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I haven’t made any memes in a while, time to rectify that I feel bad posting so many alignment charts but I like making them and I keep finding more

Bruh. Elend is the OG

Just a reminder that I love all of you guys! Stop banging your head into the wall and continue your great life because it will get better, I (almost) promise! That was mainly to Vapor, but I thought that everyone can take advantage.

Bruh. Elend is the OG (For those of you who didn't see this in my status update. It was suggested I post it here as well. )

AAAAAAAH! BEST CHRISTMAS EVER!

Hello! Sorry for the inconvenience. This game is starting over due to a mistake I made in the PM distribution. I accidentally gave a villager access to the elim doc, and decided a reset this early would be preferable to making someone leave the game for my own mistake. Thank you for your patience. You may begin deposing people once again. Please do not discuss your original roles/alignments until the end of the game. I will be sharing that along with the final write-up, but I would like to avoid any possible assumptions connected with the prior distribution. (Because I'm too lazy to try to come up with a new beginning, here it is again) The sharp crack of metal striking metal cut through the din of conversation in the assembly room. Once enough people ceased speaking, the High Minister’s assistant cleared their throat and spoke. “Welcome to this emergency session of the Superiority Council of Ministers. It has been called by the Department of Species Integration to discuss what they deem as disturbing and aggressive proposals from the Department of Protective Services.” Kaviq saw shuffling and gesturing as the gathered crowd showed their support or displeasure. Kaviq only barely suppressed their own gesture of annoyance, especially at seeing how many seemed to be in support of the baseless claim. The High Minister’s assistant continued in their flat tone. “Keras of the DSI, you are the one who pushed for this meeting. It is your chance to lay out your concerns.” A tall, red Dione adorned with antique steam-powered paraphernalia stood and pressed its lips together as it looked around at the gathered ministers. “We have done as the Department of Protective Services has asked and brought in lesser species to train. The tactics deployed by the DPS have been beyond aggressive.” It looked to Kaviq’s boss, Winzik and twitched its fingers. “They trusted us to protect them, help them into citizenship of the Superiority. Instead, dozens are dead. I move that the DPS no longer be in charge of the training program, and that the DSI take over the training of lesser species against the delvers.” Its declaration caused an explosion of muttering among the members, and several annoyed gestures from members of the DPS. Kaviq would almost call them angry, but they were above such base emotions. Who did it think it was, suggesting such a preposterous idea? Kaviq almost started to speak, but the metal gavel cracked again to quiet the room. “Keras has placed forward a motion,” said the assistant. “Does anyone second it?” A heklo from a different department gestured to get the attention of the assistant before speaking. “I second the motion placed forward by Keras and the DSI.” Kaviq clicked in annoyance. They were pretty sure they recognized the heklo as one who’d worked on projects with the DPS before. Layala? Was that their name? Either way, Kaviq dismissed them as an ambitious being who seemed to be trying to play both sides. It would be their end. “It has been officially noted on the records of this emergency council. As per our bylaws, both sides will have an opportunity to present their points. You have two hours to choose a representative and prepare your opening statements.” **** Layala took a deep breath as they stepped out into the open air of Starsight. Being cooped up in the assembly room surrounded by so many beings was overwhelming, but necessary. She was there to make a difference. And maybe mark out a little piece of history as her own. All sorts of beings flowed around her as she set off on a walk. She would not be taking part in the official discussions, and so had two hours to relax before having to listen to the debates. The aggressive move by the DSI was unnerving, but not nearly so much as what had happened to the poor recruits. Layala made an unconscious gesture, almost as if to try to ward off the heightened emotions. The lesser species who’d signed up for the defense program knew the dangers. Something grabbed her limb, startling her into silence. A large varvax, looking at her through the globe of liquid on their suit looked down at her and gestured for her to remain quiet. Layala bowed her head to show she would comply as they led her away, keeping a tight, almost painful grip on her limb. She couldn’t shout, though, couldn’t alert anyone without being aggressive. Instead, she let the varvax lead her away. To their headquarters. Through the maze of halls. To a room Layala hadn’t even known existed. There, in the middle of the room, was a black sphere floating above the ground. A nowhere portal. The varvax forced her forward. As soon as she made contact with the sphere, she felt herself stretching. Impossibly stretching towards the nowhere. To nothingness. Then there was nothing. Cycle One And so Mid-Range Game 47 begins (again)! If you have not received an updated PM but did sign up for the game, please let me or @Gears know. Basic Rules Player List This cycle ends in approximately 43.5 hours, on December 24, 2020 at 7:00 p.m. PST.

