hesitant for this at the end of Words of Radiance, but I think I'd be okay with it now. Something I've noticed is that lots of main characters are VERY non-traditional Radiants. We've got a lot of oddballs in the mix. Lots of stuff that hasn't been seen before... First is Renarin, bonded to a spren corrupted by Sja-Anat. (maybe it's happened before, but at the very least it isn't normal) We've got Lift with a bizarre condition allowing her to get Investiture from food instead of Stormlight. We've got Dalinar who somehow managed this whole "Unity" thing, which Stormfather has never seen. We've got a few Heralds who seem like they'll be Radiants. Seems like at least one other major oddity that I'm forgetting. This Desolation is weird. So that said, what I'd like to see most of all is something weird between Maya and Adolin. They've certainly begun that way, considering a deadeye has never been revived. (so far as we know at least) Like maybe Maya is mostly revived by has some really unique quirks and/or limitations. Maybe Adolin only gets one Surge. Maybe he gets no Surges but he can hold Stormlight. You know what I mean. Just some kind of weird, broken state that's never been seen before. I will say that I think it would just be weird to have Maya bond with anyone besides Adolin. Narratively, that just feels awkward. I think we place way too much emphasis on the importance of someone "fitting in" to a given Order. There's no rule saying spren can only bond with someone who doesn't "fit" their order. They might face disapproval from other spren. The human might have a more difficult time advancing through the Ideals. There's certainly obstacles in this. But Maya can bond Moash if she feels so inclined. Even if she can be revived without needing a bond (which Adolin is the only one in a position to provide), I just can't see her latching on to anyone else. Particularly just because Adolin isn't some picture-perfect Edgedancer.
  5. Wow, so I guess they killed slatrification. That surprises me. We never see it happen in the first two volumes, but I skimmed over the first one with this in mind and I'm having a hard time seeing how it won't be a clunky change. There are a couple of scenes that will come across really strange in this case. For example, the sandling at the end of the Mastrell's Path. Kenton assumes it is meant to test slatrification ability, and many people have obviously passed the test before him without the skills he used instead. So... how did all the others do it?
  6. Last night I reread the scene where Taravangian speaks with Odium... So basically they are looking at the Diagram as it originally appeared, written all over the original room it was created in. Odium then overlays his vast knowledge on top of it. And we see that in one corner it's all gone black, presumably because of Renarin. I thought it was interesting that Taravangian mentions that this black section begins "behind where the bed had stood". So I flipped open to the Diagram epigraphs in WoR and found two that seem to be in that same area of the room, near the bed. I think it's interesting that both of these are directly related to Taravangian's plans to become king of the world. They are also, so far as we know, the biggest failing of the Diagram so far. Their interpretations and predictions concerning Dalinar (and the politics for Taravangian to take over) have been repeatedly wrong. Is it just a coincidence that these pieces of the Diagram are written near the bed, which is where Renarin's impact on Odium's foresight is rooted? A bit of a tangent here, but... Why is the blackness rooted in Renarin? We can speculate all over, but the obvious (general) answer is that it's related to the corruption of Glys. That's the most unique thing about him. And the most tangible thing we know of that's a result of this is his ability to see the future. I think Renarin's ability to see the future is causing him to have an atium-like affect on the grand scale of events on Roshar. When somebody uses atium, they can see the future of the world around them. It's different for Renarin of course... He clearly sees a bit further ahead than one does with normal atium usage. And his sight is centered around key moments rather than a simple foresight into how the objects/people around him move. But it's effectively the same thing. When TWO people burn atium, they see a (seemingly) infinite number of possibilities sprouting from the other person. This is because you're getting a positive feedback loop that makes each person's actions nearly impossible to predict. So I think this is what's happening with Renarin's blackness on "Odium's Diagram". Renarin's just one guy of course. Compared to Odium's future sight, he presents a relatively small margin of error. But it's enough to have an impact in one corner. Imagine you're a general burning atium while watching a battle unfold, as one of the soldiers on the battlefield also burns atium. That person's actions would be a mess that makes no sense of course, but he doesn't influence the ENTIRE battlefield. You can see most of it clearly. Just not that corner over there. All of that to say... Odium seems to have augmented Taravangian's Diagram in this scene, and it's very curious to me that the blackness of Renarin is in the same corner as these snippets relating to Taravangian's plans concerning Dalinar and the coalition. Snippets which have repeatedly proven hard to work with, at best. Theory: Renarin Kholin's ability to see the future has caused events concerning Dalinar and the coalition to diverge from what Taravangian originally predicted.
