nervousnerd

It gets complicated, I guess. They are probably all Listeners as mentioned above but at the moment that name is most associated with Eshonai and her group. Not much of that group will have survived the Battle of Narak though. I suppose we could call the Listeners from the Shattered Plains "The Last Legion" since they are decendants of seemingly the only group to escape from their gods and being enslaved. I think once we know what is going on after the Everstorm we will understand more about Listeners as a race and the different groups within that race.

I think that Taravangian's plan is getting so many people killed unnecessarily. If he can keep following the Diagram to completion, it seems like it is the easiest (not easy but easiest) way to bring the world together but he doesn't care about how many people survive just that there is a seed left to regrow humanity. It also doesn't seem like his plan involves actually fighting back yet. I think Dalinar would be better at leading the actual war and not the bringing people together before it. He does seem like he needs someone else to bring everyone else together but I'm not sure that Taravangian would be the one to do that. If he even wanted to work together, I am not sure that he could follow the Diagram still and I don't think he would have the same ability to get people to follow him without it.

It depends on how broken a Radiant has to be. I don't think it is in him to really be broken very much. Maybe him being devastated by the apparent loss of his sons would be enough but not much seems to hold him down.

Well, it is probably going to be one of the last holdouts of humanity if things start going poorly. Wouldn't really be that great if the Radiants spent most of their time living in a giant, safe tower while the people they are supposed to save are down in the danger.

Yeah. Plus we haven't actually seen any visions where Dalinar can really tell what the Radiants are doing or where he is knowledgeable enough about their powers to look for it.

I think Sel is scewed up because of the mixing of shards. It may be that since Honor alone was splintered, it isn't as bad. I think some of the investiture also went towards increasing the number of spren but I'm not sure where I read that.

Yeah. The Stormfather definitely existed. Syl says he is broken now (I think she believes it is because he survived being bonded during the Recreance) but merging with the cognitive shadow could have been a factor as well. We still really don't know how he changed.

It is certainly possible; it would cause no end of problems and panic for people to lose the slaves that have been integrated so deeply into the economy and home life of many. The only problem is that I think the disappearance of parshmen would be enough of a problem that people would begin to believe Dalinar. The places that sent then out before the storm might be angry and think that the threat wasn't real but otherwise there will be some evidence that the parshmen purposefully escaped and disappeared. And why would that happen if Dalinar was wrong? If nothing amounted of their disappearance for a long time then that plan might work but I'm not sure I see Odium as someone who waits patiently (I'm not sure the wait until this current desolation was his plan) and giving too much time will help people recover from the changes it causes and allow them to prepare for an attack.

I doubt that Kaladin is so petty that he would be sad that he has a sister who can do what he did not. I think Lurin just took a new apprentice after Kaladin left. Obviously there is some secret that Hessina almost said ("And there’s something else you need to know about.") but I don't think it is that.

Yeah. There were a lot of quotes about it being an old design that kind of make me think of Elantris.

I thiink he obviously is but I have to guess that some are still around causing destruction. It would be a huge missed opportunity for the sneak attack of the everstorm to go unused. Perhaps in areas that were prepared, the voidbringers were sent to regroup. It kind of seems like Hearthstone didn't even see them and to me that could mean they are still a threat.

Hmm. So I wonder if there was a split with the Sons of Honor. Gavilar's behavior during this chapter certainly seems in line with Amaram but I can't see Taravangian holding those beliefs. Perhaps the reveal of the visions changed his mind.

The Listeners fit much more readily into the natural ecosystem of Roshar and I think we can assume that Aimians are similar Their whole betrayal by the spren also seems to hint that humans came later. It is possible that they were altered by the appearance of Shards but I do think they were created by Adonalsium. Vibrant is interesting because it can also mean vibrating and there is sort of a connection to rhythm there. The problem is that while Gavilar knows more than us, he does not seem to know everything about the Listeners (such as them rebelling against their gods). I'm not sure how much he respects them because if his plan works then he wants to kill them all.

Yeah. I assumed that Taravangian was there in secret and not necessarily to attend the event. I'm still not sure if he was one of the Sons of Honor or if there was something else going on. Do we know if him going to the Nightwatcher was after the assasination? Otherwise, I cannot really wrap my head around the different ideologies of the Sons and the Diagram; one way millions of people will die for no reason but power and the other is apparently to ensure that people survive. He could have been using the Sons but he seems proud that he is doing what he believes Gavilar wanted. Meanwhile Gavilar seems more focused on returning the Radiants than he is about survival.

Yeah. I still haven't done a reread since that was first mentioned.

I think it is generally easier to identify that someone is a worldhopper first before identifying who they are. It still isn't easy because there are so few but they always stand out in some minor way.

I believe that it was mentioned that he survived being bonded during the Recreance as well so he could have lost some of himself there as well.

We probably don't really know now. It will be completely different after the Everstorm most likely (on Roshar as a whole but also after the battle of Narak). Jah Kaved was also laid to waste in the succession war. Shinovar has soldiers but they are just considered to be the lowest class. We learn this from Rysn's first interlude. They may not have a national army like some other places. There is also a martial art that Szeth knows so Shinovar is complicated.

I am sure we will find out a lot but it is going to be like Mistborn where there is still so much more to learn. We mostly only learn as the characters learn and it will take some time to introduce members of each order.

Well, I get what you are saying but if if you have a bunch of ageless people then you can have a community; it is just that since they are not immortal, you will still have a small decrease in population over time due to accidental deaths, etc. That may be slowed further by more people joining the community as they become more cosmere aware but it is still there. I am not saying that is the case but it is one example of how I would see agelessness allowing a community to exist without new births.

We also don't know what dangerous means. Does that mean it could kill you? Hoid says that he doesn't think a shardblade could kill him so perhaps the cognitive realm on Sel could not either.

Do you age when you take your physical body to the cognitive realm? We know you can be hurt there so I assume so, but I have just never thought of it before.

Yeah, well the unclaimed hills is a rather large area. We don't know how Hoid can travel I suppose but Jasnah seems to have to walk at the moment. I assumed that they were going to the closest area so that they could then go home.

It may not be as useful as you think anyway because it could also be a disparaging term for the spren who actually call themselves something else (ex liespren becoming Cryptic).

I feel like opening the other oathgates should be a focus now that Urithiru has been found. I mean making the world that much smaller will help to bring it together; I'm not sure if Shallan or Dalinar would focus on that though. Shallan probably has to figure out what to expect from a desolation (at least until Jasnah joins the group). Dalinar vs Taravangian is something that could come up but it may be too early; those two are working against each other too much for them a avoid each other for long though. Szeth will also have to face Taravangian eventually but I think that will happen after Szeth heads home. I wonder how close Moash will get to Taravangian. It would be interesting to get his views as an outsider of the Diagram. I'm not sure they should trust him with how easily he betrayed Kaladin though. Kaladin is just hard because the majority of his plotlines have been completed so we have no idea where he will be headed. He will most likely have to protect Roshone from something but I can't see him going back on that ideal even for Roshone. Do we know where Jasnah and Hoid were headed after WoR?