Mandamon Posted April 9, 2018 Report Share Posted April 9, 2018 Part 1, 2nd half This is a little long, so apologies. If you want a slightly shorter read, you can skip over the stuff that was in the very first submission, but not the second, after I aged up the MC. If you want to do that, start at the break on pg 6. Last time, the group starts the expedition, gets the balloon packed and starts rising. The MC has some issues with her mother about being dragged along. Now, they will continue their ascent until they get to where the can deploy the beetle! Still mainly concerned with character voice and whether you think this will engage younger readers. If you find any plot holes, let me know. And of course anything else that occurs to you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truthweaver Posted April 12, 2018 Report Share Posted April 12, 2018 I think this is great so far. The scene about the discovery and possible theft of a second drill was interesting...I'm hoping that comes into play again later in the story. I have a better handle on the Nether now, but I think some more explanation/setting description in the beginning would be helpful and do more to cement the reader into the story, especially if they're middle grade readers. Character voice is still good and consistent. She feels like an "everykid," but that isn't a bad thing when the reader is younger. I don't have much else to add. Your writing flows well and is easy to read, and the story is engaging. I look forward to reading more! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kais Posted April 12, 2018 Report Share Posted April 12, 2018 Overall As much as I personally want to know more about the walls, I'm not sure how gripping this would be for readers outside of the world (especially new MG readers). The MC doesn't really do much this chapter, and most of the events happen around her(?). I'd like to see her do more in the balloon during the trip to really hook me into the story, as well as more emotions about what they're likely to find. As I go - at least someone cares about where the canisters go! - end of page one: suggest cutting the trying to show him with her eyes, and the line about the darling, and swapping it with an eye roll and some fists clenched, then maybe looking down at her crotch (or something akin). Kids don't have the same issues with social stuff regarding genitals, especially when it comes to peeing. OR maybe she could just say, too loudly, "I HAVE TO PEE!" Which would also be appropriate - HAHA love the line before the section break! - I wouldn't line another line or two describing the specifics around the competitor being jailed - page four: I think the conversation in the above pages would work better if the girl found it on some parchment (the relevant info) from snooping or something. Right now she's just really passive, and I'd like to see her drive the narrative a bit more - page ten: probably WRS, but I'm having a hard time getting excited for reaching the wall. I don't really get a sense of excitement from the girl, either, until the last line in this section - page fifteen: so...is no one concerned with destabilizing the walls of the Net?? - confused about the 'don't call me girl.' She seems too young to demand being called woman (she's 10? 11?). Is she nonbinary? I thought she self-identified in chapter one as female, or at least, didn't react to female pronouns? I'm confused and I apologize if I assumed. It seems like this isn't age related though, since she didn't react to the 'little one' comment one page one, which I would think would rankle more than 'girl'. - page 18 and silly girl comment: I'm confused here. Was she just chastised? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandamon Posted April 13, 2018 Author Report Share Posted April 13, 2018 Thanks to @Truthweaver and @kais 12 hours ago, Truthweaver said: The scene about the discovery and possible theft of a second drill was interesting...I'm hoping that comes into play again later in the story. It will! 12 hours ago, Truthweaver said: some more explanation/setting description in the beginning would be helpful I can do that. I want to make sure I don't overload and infodump, but also don't want to leave readers confused. 3 hours ago, kais said: OR maybe she could just say, too loudly, "I HAVE TO PEE!" Which would also be appropriate Yeah, that might work... 3 hours ago, kais said: I wouldn't line another line or two describing the specifics around the competitor being jailed "Mind," I assume? This will come up again pretty soon. 3 hours ago, kais said: the girl found it on some parchment (the relevant info) from snooping or something. Right now she's just really passive, and I'd like to see her drive the narrative a bit more Yep, I think this section is probably one of the worst for being too passive. N finding the evidence will help. 3 hours ago, kais said: confused about the 'don't call me girl.' She seems too young to demand being called woman (she's 10? 11?). Is she nonbinary? Hmm..seems like this isn't coming across right. She's female, but more 12-14 yo, enough to start wanting acknowledgement as an adult even though she's still young. I was trying to show that here but doesn't seem like it's working. She did react to the "little one" comment as well, but maybe that was too subtle... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