  7. Maybe? Renarin's futuresight is weird... It seems highly likely that is voidbinding, or at least related to voidbinding. We don't really have any evidence that "voidfabrials" are a thing? My suspicion is that it's possible... Devices for most magic in the cosmere seems possible. But I'm betting a fabrial to see the future is going to be very difficult to make and very expensive to use? I guess it depends on how "powerful" the fabrial is. To connect things to Mistborn... Looking far into the future, through more complex events, (like we see with Renarin in WoR I think) is probably not cheap or easy in my opinion.
  8. @hoiditthroughthegrapevine I think it's pretty cool. One thing that I realize now I probably wasn't very clear on, and this is a lot of assumption on my part... In the scene at the end of Oathbringer where Odium pulls Taravangian into the virtual Diagram room. We see the Diagram as it was written, then the room drops away, and then we see what Odium sees... My interpretation is that Odium is just extrapolating further. I don't think we're dealing with two separate views of the future. I think they match up, and the Diagram is just very limited compared to what Odium sees. It's like the Diagram is a single sentence written out. Then Odium comes along with a transparent page of golden text and overlays it on that single sentence. They match up perfectly, with Odium's version just revealing more/further. And when I say perfectly I mean almost perfectly. There's this one portion in the middle of the sentence that repeatedly seems wrong in some way, frustrating the people interpreting it. On Odium's overlay, that portion is just a jumble of words overlayed on one another to the point that it's illegible. I think that the reason the Diagram seems wrong is because it is. It predicted one branch which was once very likely, but now there are several possibilities propagating from Renarin (Odium's blindness). And in this particular case, the Diagram guessed the wrong one. Brandon basically confirmed Renarin's interference with Odium. So my theory is basically that if the Diagram is a work predicting the future then Renarin should be affecting it in basically the same way. The difference is that the Diagram is a static creation while Odium is seeing all of the possibilities as they currently exist. (If Odium looked into the future before Renarin bonded Glys, he probably would have seen with clarity what the Diagram predicted.) THAT SAID... I imagine Cultivation is much better at seeing the future than Odium. I figure it's possible that she has an easier time seeing all of the branches created by Renarin. So it's possible that the Diagram isn't wrong because of Renarin, but because Cultivation is manipulating people (maybe even Odium) by presenting a future that she knew would be wrong. Does that make sense? I'm personally skeptical that the Diagram is... coming from Cultivation to this degree. I think it can still be a tool of hers for the purpose of manipulation without needing to take things this far. But who knows... Sorry, I'm rambling. Personally, I think he'd still be greyed out because he's already had some influence that has stirred things up. BUT I DO think that this greyness would fade in time with Renarin dead, as his influences work themselves out and move from there. With Renarin alive, it will continue to grow, I think. Very hard to guess how long Sja-Anat has been leaning that way. Definitely a major question mark. I don't imagine she went to Cultivation. I think she's been more slow, and subtle, and careful. Afraid to move in the open, which I imagine would be required to visit Cultivation. I do expect that Glys was a weapon she planned for this purpose. A way to help out the other side. I don't know that she saw exactly what would happen with Glys... But I think she saw some of it. Less "here, this will cause X, Y, Z to happen and help you guys out" and more "here's a powerful tool, it will probably help"? Talk of Unmade reminds me... I can't remember if it comes up in this topic or not. In the Diagram epigraphs in Words of Radiance, there are three references from the "Book of the 2nd Desk Drawer." Two of them are explicitly about the Unmade, and I think they're suggestive about the relationship between Unmade and future sight. They are described as "a deviation". They have "relevance to precognition". The third epigraph is the traitor one: "One of them is most certainly a traitor to the others." The Diagram predicted Sja-Anat's treachery. So that's a clue perhaps to when that happened? Then again, maybe too ambiguous to be helpful there. Regardless, I think this soft connection between the Unmade and how they might influence the future is interesting, especially given the sequence of events that begin with Sja-Anat creating Glys...
