[OB] Szeth and Nightblood

[Wreith]

1 hour ago, Catladyman said:

So Nightblood has definitely given Szeth the ability to draw in stormlight, given the strange afterimage he leaves behind

The afterimage is caused because his spiritual (cognitive) self didn't completely realign with his physical self when Nale revived him

not sure this is needed, but Edgedancer

Spoiler

Lift can see the separation clearly because she is partially in the cognitive realm.

To the best of my knowledge we have not seen Szeth holding stormlight since his "death"

[Calderis]

3 hours ago, Catladyman said:

So Nightblood has definitely given Szeth the ability to draw in stormlight, given the strange afterimage he leaves behind.

The after image is a result of the manner in which he was resurrected. It is visible to Lift for the same reason she can touch Wyndel, but others could see it under the right conditions as well. 

http://theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=1178#7

Quote

QUESTION

Could only Lift see Szeth's afterimages?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Anyone sufficiently Invested can see them. Connection to the Cognitive Realm helps, too.

Szeth has not held Stormlight yet. 

http://theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=1163#22

Quote

QUESTION

I was wondering, is Nightblood a Shardblade?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Nightblood is an attempt by someone who didn’t know how Shardblades were made to create a Shardblade using a different magic system.

QUESTION

If Nightblood feeds on Breath, but Szeth doesn’t have it, will it feed on Stormlight?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Nightblood can feed off Stormlight, but Szeth can't draw in Stormlight right now. So Szeth better not draw that sword, for a while at least.

 

[Kingsdaughter613]

Part of the issue with Nightblood is that perfectly decent people could be drawn to the sword. For example:

There is an old Jewish saying that a man who lusts for blood could become a murderer, a slaughterer [of animals], or a circumciser, depending on how they channel it. But someone who has a natural urge to kill, no matter how succesfully they have channeled that nature, would be drawn to Nightblood. 

Actually being evil doesn't solely make someone likely to be drawn to Nightblood; having the wrong personality traits can do it too! Which makes the Nightblood litmus test very, very dangerous... 

I think Kalladin would be drawn to Nightblood during WoK and WoR. Quite possibly he still would be.

[WhiteLeeopard]

In Warbreaker Nightblood killed a lot of people for trying to steal him. So, guess Nightblood agrees with Nale on the penalty for stealing .

Now, I've been meaning to ask for a while. If we take all WoBs and assume Nightblood can grant Surges, which surges do you guys think they would be? For some reason I'm obssesed with the idea that one surge of Nightblood will be akin to a larkin or burning Chromium.

[Seeker861]

6 hours ago, WhiteLeeopard said:

Now, I've been meaning to ask for a while. If we take all WoBs and assume Nightblood can grant Surges, which surges do you guys think they would be? For some reason I'm obssesed with the idea that one surge of Nightblood will be akin to a larkin or burning Chromium.

I believe that Nightblood will grant Szeth powers of some kind but not Surges. I like the idea of him being able to leach Investiture away from a being, it would fit nicely with Nightblood. His abilities might also be similar to what comes from the Heightenings.  

[Blacksmithki]

10 hours ago, Seeker861 said:

I believe that Nightblood will grant Szeth powers of some kind but not Surges. I like the idea of him being able to leach Investiture away from a being, it would fit nicely with Nightblood. His abilities might also be similar to what comes from the Heightenings.  

I wonder if night blood, an honorblade and a nahel  bond could be had/wielded by one person, would it grant them powers from all three? Would they block each other? Could we have an invisible soulcasting Releaser wielding night blood and two shardblades?

Edit: autocorrect likes radiants to bond bagels I guess (changed bagel bond to nahel bond)

Edited October 19, 2017 by Blacksmithki

[Wreith]

4 minutes ago, Blacksmithki said:

I wonder if night blood, an honorblade and a nahel  bond could be had/wielded by one person, would it grant them powers from all three? Would they block each other? Could we have an invisible soulcasting Releaser wielding night blood and two shardblades?

Edit: autocorrect likes radiants to bond bagels I guess (changed bagel bond to nahel bond)

I don't agree with your described cause, but I like the general idea.

I wonder if Nightblood absorbs investure from different Radiants if he could then grant their surges. Possibly for a limited time.

[Seeker861]

2 hours ago, Blacksmithki said:

I wonder if night blood, an honorblade and a nahel  bond could be had/wielded by one person, would it grant them powers from all three? Would they block each other? Could we have an invisible soulcasting Releaser wielding night blood and two shardblades?

We know that a person can have a Spren bond and wield an Honorblade in order to gain multiple Surges. I'm not sure a Spren would be comfortable with their Knight using Nightblood though. 

2 hours ago, Wreith said:

I wonder if Nightblood absorbs investure from different Radiants if he could then grant their surges. Possibly for a limited time.

This would be an awesome ability. 

[ChazBolt]

6 hours ago, Wreith said:

I don't agree with your described cause, but I like the general idea.

I wonder if Nightblood absorbs investure from different Radiants if he could then grant their surges. Possibly for a limited time.

