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BRING ON THE KALADIN/ELHOKAR BUDDY COMEDY WE ALL DESERVE #elhokarsredemption2k17

this is going to be Shardplate!

"We are the Watchers at the Rim" Oh. No.

Haven't even been able to finish the first chapter yet.... But seriously, the mental image of Syl on a headboard, cheering Kaladin on... "Harder, Kaladin! Harder! Oh yeah... That's it. Hit it" I'm.... Laughing and dying inside.

Now I can't stop myself from imagine all people from Roshar like: "Oh No! The Voidbringers have come" And people from Azir: "And even worse, they have binding contracts!"

I'm crossing my fingers that Lift will just randomly pop up from the Oathgate, hopefully right in the middle of a really dramatic scene. Imagine: there's a bang, a flash of light and suddenly a barefoot, half-starved, beggar girl with no safehand is standing on the Oathgate, brandishing a ShardFork and threatening to eat somebody if they don't take her to Dalinar pronto.

No - Dalinar already named Aladar as Highprince of Information. Adolin will either get Highprince of War, or Highprince of Fashion. It could really go either way...

Wow, I cannot believe that we already know the reason why the Knights Radiant turned their backs on mankind on the Day of Recreance.

Ok All the renarin haters can SHUT UP because he clearly used regrowth, and has a shardblade. Please stop hating. Although, that moved fast for Renarin. Hm. Also a new critter! A creature that has a gemheart that allows for meat making.

Syl trying to ship Kaladin and Shallan is making me crack up

This conflict with the voidbringers is going to be a lot more complicated than anyone thought! Sailing, stealing grain, negotiating! it almost seems like the parshmen of each region are collecting the attributes of that region. Farmlands parshmen steal grain, sea based parshmen take ships, parshmen near Azir negotiate. ...... What other notable trades/exports could be important to them?

Renarin is like my son, or so I think. My son is high-functioning autistic; I'm of the opinion Renarin is similar, higher functioning and perhaps Asperger's, but on the spectrum regardless. My son makes a lot of people uncomfortable. Even me at times. He doesn't assimilate data like I do, doesn't react to people like I do, worries about the strangest stuff, doesn't emotionally respond like most people are used to, gets overwhelmed by simple things and lets some really big ones just roll off of him. Anyway. I bring this up because Renarin's apparent leap forward as a Radiant is exactly how my son has developed over his whole life. There has been no gradual learning for him (and he's 17 now). There have been periods of no learning at all, followed by these massive leaps in understanding and adaptability that are unpredictable in both their duration and occurrence. The more I see of Renarin, the more I like him. Have to say I was pretty gratified he manifested Regrowth.

The Parshmen from Azir seem to be mediation form. They were mentioned in the listener songs as forms that could have made peace but actually delivered treachery and deceit and that is what their endgame right now might be.

The Parshmen are not all changing into stormform, but it seems there is a variety. I think the Everstorm broke whatever bond they used in the past to enslave the Parshmen and allowed the Parshmen to bond spren as normal. I suspect Odium is probably going to drum up a normal war to get both sides to hate each other, then both sides are on his side. Dalinar doesn't need to unite the kingdoms, he needs to unite the humans and the Parshendi.