Enjoy! Note there are spoilers, so listener beware! Download links mp3: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1g7zduxqiV-CX0beQxiHKhuPMiKCP8rM2/view?usp=sharing wav: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1W84nVcSljQVcLW8tGfX0AaAkCerQIIQN/view?usp=sharing

Background: In the Cosmere it is known that everything is made of investiture, similar to how in the real world everything is made of energy. Again similar to energy, in the Cosmere, Investiture is conserved. I briefly went looking to try to find whether or not investiture is the base Cosmere unit or if energy is (as it is in the real world). I was not able to find anything specifically saying this (although admittedly I didn't search very hard), but I did find a WoB saying that you can go from matter to energy to investiture etc and transfer between the 3. What is unclear is what is the base. In the real world, energy is the base (to the best of our knowledge) In other words, matter is made of very dense energy (e = mc^2). Again, the thing I didn't specifically find was if energy is composed of investiture, or the other way around. The way Conservation of Investiture is discussed implies that energy is composed of investiture, which is kinda difficult conceptualize, as both energy and investiture are already very abstract concepts (equations would be helpful, but the previously mentioned WoB mentioned that those aren't made yet, and probably won't be for some time). Anyway, on to the actually issues I see with Conservation of Investiture. 1. Nightblood and corruption of investiture I believe it is said somewhere that Nightblood doesn't destroy investiture because the smoke he leaks is that investiture corrupted. I suppose everybody has questions about Nightblood, so I'll limit this just to the question of what the investiture density of the smoke is? I would imagine it is a lot, since Nightblood consumes a lot of investiture, and I don't particularly remember it ever being noted that he was releasing a particularly large amount of smoke. If anybody has ideas on this, let me know. 2. Atium consumption Atium is a godmetal, meaning it is composed purely of Ruin's investiture. In Mistborn: Hero of the Ages, Elend and a large group of Atium mistings consumes the gathered hoard of Atium that was being guarded by the Kandra, effectively preventing Ruin/Ati from accessing his power stored in the metal. This all makes sense, until you actually wonder what happened to the presumably massive amounts of investiture stored in that Atium. Seriously, what happened to it? The Atium is gone. Ruin didn't get the power back when it was consumed (otherwise why would he have been upset?). Does anybody know what happened to it? 3. Anti-light + light reactions When coming into contact, Anti-light and light creates an explosion. It seems that this is modeled after real-world Matter and Anti-Matter. The issue is that with Matter and Anti-Matter, when they come into contact they are reduced to what Matter/Anti-matter is composed of: Energy. Investiture and Anti-investiture also appear to be reduced to energy. This implies that investiture, like matter, is just a form of energy. This would effectively disprove conservation of investiture. So if anti-light + light reactions are not "destroying" each other, and leaving behind the base construct of energy, what are they doing? 4. Perfect Gemstones Perfect gemstones are said to hold Stormlight (and one would assume the other lights as well) indefinitely. The King's Drop is the example of this that gets the most screentime to my knowledge. My issue with this is that these gems still glow. In fact, the King's Drop is described as glowing as bright as daylight. If the gemstones aren't leaking stormlight, where is the light coming from? Light is a form of energy (and by extension, investiture), so where is that investiture coming from? Personally, to me this feels like a minor detail that was overlooked in the books, and that the issue here was overlooked while writing the book and was never caught. In other words, this feels like a mistake to me. It is also totally possible that perfect gemstones have properties that allow them to attract more investiture than just the stormlight within them. Anyway, please let me know your thoughts, ideas, or if there are any relevant WoB's that I missed on these subjects.

We should listen to Elend. The only way we can get rid of this virus is to walk into the mists! And when we all get covid, and people die, it’ll all be over and then we can live normal again. Does that make sense?

Niki walked to the nearest water garden. It wasn't far off from the assembly room, and she could be back early before the debates began. She watched the children play chasing the floating balls of water. Their joy helped center her. This was why she volunteered to join the council. The council, she thought, What should I do? My people come first... Hello! I'm super excited to be here for my first time and roleplay a bit.