industrialistDragon Posted April 13, 2018 Report Share Posted April 13, 2018 10 hours ago, Mandamon said: She's female, but more 12-14 yo, If she's 13 or 14, you're edging out of the middle grade age bracket and into teen age bracket. About as old as you can go for mg is 12. 13/14 is a ninth grader and a teen. I was picturing her as a 10- or 11-year-old, which is kind of the sweet spot for mg. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truthweaver Posted April 13, 2018 Report Share Posted April 13, 2018 I agree with @industrialistDragon. If she's supposed to be 12-14, her voice feels very young. 9-11 would be the age I would put her at. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandamon Posted April 13, 2018 Author Report Share Posted April 13, 2018 Thanks to @industrialistDragon and @Truthweaver for the clarification. 9 to 11 it is. Is this voice sounding the right age, or do I need to age her actions down some? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truthweaver Posted April 13, 2018 Report Share Posted April 13, 2018 @Mandamon I don't think so, she sounds tween-age to me. When I was 9 I read a book that involved the main character's nine-year-old sister in some adventure. I remember really enjoying the whole book, but whenever the 9yr old was in a scene it annoyed me to no end because she talked and acted like a five-year-old. By the time a kid is a tween, they're usually able to understand most things at an adult level and act accordingly if they want to. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandamon Posted April 13, 2018 Author Report Share Posted April 13, 2018 @Truthweaver Great! Thanks for the explanation! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinski Posted April 16, 2018 Report Share Posted April 16, 2018 On 13/04/2018 at 4:56 PM, Truthweaver said: I agree with @industrialistDragon. If she's supposed to be 12-14, her voice feels very young. 9-11 would be the age I would put her at. I would disagree. Why does it have to be Middle Grade anyway? My complaint with the original version was the overwhelming simplicity of the reactions. I don't think simplifying is going to serve the story well. Clearly, I don't have a female perspective, but I do have a daughter, now 23, who has been 9, 10, 11, 12, 13 and 14. All people are different, but I think I would struggle to believe that a 9-11 year-old could influence the story in the same way a 13-14 year-old could and would. I have emailed LBLs. I have major issues with them free climbing the wall with basically no physical support from the drill; it's not at all what I was picturing or expecting. If Mom has brought her 9-11 year-old to the height of Everest to then free climb a shear surface, she should be locked up from child abuse! At the point where the drill attaches to the wall, something should happen to the balloon with the change in loading. BUT WAIT, how has the balloon been stationary through this? If the burner is not burning, it will begin to drop as the air in the balloon cools, probably quite rapidly at this altitude. They've been stationary for quite a while with no gas. When the weight of the drill comes off, the balloon should at least shift somehow. I thought they would be riding inside the drill, like a Jules Verne submarine, or other contraption. The drill is huge, it can't all be engine, surely? And I must admit, I was picturing it like the thing the Underminer has in The Incredibles. I've been struggling to get my head around how they were going to be suspended from the drill, but this free climbing aspect is unbelievable, for me 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandamon Posted April 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2018 Thanks @Robinski Yeah, I was wondering if someone would find climbing unbelievable. There's some more description in the new submission about how they're rigged up, so maybe that will help? 5 hours ago, Robinski said: I thought they would be riding inside the drill, like a Jules Verne submarine, or other contraption. The drill is huge, it can't all be engine, I think I need some better description of the drill then. It's big enough to ride on, but not in. 5 hours ago, Robinski said: At the point where the drill attaches to the wall, something should happen to the balloon with the change in loading. BUT WAIT, how has the balloon been stationary through this? Thanks for the engineering check, as usual! I think I can edit this to make some more sense. Maybe they're using another canister just to keep the balloon stationary for now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kais Posted April 17, 2018 Report Share Posted April 17, 2018 On 4/12/2018 at 7:12 PM, Mandamon said: but more 12-14 yo If she's 14, I think you'll need to age her up again. 12 I could see, and yes, also bristling at girl, although now I'm trying to think if I cared about that at that age (gender aside). Hmmm. But 11 would be more believable yet. Just definitely not 14. 14 is a whoooole different level of snark. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinski Posted April 17, 2018 Report Share Posted April 17, 2018 I think you're close to a consensus here, @Mandamon, at 12 years-old (if Truthweaver would permit another year up from 11). Of course, Nat's an Et. so she could be 35 in Et. years for all we know 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truthweaver Posted April 17, 2018 Report Share Posted April 17, 2018 I agree with @Robinski. 12 I could also find believable. After all, everyone ages differently. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandamon Posted April 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2018 Yay! We have consensus. I'm going with 12. And as @Robinski notes, of course her species lives longer, so that messes everything up, but I'm taking that out of consideration. "Equivalent to 12" because I don't actually mention her age. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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