Chapter 10: ... Heh. I chuckled. Like Kaladin. Guys, Kaladin chuckled! Huh. Warform? That's not a form of power, the ex-Parshmen might not be Voidbringers at all. The way I see it, they were freed by either the unchanged listeners (and so they are sticking to the safer forms; which could explain why they only went after the food), or they were freed by some stormforms... but then nothing else makes sense. I am heavily leaning towards the former, but I'll keep an eye out. I will personally hold Brandon accountable if this scene never happens. Check in with me after SA10 comes out. Also, Syl? The greatest thing ever. All the time. Forever. I do wonder if there was an actual bond between a Radiant and their Ryshadium. It sounds like a weird thing to have - I mean, both have a spren bond, but a bond between them? Maybe it was just some interference... Loooreee! Hey, that's kind of like a rapier. Renarin is pirate, confirmed. Also, I do so love the dynamic between the Kholin boys in this scene. I am revisiting my well-formed "Renarin is a creeplord" theory from before. I still think there's some fishy stuff going on with him, but maybe Shallan is just picking on those aspects a little too strongly. Which could make sense if she is also sensing something weird about Urithiru. Radiance. I wonder how we are going to be using the term, I like it. It's probably something Adolin made up on the spot, but it's good. Also, Lightweaving (from the perfected self-image, something we've seen Shallan do too) and Regrowth (from the healed hand)? Lightweaving might end up being a little more complicated than anticipated... Chapter 11: The Rift Maybe worth keeping this in mind when we start learning how Plate works. Young Sadeas is me, as a raid leader. The Kholins are my raid group. This is a big part of why I read Stormlight. Everything about it is excellent, but the one thing I can get in virtually no other book is the alien-ness of the world. Much like Tanavast, in fact. Tanalan. Tanavast. Hmm... What did you do, Blackthorn? Are you ashamed you killed a child, or that you spared one? Gavilar says you killed the boy, and at this point of your life I can believe that, but "Dalinar closed his eyes, distracted by the shame he felt. What if Gavilar found out?" doesn't fit. I think the kid's alive. This is the first time we hear Sunmaker's name, isn't it? The reveal that Oathbringer used to belong to Sunmaker was in this chapter's version included in Unfettered II, but not Sunmaker's name, I think. Good to know. Chapter 12: Negotiations Aww, that's nice. If I ever catch up on all of the (120+ so far) replies I've missed, I'll be looking at what Ch. V. D. stands for. It's certainly a very Azish thing to do though. It's interesting how the story has deviated from the truth. What. Wow, I actually feel frustrated at the Azish. That's amazing. Same here, buddy. Same here. Oh, you still have the Honorblade, don't you. Of course. I wonder if that refers to someone holy and pious, or is just another term for Surgebinder/Radiant. Well. Okay. Did not see that coming. Yeah, I am pretty shocked actually. I absolutely approve, and it's awesome, I just didn't think Elhokar was good enough, strong enough, to do something like this. I'll have to revise my opinion of the man, that must've taken a lot of courage, to submit himself to Dalinar like that. Oh, hey, on a different note, you know who likes bravery and obedience? Chana. And the Dustbringers. Just saying. Storms, I am beginning to really like Elhokar! That's a very charming fatalism and self-depreciation you've got going for you, kid. I dig that. Oooh, boy. Ohboy. This is ten ways not good, no, no, no. But I am curious about this supposed Radiant he has.

I don't think that quote has anything to do with Adolin becoming a Radiant. That is a glimpse into how Regrowth, and healing in general, is accomplished through magic. There is a 'Spiritual Ideal' of each person, who they are and who they believe themselves to be. Healing resets what has happened to them to that default, to whatever the Spiritual Ideal looks like at that time. So, Adolin's hand is broken, but his true Spiritual self doesn't have a broken hand, so the Physical changes to match the Spiritual. This is in contrast with Kaladin, who cannot heal his brands. He has taken those scars as a part of his personhood, as a part of his Spiritual self, so when he heals with Stormlight, they don't disappear. Same for Dalinar and his old scars; Stormlight won't heal them, because he is accustomed to them as part of him.

I think that this is an excellent point. Lightweaving seems to have a lot to do with idealizing someone, and in Shallan's case, she interplays it with Transformation, showing people what they could transform into, maybe, whereas Renarin seems to mix it with his Progression to heal them like the idealized version. Maybe it has to do with their Cognitive Aspect, somehow?

I think you meant "pay-Rayse".

To prevent you guys from racing each other in who posts a topic first, I'm gonna post a topic right now. The chapter should be available here, when it's published by tor: https://www.tor.com/2017/09/19/oathbringer-by-brandon-sanderson-chapters-10-12/ This topic will be unlocked when the chapters go public.

He got Adolin's plate through marriage...

I think the author of the in-world Oathbringer is more and more likely to be the Sunmaker since that was what his original Blade was called. His ideas must have been borderline heretical at the time (challenging the ardentia) and at that point I think vorin women already were the only ones who wrote, so the Sunmaker writing a book must have been unsettling as previous epigraphs implied.

So... Did anyone reading this wonder if the Thaylen Queen might be a proto-radiant herself? Not a lot of supporting evidence, just that what little we've seen of her personality matches the Stonewards, to me, and we don't have one yet, plus it's the section dealing with the radiants that made her suddenly go very distant and withdrawn. It seems to me to fit with her concealing something throughout the whole conversation, as well. Just a thought.