Cooper burst into the room, a stack of papers piled precariously in his arms. “Oh gosh golly everyone! I’m so sorry I’m late. I got lost and walked into the wrong meeting. This building is so confusing!” The young intern began passing pages around the room. “I’m afraid I don’t know any of you very well. Perhaps-” he checked his notes “- Mr. Heklo could talk to me at some point? When you’re not busy of course. I don’t mean to be a bother, I’m just here to learn! Did everyone get their sheets of doodling paper? You could also make paper starships out of them. If you need any more, just wave me over! What are we voting for?” Hey, all! Let me know if I’m using this new voting terminology correctly. I propose removing Snipexe. Snip has been exed. Snip.exe has stopped working. Nailed it.

Given what we see of Kalak in this book, something tells me he said nothing of the sort. Amaram claimed he did what he did for the good of the army, then he claimed he did it for the good of Alethkar, then he claimed it for the good of Roshar. Amaram did everything he could to justify his actions so that he wouldn't have to admit that he was wrong. If Kalak did mention taking the shards for himself, I don't doubt that he stated it as an option given Kalak's penchant for indecision. Amaram's betrayal came because he wanted power and he refused to admit that he had no right to it. At the end of the day, it was Amaram who chose to, in defiance of all custom, law and tradition, murder men who tried to save his life by placing themselves in harms way and enslave the man who fought on alone because Amaram was 'trained in the sword'. Amaram's sense of honour was not about doing what was right because it was right, Amaram's sense of honour was simply a facade of convenience so that his outward image could remain spotless. Any one who can kill a shardbearer in a one on one contest without the advantage of any shards doesn't need to be 'trained in the sword', the man simply deserves the shards and anyone who tries to claim otherwise is an idiot. Amaram's skill compared to that of Kaladin was like a competent swordsman against a weapons master. The difference in ability between the two, as Elhokar would put it, could hold a kingdom. However, I think the main reason was that Amaram was a jealous coward who was embarrassed by the fact that it wasn't his honour guard who defended him but a group of lowly dark-eyed spearmen who proved themselves more capable and brave than any man in Amaram's army and he simply couldn't let them have the glory for their actions. He wanted what he wanted and, instead of claiming that they were sent off as a reward, he slandered the entire squad as traitors. Amaram deserved worse than he got in my opinion, far worse.

six hundred posts ! I have tripled my amount of posts in such short time

I felt a treatise instantly jump to mind, but it's one of those ones where the thousand-word pictures are there and in line, but the actual words to describe it all are difficult to find.I'm gonna chalk it up to "I'm tired" but here's my attempt. I find it's rare to have a character like this in fantasy; where an intelligent, powerful woman isn't punished by the story for being competent. Jasnah feels amazing as a female reader, where I don't have to worry Brandon is going to decide she needs to be brought "low" for no reason, just because she "deserves" it or whatever. She is an extremely guarded person, because she is surrounded at all times by people who think she should be brought low - because she's a woman, an atheist, whatever - and she is constantly putting on her strongest face, because to let everyone know she's touchable is an opening to destroy her. A lot of people want to destroy her. She's seen as cold, and that's an effect of her persona, she doesn't emote or present her emotions - but she does have them. There is a disconnect between what she feels and what other people see in her that is so frustrating, when you're in her shoes. Better to let people think you're an emotionless witch, it serves her appearance of strength, and in the meantime she... quietly wonders whether she's making a mistake. But she lets her walls down occasionally - with Shallan on the boat in WoR, with Renarin at the end of OB... She's always planning, conniving, scheming - and while a lot of the people around her think she's invincible because of her skill in this, the reader knows she's afraid she's just barely ahead of the curve. This is textual, in fact, in the beginning of WoR, when she lets down her walls with Shallan. We know for a fact Jasnah is treading water, discovering secrets almost too late to be of real use - coming back to Urithiru when all of her expertise is no longer needed, the Heralds' open return making her years of hard work basically irrelevant. Jasnah is a woman desperate to use her abilities in a way that matters, and she's barely breaking even. All of her intelligence and ability honed to an edge, and she still doesn't get to swoop in and save the day deus ex machina style like she would be able to in another, weaker story. If you don't like Jasnah, you don't like Jasnah. On principle, I hate the term "Mary Sue" and I think it's illegitimate, but this thread isn't really the place. She's competent, but competence in a female character is not enough to make her a cardboard cut-out. Part of her character is based on the fact that she's very secondary, even tertiary, right now - she just isn't going to get the role where we experience her pathos with her until later. In the meantime, what Jasnah really is a woman who intentionally obscures who she really is in public and sometimes even with her family. She requires a second look to see beyond the persona.