  9. My point is that the Diagram was written before Renarin became what he is. Prior to Glys, Jasnah never would have had any reason to kill him in the first place. That said, I'm not entirely sure it holds up to close scrutiny. It's certainly possible that the Diagram says something that's hard to reconcile with my theory, but I'm not aware of any such thing. Do you know what the Diagram predicts/says about Renarin? Particularly concerning the time after the Battle of Thaylen Field? Nothing comes to mind and the Coppermind page doesn't mention him. I don't mean to say that he's JUST a smokescreen for Dalinar. That's sort of what he is at the moment, as he's just coming into his powers. Definitely don't mean to say that's all he is or all he will be. I think that black infinity that Odium sees is going to grow much larger in the coming books, and play into Renarin's very important 2nd arc role.
  10. I hadn't seen this theory before. That's an awesome idea! It makes me wonder if the day of the Diagram's creation was just "the beginning" or if something drastic happened that day which required Taravangian to make a massive change of course. And if the latter... what happened that day?! I won't dig into it in detail here as the theory isn't entirely relevant to this topic. (And it is of course just a theory.) My short response is that I don't see why this is any reason to doubt the theory. I'm not saying Renarin is pulling the future in a different way than was predicted. I'm saying there are events around him which were once 99.9% likely to happen a certain way, and now he's unknowingly shifting those odds. (by having the powers he does and being the person he is) I think it's pretty clear that he's the reason Odium is having a hard time predicting events surrounding Dalinar, and I think it's no coincidence that the Diagram is having a difficult time there as well.
  11. Definitely a capital U. The text reads: But capitalization can be used to emphasize many things beyond "this is a Shard," obviously. I think it's pretty obvious Dalinar didn't pick up a full Shard. When those on Scadrial did this, they lost their bodies and their minds were greatly expanded. They didn't become omniscient, but they became aware of many, many things. Dalinar didn't experience anything like that. I like the idea that @Xavier Iriarte mentions, where Dalinar has summoned some "portion" of Honor which could cumulatively be described as something like a sense of unity. But we could also be reading into it a bit too much. It could just be Dalinar's way of describing his perceived role as a uniter.
  12. See I think we've just been mislead by poor accounts of meeting with the Nightwatcher. I think these are well within what Nightwatcher is capable of doing, and would be a little disappointed if Nightwatcher is nothing more than a trickster who gets called to heel when Cultivation wants to do something actually cool. The only examples we have (if I'm not mistaken) come from the Baxil interlude and are completely word of mouth. That isn't to say Nightwatchers work is never silly. I'd just be disappointed if it's just a genie with a weird sense of humor. Yes, but the only reason it worked out this way for him was because she specifically removed a bunch of his memories. Lift seems to have a very clear memory of her visit, and I don't see any reason why Taravangian wouldn't. None of them mention anything weird about their encounters. They went, they asked for a thing, they got a boon and a curse. Lift's is a little vague in this respect, but I'd chalk that up to the fact that (1) it's meant to be more complex than a young girl can make sense of and (2) the explanation for why she got what she did is going to be a bit of a twist in a later book. As for the WoB, Brandon has never been intentionally misleading with Dalinar as far as I can see. When people asked about his involvement with the Nightwatcher or his boon/curse, Brandon would RAFO it or answer around it. (and say that the answer is coming in Oathbringer) In this question, the person didn't even bring up the fact that her condition is related to the Nightwatcher. Brandon is the one brought her involvement into the mix, and if it was Cultivation's tampering then he's just being misleading I think. (intentionally or otherwise) All of that together makes me skeptical that we'll get a "Surprise! It was actually Cultivation!" for ALL of these cases which are interesting. It will be overdone if it happens a second time, and just plain irritating if it happens a third.