I think it was good to see Renarin from Adolin's point of view again. In fantasy, we're used to seeing those who are "different" but that's often in the context of them being a whole different race (eg elf, dwarf, dragon, whatever) so we expect them to be different - that's part of the charm. From that perspective, it seems a bit unfair to demand that all humans conform to some limited definition of "normal" and that any who don't are treated with distrust and suspicion. That's not always easy of course and can take time, depending upon the situation.

Oh, two more things: 1. What is up with the Shin and their dislike of fabrials? 2. Anyone else who thinks that Vstim might be Navanis Thaylen contact? That could introduce Rysn and the Larkin to Team Urithiru.

10. - Peeping Spren! I imagined something along this lines: Syl: "Go, Kaladin! Go!" ... Kaladin: "Did you like it?" Shallan: "That was... great." Pattern: "Mmm... a powerful lie..." - I really liked the interaction between the Kholin Brothers and it's nice having proof that Renarin wasn't hijacked by a Voidspren. 11. That's a quote from The Way of Kings that Dalinar quoted back in WoR. It sounds pretty ominous after this chapter. 12. - I really hope Vstim (and Rysn, of course) is the Thaylen Merchant Navani used to contact the Shin XD - Maybe it's a stupid question and I'm missing something but... ... who unlocked the gate in Urithiru when Shallan unlocked the Stormseat's one? - I don't understand why Bondsmiths were supposed (if they really were: I'm not still convinced) to lead Radiants and people: I mean, Ishar seems more the Herald equivalent of an ASoIaF Maester than a leader. Nevertheless, I was really pleased with this turn of events: Highking Dalinar... sounds good to me. Also, I really liked Elhokar in this chapter: it takes a lot of strength and courage to face our own fails and shortcomings... and he handled this pretty well: suddenly, an hypothetical story arc focused on him sounds more interesting. In this book, there will be a time where Dalinar will think that things couldn't get any worse for him. And Taravangian will be there, reminding him that things can always get worse.

Meme dump! Enjoy! Half of us be like: Words of Radiance: Mistborn: Reading Sanderson like:

Alright, just so we're clear... Is Renarin's shardblade a katana? Syl no! Don't provoke the Shadolin shippers! Also, I'm curious as to why Syl doesn't seem to have a problem with Lightweavers... Okay, ow! No wonder Dalinar is so grumpy... I'm with Navani, the queen of Thaylenah is awesome. This might be one of the most sinister lines ever written. I'm pretty sure I heard distant wailing. The voidbringers have me worried. They could be setting themselves up to be a body that, when faced with extinction, could be reasonable to ally yourself with. They do have legitament grievances (at least, they would be legitament if they weren't being driven by a cosmic force of Hate). And this is opposed to the bloody tyrant and conquerer everyone knows the Blackthorn to be, who just declared himself High King of the World.

And to think there were people saying Kal and Shallan could never get along because their spren are too different *whistles innocently* @Idealisticif Elhokar became a squire I would literally squeal. No shame here.

That doesn't help: Watership Down

- Kaladin's discussions with Syl are starting to Go There. The concept of a Sylphrena Cheering Section when Kaladin eventually, uh, gets his turn at bat is going to drive a lot of fanfic I'm never, ever going to read. - So Elhokar was, in fact, simply excluded (or was not considered essential) for Dalinar's planning session where he Bondsmith'ed Shallan into a 3D projector. And he wasn't in the room when Aladar was, during the spanreeding to other world leaders. damnation. - Uh-oh. I think Dalinar is going to get to the point of "lending" the Windrunner blade to Elhokar. Especially since Elhokar still seems to think Kaladin could teach him something - why not teach him Windrunner Surgebinding? - Renarin's healing of Adolin carried overtones of what Shallan did with Bluth and even Gaz: show them an idealized version of themselves. Perhaps it's an interplay of Lightweaving with Progression? - Taravangian has a Radiant?! What? - What are the Voidbringers up to? Negotiating contracts with the Azish, stealing ships and grain... They're gearing up for the long haul, not just a war of destruction.