There are many theories in circulation on the cite and to commemorate the best of them I give you Theory Thursday. About Purpose Requirements RoW Season That concludes our RoW Season, we look forward to joining you again with tLM

So with the recent creation of the f-duralumin club, I got to thinking about interesting f-duralumin twinborn. Which made me wonder what allomantic powers heavily use Connection. The obvious answers are the ones that affect other people. Nicrosil, chromium, zinc, brass, maybe copper and bronze, maybe atium and malatium. So what would enhancing your connection do to these? Nicrosil and chromium generally require touch, which I think is to establish a basic connection with your target, and if so I think you could tap f-duralumin to leech/burst someone without touching them. I also think you could use it to generally strengthen any form of allomancy you use that targets someone else. But interestingly, and this would be useful even if you're not a twinborn, this would probably mean if someone tries to allomancy you, you could store connection to counteract it. If you're fighting someone who's burning atium, you could use f-duralumin to make it so that they don't see your shadows. You could maybe even mimic copper and hide yourself from a Seeker if you know what you're doing. So what do you all think? Am I completely off base here? Are there other cool uses for f-duralumin?

I just watched one of my favorite classic movies. I'll drop the plot below in spoilers:

Does....anyone mind if I also nominate Xinar ( @xinoehp512 x @Shard of Thought ) as best Couple? Nominate @Jaywalk as Friendliest And.... @FelCandy as the superior artist. Oh! How could I forget. @Aon-CHRISTMAS-Ene for best Mod, and @AonDii for Yay-est!

Most likely to brighten up your day: @Lunamor Most likely to break a world record: @AonDii because he can do anything. Most likely to be the next Bill Gates: @xinoehp512 Biggest prankster: @Aspiring Writer Most likely to become a motivational speaker: @Aon-CHRISTMAS-Ene Most likely to become the next Brandon Sandy: @Jaywalk Most positive: @Condensation

I just want to know where you got the idea that tin can store basically anything. Did Brandon ever say steelsight is a sense? Do we have a WoB on storing the 'sense of balance' you get from pewter? I think you can only store hearing, sight, smell, taste, or touch in a tinmind. Please. Don’t anger @Koloss17 by insulting tin. You’re lucky I got to you before they did. But yes, tin minds can store all manner of senses. There’s a different WoB that mentions how a platypus can store its electricity-sense. And since you can see bluelines even when you’re blind (it’s how the inquisitors see) there’s very good reason to believe it’s a separate sense. I even asked brandon a question relying on that assumption and he didn’t correct me. Tin is a really cool metal honestly.

Oh. Right. The elims always (almost always?) have access to a Google doc where they can communicate, plan, and generally create evil happenings, all the while free from the prying eyes and ears of the village. Edit: It'll be posted at the end of the game, in the Aftermath. imo one of the best parts of an SE game is Ctrl+Fing your name in the elim doc to see what they said about you.