  13. I absolutely think Taravangian (and the Diagram) may be a tool of Cultivation, but I disagree with @Calderis on the accuracy of the Diagram. I believe the WoB pasted by @hoiditthroughthegrapevine above and Taranvangian's own understanding of his encounter with the Nightwatcher suggests that it was indeed the Nightwatcher who was involved. That is, Lift definitely seems to be a product of the Nightwatcher, and I think Taravangian would be able to tell the difference between Nightwatcher and Cultivation. (Dalinar was) Not entirely sure this is relevant... But I suppose it supports the fact that the Diagram isn't some masterpiece of Cultivation. Maybe it's some measure of basic futuresight that he's been granted on occasion. Personally, I imagine it's exactly what he thinks it is--an insane level of analytical brilliance. Either way, it's prone to error. And I think Renarin is a primary source for that error, particularly where Dalinar is concerned: I think Renarin's ability to see the future is causing disturbances that the Diagram couldn't possibly predict. Taravangian certainly thinks the Diagram is a "perfect" thing, which must be followed religiously. I think he's a fool, likely being manipulated by Odium and/or Cultivation to some end. The biggest challenge to the idea that the Diagram didn't predict this outcome is the text Taravangian reads at the end: My first thought is that I'll be very surprised if he isn't being directly manipulated by Odium here. He didn't come to the meeting with this piece of the Diagram figured out, so far as I can tell. So he starts making up some reason why Odium needs him, and suddenly he finds himself in front of some bit of some text that lays out an argument to use? Odium caused these glowing words to appear in the first place, extrapolating beyond the Diagram. I think it's a complete fabrication by Odium. If not that, it's part of what Odium sees (at this point, after the failure with Dalinar) and he's letting Taravangian have a glimpse. Either way, the point is to make Taravangian think this is all his idea. It's working pretty well. There's no way in Braize Taravangian (on a stupid day, no less) had a meeting with Odium and came out with a good bargain. He's being played.
  14. Ages are correct, more or less.
  15. The spheres used for currency are "a little larger than a person’s thumbnail." The Shadesmar beads are supposed to be smaller. (" those that would hold Stormlight, but dark and small...") But apparently big enough to pick up an individual sphere comfortably. So perhaps the size of a pinky nail?
  16. Concerning the original post of the topic, I wanted to say... I think Brandon's being really optimistic here. Which makes sense... He's trying to break the news gently. It's easy to say you hope someone will be pleased and then walk away, you know? At the end of the day he's going to tell the story he wants to tell, and he's just hoping it pleases more people than it doesn't. I assume he's implying that he's not going to just drop the Shallan-Adolin relationship and let it settle. That would surely frustrate a lot of people--particularly those who aren't fond of the relationship as it is now. My hope is that he does interesting things with their relationship and that it affects their stories in meaningful ways. In that case, perhaps people who didn't like the pairing will find something to love (or at least like) over the next two books. But obviously there's no way it will please everyone. I can't speak as a Shalladin shipper, so I can't pretend to know what development would make their relationship more interesting to read from that perspective. Personally, I hope that Brandon uses them to explore marriage of a young couple (something he did with Vin/Elend, but I think he can do better). I hope they have problems to work through. More specifically, I'd like to watch them have to work through Shallan's issues together. Maybe Adolin doesn't really understand her issues to some extent. So let him learn. Maybe Adolin doesn't love her as much as he should (or vice versa). So let's see that develop. My hope is that Brandon sees room for conflict/development in their current relationship, and he takes some time to explore it.
  17. Alright, for my 1000th post on the 17th Shard... Updated version with correct Pailiah spelling! I'm too lazy/busy to figure out exactly what I did to make the multiple black versions, so I'm not toying with that. You only get two options now, sorry. Original post is updated.