Hi. My name is Cynthia. I'm from Kenya. I actually know didn't know who Brandon Sanderson until last week Monday when Elantris came up in my suggestion list. Since then I have literally been glued to my Kindle devouring his books. I have gone through Elantris, The Emperor's Soul, Warbreaker, The Way of Kings and Words of Radiance. Stormlight Archive is my absolute favourite and I am so glad I only have to wait 2 months for the next book. I can only imagine the agony of waiting from 2014. I'm currently reading Mistborn: The Final Empire and it is pretty Amazing so far. Anyway... I hope I have a great time here in the 17th Shard.

In a shattering of all decorum and common decency, I lapsed into unconsciousness immediately after reading "If Dalinar failed everywhere else, at least he would have King Taravangian at his...". Oh DK. So without further soliloquy, my post-sleep/pre-work first thinkies. As always, I have not read any of the comments or delicious lies by others, to leave my virginal thoughts unsullied and unspoiled, so my lazy apologies if you've seen it all before. Our first glimpses of using windrunner powers for general shenanigans rather than surgical assassinations, of conserving stormlight, and of Syl's sidekick developing some finesse. And of apparently believing he's an Edgedancer. Tasty! Hello. Farmed gemhearts. For those who may have wondered where they all come from. Stormfather or Honor, Syl. STORMFATHER OR HONOR? My lady doth speaketh elliptically. Eh? The Desolation will be...loud? Is this some ultrasonic "let's irritate American diplomats scenario? So clearly not all voidforms get pink-eye. Voidform may have more flexibility than we expected. Hmmmm. Beardin is back! Oh to spend cold nights nestled in your silky man-mane. There will be a quarter of a million posts on this exchange. I'll leave that to the shippers. Get your dirty, stinking paws off that Oathgate. Logistics win wars. Renarin doesn't get my motor running that much, but this was wonderful. You go boy! Oh and Truthwatchers clearly have a loose oath system yes? "Renarin is clearly a voidbinder because he hasn't healed Adolingo's hand", said this Extesian last week. Touche, Renarin, tou-storming-che. Oh and TRUTHWATCHER POWER. I was guessing the ability to change a spirit web. This is a bit more electrummy but delicious nonetheless. This will have uses. I hope Sadeas has a cognitive shadow so Hoid can waterboard it. Do...naturespren usually avoid the living? What is going on with your bond DK? Does Cultivation's investiture have an aversion to Honors investiture? Is the Stormsire Odiumish? Is Dalinar a voidspren? Stay tuned... There was definitely too much Thrill being cooked in the Kholin bathtubs. You stay strong DK. The seventh step is the most important. I admit, I expected the big reveal to be more disturbing. But still. Thrill addicts eh. Poor brave boy Brandon, you gotta quit trolling us bro. Either May is Adonalsium's cognitive shadow or she's NOTHING IMPORTANT WHATSOEVER. Or this is all leading to one terrible 'may' pun. Mediationform made for peace, it’s said. / Form of teaching and consolation. / When used by the gods, it became instead / Form of lies and desolation. I ship Fen and me. Is that you Vivenna? Did you grow your eyebrows long? I can dig it. That answers that. The people who follow One have Three? But any information on the Iriali pleases me. And Vstim is about to have some influence. Sweet. Elhokar, these words taste strange, but I love you. I actually teared up a bit at this. The spren directed? Taravangian is using Radiants? 10,000 Veden troops are about to arrive in Urithiru? A new Radiant order? Mrall is a Returned kandra with hemalurgy? Taravangian is a dragon? Vivenna is Jezrien's daughter? Any more questions?

Did anyone else catch onto Renarin discovering that horses are not native to Roshar? While he doesn't explicitly state it, he notes that they are not fit to survive on roshar on their own.

Awesome writing prompt. I think they are being led off to nurse their hatred. The parshendi fought the Alethi, but not with any especial relish. They viewed the war as a logical consequence of a necessary action - killing Gavilar to stop him from returning their gods. The parshmen, however, have been enslaved in chattel slavery for centuries. Now they are aware. Odium's intent is hatred, not simply destruction. Why not stoke that hatred of the formerly oppressed before turning them loose with no combat training? The Thrill even plays into it, as it encourages you to do terrible things - things that disgust or invoke loathing in others. Years of oppression and warfare have turned the humans of Roshar, especially the Alethi, into catalysts for Odium. Why waste that for a simple assault? Odium isn't Ruin, and even Ruin was more subtle than that.