Hello! After reading Rhythm of War and thinking about the Cosmere as a whole, I came up with a crazy theory that had shocked me to the core, and I can't find anything that disproves this theory, so I want to share it here and get other's opinions of this. My theory has to do with Trell, who we learn the existance of in Mistborn Era 2, and connecting it with Stormlight Archive. First, my theory is based on two assumptions: 1) That Mistborn Era 2 takes place after the first 5 books of the Stormlight Archive. I saw a fan made image on Instagram a while ago that showed this was the case. Has new information changed this? I haven't seen any updated timelines for the books. 2) That Dalian will loose in the upcoming battle against Odium and become a pawn of Todium (Taravangian with Odium's power). My theory is that Trell is Dalinar working on behalf of Todium. Pg 1193 of RoW "So Taravangian knew the cosmere was in chaos. Ruled by fools. Presides over by broken gods." We see that Todium looks out into the Cosmere and sees all the corrupt leaders and the other shards/gods and sees that it needs to be made right. Later on that page he says "and now, Taravangian was going to save them all." Todium clearly has plans not only for Roshar, but for all of the cosmere to make things "right". It sounds like he's going along the lines of Odium's original plan of being the only god and possibly bringing peace and security to the cosmere. Pg 385 of Shadows of Self "The governor was planning to speak to the people of the city. Bleeder hadn't succeeded in killing him yet, and Wax suspected he knew why. Because when she murdered him, she wanted an audience." Here we see Bleeder, who is being used by Trell, trying to take out a major political leader on Scadrial. Clearly Trell wants the "corrupt" leaders killed in front of the public to try and win over the hearts and minds of the people to them. If Bleeder had succeeded there is likely more to Trell's plan to put a better leader in place. Perhaps even someone who is a minion of Trell who would bring the right sort of leadership to a major area of Scadrial. Pg 435 of Shadows of Self (there are a few lines here I'm not going to quote them all) but it confirms that the metal is not one that Harmony knows. So it is a metal from another world, from another god. Let's call this metal Taravangium. (Not Trellium, though it was Trell, aka Dalinar, who delivered this metal to Scadrial on behalf of Todium.) (formerly this metal was Raysium) We also know (I don't have a quote for this) that shards can sense the presence of other shards. If Odium was free of Roshar and working in the Scadrial system as Trell, Harmony would know. But, we do know that powerful humans (and other beings) can operate on a planet without the shard noticing. Pg 535 of RoW in the text at the start of the chapter (which we can assume is a letter from Harmony to Hoid) "Regardless, please make yourself known to me when you travel my lands. It is distressing that you think you need to move in the shadows". Dalinar, going by the name of Trell, powered by Odium, could come to Scadrial and work to recruit members to Todium's cause, and Harmony would not be able to detect him as long as he kept hidden. The final piece is from the Copppermind website, when looking up Trell, Sanderson has said that "Trell has been many things over the eons..." so why not use that name to sow some confusion. So there it is. My theory that Trell is Dalinar, working on behalf of Todium to bring peace to the cosmere and take down all those corrupt leaders and gods. Now what does this mean for the future of the cosmere...

Anyone else get Die Hard vibes from Kaladin being the rogue troublemaker hiding in the upper floors of occupied Urithiru? If Die Hard is a Christmas movie, and Rhythm of War is a Die Hard doppelgänger, is Rhythm of War a Christmas book? Yippee Ki Yay, Odium!!

Hello Internet: Next time we're gonna talk about The Martian (one of my favorite books)! Me: Oh boy!!! That's one of my favorite books!!! Next time on HI: *continuous complaining about one of my favorite books* Me:

Did you read Alcatraz? Moron is not an insult.

No worries! Are you thinking we'd have a book 4 situation again, where the flashbacks are Eshonai's and Venli's but it's sorta Navani's book anyway? Because in that case, it's entirely possible we have a non-Radiant character becoming a Dustbringer

Okay, here's Tuesday and Wednesday. @Shard of Reading! You are cool, even if your improper spelling bugs me sometimes. Okay, a lot. But still. I'm glad for the providence that made me think you were Star ( ) so we could become Shardbuddies! @FriarFritz, you are totally cool. Your Epic character, Fritz, is really awesome and his powers were a great idea. You can be a little weird, but who isn't? Weird is good @Lunamor! You are so nice, I love to see your status updates because they always make me happy! I did think you were a boy at first, but now I can tell that you are a totally awesome girl. Keep being you! @MusicalReader, I don't think you've been on in a while. I'm still doing this because you're awesome. You were the only one to pick up on the loophole I left for people with purple eyes in Crystellation, and I absolutely loved discussing things with you! I'm grasping here. I'm running out of compliments.

So last night, during Sanderon's livestream, I asked if the maximum amount of Bondsmiths is set at 3 like it was historically. Brandon responded that there have not been more than 3 at one time historically with emphasis on historically. The smirk and laughter in the background makes me think he's being coy about the possibility of more than 3 Bondsmiths in the future. My theory is that there could be Bondsmiths for each type of light and associated "god-spren". Stormfather - Stormlight Nightwatcher - Lifelight Sibling - Towerlight BAM - Voidlight Sja-anat - Warlight ??? - unnamed Lifelight/Voidlight combo. This spren may not exist yet or we're not aware of it. BAM being a god-spren for Bondsmiths might answer a lot of the questions about deadeyes, the recreance, ect. This would tie in to the theorizing that imprisoning her lead to tons of Connection issues on Roshar. Her bondsmith might be able to fix these Connections but I might be getting too out-there with my theory. Let me know your thoughts. First Topic post on 17th Shard so let me know if I messed anything up (tags, spoilers, ect)! -Beren