  18. I made these and wanted to share. Comes in two flavors. That's all! Latest Revision: Old Revisions: 1: Original. 2: Ishar at top and divine attributes. Numbers removed, numerals moved. 3: Surge symbols, gemstones, and essences. Divine attributes moved. 4: Made from scratch for clarity and misalignment problems. Colorful order names. Minor moves and resizing. Multiple black options. 5: A few more varieties of black, just with different shades for the white text. 6: Fixed spelling of Pailiah
  19. Adolin shows his love more in his actions than his thoughts I think. He brings her food when he hears she hasn't eaten, which is pretty thoughtful. He wants to teach her how to use a Shardblade because it's something he loves and he's excited to share it. He wants her to come along with the visit to Ialai because he think she's smart and comforting to him. He defends her from Dalinar when Shallan annoys him. etc. etc. And okay... yes. All of this could be interpreted in a different direction. That's totally reasonable. This is just how I read it, and how I think Brandon intended for it to come across. If I've learned anything from getting my wife into these books, it's that (1) Brandon's [generally] not that great at writing romance and (2) my own taste for romance is unrefined. I think most of the debate over the interactions between Shallan, Adolin, and Kaladin boils down to different people seeing different things in the same text.
  20. We are clearly reading two different characters, maybe even books. First of all, I don't remember Palona reading any books, I think you are remembering that ardent in the interlude. Either way, just because one woman reads romance books it doesn't mean that all women do and maybe you should be a little more careful with that generalization on a public forum where female readers participate. On the contrary, Shallan wasn't like that, from Way of Kings: Chapter 8: I think Robardin's referring to this, from OB chapter 122: Maybe making some assumptions that she enjoys things similar to what Ellista was reading. Though I think it's a mistake to assume that either of these give us a clear picture of the entirety of "women's fiction" on Roshar. (and even more so to assume Shallan has been shaped by it) That said, I think you're understating Shallan's level of romantic interest. This quote says nothing about Shallan's personal interests--she's got bigger issues at the moment than entertainment. That doesn't mean she doesn't enjoy romance novels in her spare time, and interest in romance novels has little bearing on romantic interest in general. Like Robardin said, we only have to look at her relationship with Kabsal to see romantic interest from her in TWoK.
  21. IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE PAILIAH! Arg.... Thanks too Argent for pointing this out. Pailiah's name has been spelled wrong all this time. Fun history fact: I think we originally got her name way back when from a WoB and somehow came away with a bad spelling. (probably transcribed that way) It ended up on the wiki (and all over the place) with this incorrect spelling, and just kept getting propagated. (Exhibit A: this chart!) Peter happened across her page on Coppermind a while back (years after WoR had given us the correct spelling and nobody noticed the error) and pointed out the error. I personally went through and fixed every instance I could find on the wiki and a few other places... Unfortunately I didn't realize I had it wrong on my own darn chart! Hoping to update it this week sometime, when I get a chance to dig up the files.
  22. We definitely encourage anyone to edit @Dizzy. Thanks for making an account and <considering> making the change yourself! The Skybreaker's 4th Ideal is strange. Whether Szeth's statement in OB can be taken as the actual oath or not, I think the general consensus is that it isn't "fulfilled" in the way normal Ideals are by speaking it. That is to say, it seems like a 3rd Ideal Skybreaker has to actually do what they swear they will do before they are "of the 4th Ideal." When the Ideals are explained, Szeth is told that he must "undertake a personal quest and complete it." That completion seems to be a necessary component before Szeth advances.
  23. Amusing fiction about the script being approved followed by a few press release snippets: From Variety:
  24. I believe I made sure my audio had everything when it was being snipped. It looks like @Personification made this entry yesterday? I approved it and attached the snippet.
  25. Please post any Oathbringer typos you come across in this thread. Give a clear explanation of what the typo is along with a reference of where it can be found. This thread will be unlocked on November 14, 2017. NOTE: Oathbringer Preview chapters posted by Tor contain typos that are NOT in the final version of the book. Do not post typos which you have found anywhere prior to the full release of the book.