I greatly enjoyed these chapters. An end (or at least a pause) to "Renarin is faking being a Truthwatcher", and the same for Syl/Kaladin relationships. I don't know how that would work, don't want to know, but at least neither of them seem to show interest in it - more family than romance. Oh, and some more indication that Elhokar might end up a Lightweaver. Admitting truths to himself, seeing more Spren when he's around other Radiants... though I'd be just as happy if he ended up a squire to Kaladin.

At the worst possible time.

Spren babies... spren babies everywhere

Any one else get the pun?

The scout is...wait for it... ... VIVENNA

This song is a tribute for Disney, but also a tribute to Bridge Four. ( @Faceless Mist-Wraith still working on Cold as Ice) Let’s get down to business, to lift up the bridge! Are we to be martyrs, when we run the ridge? You’re the saddest bunch I’ve ever met But you can bet before we’re through Bridgemen, I’ll make a man out of you. Slaving for the lighteyes but rebel within Once you find your center, you are sure to win You’re a storming, pale, pathetic lot And you haven’t got a clue Somehow I’ll take the slave out of you I’m never gonna lift the bridge To Damnation go those lighteyes Storms, was I a fool in war for cutting lords Kaladin’s got me scared to death Hope he doesn’t see right through me Now I really wish for some ale and gin Bridge Four! We must be swift like the racing Fleet! Bridge Four! With all the force of an Everstorm! Bridge Four! With all the strength of a chasmfiend! Mysterious as the dark side of the Plains! Time is racing toward us till the next bridge run Heed all commands, and you might survive! We’re unsuited for the rage of war So kneel down, and pray to gods How could I honor men such as you! Bridge Four! We must be swift like the racing Fleet! Bridge Four! With all the force of an Everstorm! Bridge Four! With all the strength of a chasmfiend! Mysterious as the dark side of the Plains! Bridge Four! We must be swift like the racing Fleet! Bridge Four! With all the force of an Everstorm! Bridge Four! With all the strength of a chasmfiend! Mysterious as the dark side of the Plains! Hyaa!

Chapters 10-12 were released today, and everyone's talking about the big comedy moment: the image of Syl watching Kaladin have sex. Yes, the peeping spren is indeed hilarious. But it's also so much more. I think Brandon may have just dropped some epic foreshadowing, disguised as an innocuous joke. Spren do not respect closed doors. Spren are usually invisible to most people. Radiants are popping up all over Roshar, so sapient spren are about to be almost as common as regular spren. Conclusion? There is no more privacy on Roshar. Every single private conversation and covert activity is vulnerable to spyspren. No secret is safe. The Sleepless are nothing compared to spyspren. We've already seen Pattern used this way, but any Radiant spren should be able to do the same. And it's too big an advantage not to use. In fact, I'm a little disappointed that Shallan hasn't shared this technique with Dalinar and the others. It would probably be a big help in the murder investigation. Speaking of which... Adolin did a bad thing at the end of WoR, and he doesn't think there were any witnesses. Same for the copycat killer. (Assuming Adolin himself isn't the copycat killer.) But there could always be a spyspren. And what about voidspren? What if Odium has little eyes and ears all over the place, and no one can see them?

Yeah... making out... thats what he was thinking of

According to the Ars Arcanum, heliodor is associated with soulcasting meat and flesh. Gumfrems must have heliodor gemhearts. From the same source, helidor is associated with Ishar... we don't know where he is yet. Ishar = a random gumfrem in the field Kaladin passed confirmed!

Let's talk about Highking Dalinar. By the numbers. 1. Kholin Princedom. This looks like it will go to Adolin, as Dalinar's heir. Reasonable, and Dalinar really doesn't have time to administer it. Of course, we know that Alethi work in pairs (similar to parshendi, amusingly), and Adolin's causal-betrothed is not likely to be free to help Adolin see to the administration of the princedom. 2. Position as Highprince of War. Is that going to go to Adolin, as well? It seems obvious, if a bit uninspired. Same problems as (1) are involved. 3. The Investigation. Adolin was directed to investigate by the Highprince of War/de facto King. He is now Highprince. Will he designate a new investigator, and how will that work for him? I am guessing poorly. 4. Urithiru. Anyone else uncomfortable with a KR being placed in a monarchial position? What right do the Bondsmiths have to claim the region, as opposed to a council of the Orders? Also, what will happen when another Bondsmith arises? 5. Elhokar. This was a pretty shrewd move by him, if it was intended to be a reconsolidation of power. Even if not, it has potential to cause trouble later.