Interesting WoB, he's said pretty much the opposite about NB before. I agree with you, Investiture is basically infinite on a long enough timeline because it eventually recycles to the spiritual realm. I don't think it's infinite in a given moment in time. Time doesn't matter in the spiritual realm, but it does matter in the other two. They can't pull a specific piece of investiture out of the spiritual if that piece is already in use in the physical or cognitive realm at that moment in time. He does say most investiture, maybe Nightblood is an exception. Maybe (MB spoilers): I assumed there was a natural delay between it being used and it being available to the Vessel. This may just be my head canon though, I thought he actually said this, but I don't see a WoB quite on point. https://wob.coppermind.net/events/256/#e8605 Nightblood holds onto a lot of the investiture he eats, it is not destroyed, just mulched and mixed together. When Nightblood is unsheathed and the black smoke spreads out I interpret that as the consumed investiture leaking out. It "evaporates" and goes back to the spiritual realm where it would become available to whatever Shard they were from. That's been my head canon and what Brandon basically said recently:

The two references hinting at Cultivation being a Dragon, from RoW: Exhibit A: Exhibit B:

I'm ambivalent about all of the suggestions, though a large part of that is probably familiarity bias. With a lot of our roles, we've developed a name for them based on the first game to feature them, which often means the Mistborn roles from LG1 - even if it's not a Scadrial game (e.g. vote manipulation being referred to as Soothing, even if it's not a Mistborn game.) I could see something similar happening here - you can use either a game-specific term (which might be imprisonment, execution, hanging, etc., depending on the game) or a generic term coming from a game with a word we all liked.

Survivor and Thaidakar do have the same number of syllables. It amuses me to imagine that Kell’s penchant for bestowing nicknames has become a Ghostblood by-law, and that’s why none of them use their actual names.

From my understanding Investiture is infinite. The Investiture we've seen used, while massive to mortal beings, is actually a small amount, basically the dregs. When we see that Investiture used, whatever products are left after the magic user has completed the action goes back into the Spiritual Realm where all Investiture originates. As for the Atium, Ruin was essentially locked out of the SR by Preservation and only able to access the Investiture he possessed locally. Those Atium beads would have been the key to unlocking his greater power, and since Preservation was weakened by being held by an incompatible Vessel at the time of the burn he would have been able to do as he wished. Elend however returned that Investiture to the SR and Ati could not access it. For the Light-antilight reaction, if I understand the mechanics the reaction forcibly removes whatever Investiture lurks within the target and returns it to the original realm (Spiritual). The force of that reaction releases heat. If the content of the Investiture is under pressure (like in a gemheart) then heat plus pressure equals explosion. That's all I got for now.

This is probably going to be my final clarification. I don't think it's impossible for cognitive shadows to leave their planets of origin. My interpretation of Brandon's WOB that I posted above, the dilemma that Kelsier is trying to resolve [which Brandon refers to as being due to being a Cognitive Shadow here], and the restrictions upon the Heralds and Fused is that it is not possible without a specific method that is not generally known but that Vasher probably knows it. There are a wide variety of things you can do that are theoretically possible - like Awaken with Stormlight or enter into Sel - but are not viable under ordinary conditions unless you know some kind of hack [which is not to get into the mechanics of these, but simply to state that getting Cognitive Shadows off system is not an ordinary feat that anyone can just do at the moment]. This assumption is reinforced by this WoB about Kelsier, which compares his dilemma to a spren. I personally do not find your examples persuasive of the idea that Cognitive Shadows can usually leave their systems with ease since most of them are based on things that haven't happened yet like Dalinar becoming Odium's interplanetary Fused general, Threnody's shades invading the rest of the galaxy, or generalising Vasher's experience to all Returned. I do not find these examples persuasive not out of a belief that Cognitive Shadows will never be able to leave [because we know pretty much anything is possible], but because we do not have any understanding of the mechanism that any of these theoretical events may or may not happen such that we can add them in as evidence for something. Moreover, I don't think it makes sense for the story if Kelsier/Thaidakar is the exception to the norm, because it means any progress that the Ghostbloods make on transporting Investiture has no impact on any broader plot that involves him leaving Scadrial. It makes more sense if there's some hack, and that hints to what that hack is are seen in the Seon case which is why Brandon thinks whether a random Splinter can leave Sel is informative as to why a Cognitive Shadow could one day leave Scadrial. If there were no common mechanics at all, then there wouldn't be much to ponder or deduce and the answer would come out of nowhere rather than be seeded in the books.