Okay guys so. I've had the crappiest afternoon. And yet! *Adolin getting his wrist healed. Adolin thinking fondly about his blade. Adolin having Sureblood Feels *Renarin with his Radiant Blade. Renarin and his brother bonding *Elhokar stepping up, ready to become a better man *Kaladin smiling *Brandon throwing a bone to us Shalladin shippers after three years and a half, god bless his soul *Things are well on their way to blowing the hell up This chapter trifecta was the best yet. And we're still, like, a third into part one. I'm so excited.

My thoughts: *Sylblade is awesome. Now I'll be waiting for Shallan to start thinking about her Patternblade. *Speaking of Syl, I can see how she would be a huge problem once Kaladin gets a girlfriend. I dislike how dismissive she is of Adolin though, and how biased she is towards Kaladin. *Looks like Renarin is a Truthwatcher. Well, I'll continue to say that something is wrong with him. He is just too wierd. And also, Adolin seeing his ultimate self, might that have been the Truthwatchers Resonance? Making others see their true potential, or something? *Dalinar killed a little kid? He really was a monster. Also, R.I.P Teleb. These flashbacks makes him a badass. He is Stormlights version of Legolas, and died off-screen :-( *I LOVE the Azish. They are hilarious, even though I understand Dalinars frustration. *May Aladar keeps on appearing... I like Aladar though, he comes with good suggestions. And also, his "having a bad day" line was kind of funny. *I didn't like the Thaylen queen, which makes her the first Thaylen I don't like. I wonder what is up with her though. Dalinar thought something was off. The Thaylens are on an island, so they are pretty isolated. Maybe the Voidbringers conquered it and the one writing is an Unmade/Voidbringer impostor. They would probably have a lot of parshmen around there, since they most likely trade with them. It could be theoretically possible, and due to the isolated nature of the island, take a while for Team Urithiru to discover. *Elhokar is great. I also think that his scene proves that he does care about his people, and is not in it for glory only. "Bring the bridgeman in case I screw up, so that the city will be saved anyway" implies that he isn't afraid of humiliation, and that saving the people is his first priority. *Mr. T has a Radiant. Thats fun, considering that he doesn't want any of them running around. Something is wierd here.

My first thought was that Taravangian's "Radiant" was actually Palah. Possibly he figured out who she was awhile ago, possibly she just decided to surface. Either way he is definitely playing a deadly game.

SAME! Ok. Parshmen strategy. Stealing boats, food, and making demands? Where is all the destruction? I want VOIDING not POLITICS. Also when is tarangavian going to betray dalinar

Maybe the reason Adolin hasn't bonded a spren yet is because he hasn't embodied the first oath yet, I can see hints of both edgedancer and stoneward in him which is specific to his particular order, assuming he will become a radiant. But if he hasn't embodied the first ideal no matter how much he resembles the ideas that embody that ideal he will never become a radiant. The way I see it, adolin is putting the destination before the journey, he takes the most direct path even if such a path is dishonorable or unjust. And I am only mildly thinking about him killing sadaes. That to me seems like something that a knight radiant could do. But and i say but, I don't believe he had the authority to make that call. additionally when they were initially betrayed by sadaes, adolin was practically ignoring the losses of his armies so that he could save dalinar from the shardbearer. Again moving in direct fashion ignoring the cost and instead focusing on the destination of rescuing dalinar. < that scene is also why I think Adolin might be a stoneward. Also in the arena with the four shardbearers, or rather before, he was so focused on the end goal of collecting shards he didn't really think about how his words could be used against him so he had to fight 4 shardbearers. Also in the arena is another example of why i think he might be a stoneward. He was willing to stand against impossible odds to protect his brothers life again "I will stand". I realize this post is a bit disorginized but basically my thoughts on the matter is TLDR: that adolin isn't bonding a spren because he is focused on the destination before the journey and that adolin might be a stoneward

Literally my reaction: THEY'RE GORGEOUS. *saves as wallpaper for her desktop*