Hi! Just reading through this thread, can't believe I noticed this. I promise not to get on your back. I'm also going to go rep that. If you see, recognise, and "correct" your mistake, I'm unlikely to correct you. Because... duh. TBH, I'm laughing so hard right now.

Welcome to the Shard!

I think we should go for brutal honesty and use “murder”.

Well, @Frustration @mathiau, I made another one:

Not the Elantrians themselves--I think the Seons are the better comparison. The Seons bonded to a "broken" Elantrian (how do we not have a term for them??) all exhibit the following: Their minds aren't entirely there. Same for deadeyes. They're sapient beings that seem to have lost their intelligence. The Aon symbols at their center appear broken up. Similarly, the deadeyes show visible signs of not looking right. They loosely follow around the human they are bonded to. Just as deadeyes follow the human they are bonded to in Shadesmar. Might be some other things not coming to mind? My general suspicion is that it's a Connection issue. Elantrians were "broken" because the chasm disrupted their Connection to the Dor. And those effects seem to extend to the Seon they are deeply Connected to with a bond. So how does that relate to the spren? BAM was Connected to the singers and we saw that her capture damaged their Connection. The mechanics behind that are a bit of a mystery though... In any case, perhaps this Unmade was Connected to all spren on Roshar as well, (maybe dating back to before she was even Unmade) so her imprisonment broken their Connection too? But then why did it only affect them after Radiants broke oaths? Could guess that their bond with a stable human served as a lifeline for them, but it's still kind of weird. And what about the spren who weren't bonded? Is it possible that they were ALL (every last one of them??) bonded at the time of the Recreance? I feel like there's a lot of mysteries to be unraveled here, but I'm trying to work through my reread before getting in the weeds of this theorizing. XD

Yeah, I was so stunned I immediately flipped back and re-read the last few pages again, starting from Odium arriving and accusing Taravangian of betraying him. Then I noticed the simple sentence "And Ascended to godhood, becoming Odium." was at the very bottom of the page, but maybe not the chapter. So I flipped to the next page to see if there was more to this (there wasn't), half expecting Brandon to break the fourth wall. Yes, you read that right. Taravangian segued from being murdered by Szeth to wielding Nightblood to kill Rayse as the Vessel and Ascending in his place to become Odium. So many RAFOs just got FO'ed in one page. And so many more have now been spawned. Heh heh heh. I love my job. And I just realized, Taravangian has thought about Hoid before Ascending - what did he glean from Rayse's memories as the shard Odium, and what more did he add from rummaging and editing directly in Hoid's Breath-store of memories? But who is the wanderer, the wild piece, the one who makes no sense? I glimpse at his implications, and the world opens to me. (--From the Diagram, West Wall Psalm of Wonders: Paragraph 8)

I'm not sure about that. Kalak might be indecisive, but the very act of founding the sons of honor confirms he's capable of extreme manipulation and duplicity. There's simply no way a herald started a "lets restart the desolations to restore vorinism!" club on good faith. He's been misleading his followers and treating them like patsies from the start. And I see no reason why he would have acted any less during Kaladin's enslavement. If anything there are two things we really need to keep in mind about Kalak when it comes to judging his part in what happened with Kaladin and Amaram. -Kalak would have innately known that a single full shardbearer would have been utterly inconsequential in the event of another desolation -Kalak would have had the familiarity with Radiants and Surgebinding to understand there were ways to explain a full shardbearer being defeated by an "ordinary" soldier outside of astronomical luck Kalak knows the Sons of Honor having a full shardbearer does nothing to advance their purported goals, and certainly it does nothing to advance any of his ulterior ones. He has no reason to get excited over a transference of "mundane" shards amongst mortals. But has plenty of possible reasons as a herald to panic over a prospective radiant returning. To me that suggests that if Kalak said anything to Amaram, it was less out of concern for what was to be done with the blade and plate and more towards viewing Kaladin as a threat. And in light of how he's manipulated the Son's of Honor, I don't doubt he could have made a knee jerk decision to try to talk Amaram into executing Kaladin. If Kalak suffered any indecisiveness, it's likely in that he wasn't able to convince Amaram to kill Kaladin outright at that time.

There's so many odd factors to the state of Shallan's Ideal level and Lightweavers in general, it's almost impossible to pinpoint where she's really at and therefore where she's going. If not for Testament, I'd say she's already at the 5th Ideal equivalent for Lightweavers. But given that, it's possible that one or more of the Truths we've seen her speak have been to Testament. Even before RoW, I'd never really base any supposition on Shallan's Radiant path, too many extra factors and unreliable narration make it really hard to know anything as a fact as it relates to her. I'm starting to even doubt whether they have to swear "Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination." As for Windrunners, I'd say it's going to be along the lines of them choosing who to protect. It goes back to that scene in WoK where Lirin chose to save Roshone and let Riller die. Lirin first had to accept that he couldn't save Riller and had to choose to let him die to save the one he knew he could. The 4th Oath seems like it's more for accepting when you've failed to protect someone. These seem similar, but Kaladin wasn't forced to choose between saving Teft and doing something else. He was faced with the fact that he could not protect him. If it had just been Riller who was wounded and Lirin failed, that would relate more to the 4th Ideal. But he not only decided he could not save Riller, he immediately stopped using his time on him and moved on to Roshone. I have a feeling Kaladin will reach the 5th Ideal when he is forced to save someone he knows he can while letting someone else that he isn't sure he can save die(or leaving them to whatever fate awaits). I think it would be quite interesting if I got that right as that scene with Lirin would embody every oath a Windrunner can make. Protecting those who cannot protect themselves: Preforming lifesaving surgery on those who could not protect themselves from the whitespine. Protecting even those you hate: Saving Roshone's life even though he could have easily cut that artery and no one would ever know. I will accept that there are those I cannot save: Acknowledging that Riller was beyond saving. I will prioritize those that I can save when I determine it is likely that there are those I cannot: Making Riller comfortable and focusing on saving Roshone despite what Kaladin or Roshone thought. Edit: Had an interesting thought. What if he has to decide he cannot save Moash and has to kill him to protect someone Moash is going to kill.

The Ars Arcanum lists the 10 essences of Roshar and to each essence/Herald/Radiant order is listed a Primary and Secondary Divine Attribute. I wonder if the Radiant Oaths themselves are a progression from the Primary Divine Attribute to the Secondary Divine Attribute. In the case of Windrunners the primary attribute is Protecting, and the secondary is Leading. The 2nd and 3rd oaths focused on protecting, but the 4th seems a transition oath to broader duties of leadership. I would expect the 5th to be extremely leadership focused.

I think the time for Kaladin to kill Moash has passed. I feel like he'll have more of a Gollum type moment, with his failings of character putting him in the right place at the right time to change everything, even if he doesn't mean to.

I think you’re missing the point. Lift’s issue isn’t that her body is changing - it’s what the change represents. She doesn’t want to grow up. She doesn’t want to stop being her mother’s little girl. If her body didn’t change but her mind did she would still have all her problems. The physical change is just the most obvious, and she feels like she can enforce some control over that, like by measuring and binding herself. So that’s what she focuses on. But her real issue is that she’s maturing mentally. She wants her psychology to stay the same. She doesn’t want to grow up. It’s not her body; it’s her mind. Honestly, I think she’s a terrible choice for any trans association. Lift wants her mind to stay the same and is projecting that desire onto her body. Trans individuals want their body to reflect their mind. One of the things trans activists are fighting is the belief that trans individuals are projecting psychological difficulties onto their bodies. Since that is EXACTLY what Lift is doing, conflating her with the trans experience is a bad idea, as it can lead to the propagation of harmful stereotypes and beliefs. I can definitely see where her experience can reflect elements of the trans experience, especially where she feels betrayed by her body. But since her issues stem from a source that is too often mistaken as a ‘cause’ for transsexuality it is best not to conflate them. (Specifically, Lift has something more akin to Peter Pan Syndrome with elements of Body Dysmorphia. Since Dysmorphia and Dysphoria are confused far too often, it’s better not to conflate them period. Note that Peter Pan Syndrome is not recognized by the DSM.)

I think you spelled Willshapers Rule! wrong? Could be a trick of the light idk but I would appreciate this fixed please and thank you.