That ability sounds Bondsmith-y to me. 

[Yata]

14 hours ago, Wreith said:

I don't agree with your described cause, but I like the general idea.

I wonder if Nightblood absorbs investure from different Radiants if he could then grant their surges. Possibly for a limited time.

I believe this is mostly impossible.

If Nightblood absorbs a Radiant's Kinetic Investiture (and this happens before the Innate is touched) and this Investiture is in someway usable by the holder (Szeth), it will just be fuel.

If Nightblood absorbs a Radiant's Innate Investiture (witch mostly mean he would kill the guy or hurt the Spren) and this Invesitute is usable...Maybe something could happen, but watching Nightblood's work. I strongly disagree with the possibily of a sofisticated use of the stolen Investiture.

[Erunion]

54 minutes ago, Yata said:

I believe this is mostly impossible.

If Nightblood absorbs a Radiant's Kinetic Investiture (and this happens before the Innate is touched) and this Investiture is in someway usable by the holder (Szeth), it will just be fuel.

If Nightblood absorbs a Radiant's Innate Investiture (witch mostly mean he would kill the guy or hurt the Spren) and this Invesitute is usable...Maybe something could happen, but watching Nightblood's work. I strongly disagree with the possibily of a sofisticated use of the stolen Investiture.

Agreed. Also, Mistborn spoilers below!  

 

Stolen access to Invested abilities comes from stealing a part of the spiritweb as in hemalurgy - this is an incredibly damaging thing. 

 

So if Nightblood can act as a pseudo hemalurgical spike? That would be interesting. But I don’t think it’s likely - as it would require damaging the host as well. 

I can however see Nightblood devouring Investiture itself (in this case, Stormlight) and feeding off of it. 

[Wreith]

7 hours ago, Erunion said:

Agreed. Also, Mistborn spoilers below!  

 

Stolen access to Invested abilities comes from stealing a part of the spiritweb as in hemalurgy - this is an incredibly damaging thing. 

 

So if Nightblood can act as a pseudo hemalurgical spike? That would be interesting. But I don’t think it’s likely - as it would require damaging the host as well. 

I can however see Nightblood devouring Investiture itself (in this case, Stormlight) and feeding off of it. 

My idea was more that Nightblood somehow learns how the investure was filtered when he takes it. The investure he takes isn't actually used to perform the abilities, but he can now mimic for his wielder the abilities he has encountered.

I agree that it's not likely.

[Naerin]

On 10/5/2017 at 1:01 PM, Erunion said:

Most interestingly, however, is that Nightblood has a resonance with people. If someone is good/innocent/relatively moral, they will feel profoundly nauseated by Nightblood. If someone is evil/selfish/relatively immoral they will be filled with lust to claim and use Nightblood; all but inevitably ending in their death. 

Perhaps I am just reading into things too much, but I think it is interesting that Szeth had neither reaction to Nightblood. There is no description of nausea, but also no description of lust or craving. Just mild curiosity. To me this speaks to Szeth's thematic arc as Truthless, someone who doesn't believe in anything anymore, and doesn't want anything, except guidance. Which gets into what everyone has already said about him using Nightblood as a moral guide, as if he can't really come back from being Truthless, and still needs some kind of external touchstone in order to go on living and making decisions about right and wrong. It should be a really fascinating dynamic to explore and I really, really hope they get a decent amount of POV time in Oathbringer. 

[Lazarus52980]

9 hours ago, Naerin said:

Perhaps I am just reading into things too much, but I think it is interesting that Szeth had neither reaction to Nightblood. There is no description of nausea, but also no description of lust or craving. Just mild curiosity. To me this speaks to Szeth's thematic arc as Truthless, someone who doesn't believe in anything anymore, and doesn't want anything, except guidance. Which gets into what everyone has already said about him using Nightblood as a moral guide, as if he can't really come back from being Truthless, and still needs some kind of external touchstone in order to go on living and making decisions about right and wrong. It should be a really fascinating dynamic to explore and I really, really hope they get a decent amount of POV time in Oathbringer. 

IIRC, the next book is most likely going to be Szeth's book (Stones unhallowed?) so I'm guessing we won't see TOO much of his perspective until book 4.

[Naerin]

19 minutes ago, Lazarus52980 said:

IIRC, the next book is most likely going to be Szeth's book (Stones unhallowed?) so I'm guessing we won't see TOO much of his perspective until book 4.

You are probably right. But I can dream! 

We'll find out on Tuesday. Coincidentally the day where I come down with a mysterious illness and have to miss work. 

Edited November 10, 2017 by Naerin

[NinjaAlligators]

I am very interested to see how Szeth will learn to draw in Stormlight, assuming that happens in Oathbringer.  I have serious doubts that any Nahel spren would consider him while he possesses Nightblood, even with the recommendation of a Herald.  Nightblood can devour spren,  destruction beyond even the breaking of Oaths, and all Szeth would have to do is run out of Investiture with Nightblood drawn.  Unless highspren have very little sense of self-preservation, I have a hard time seeing one take that kind of risk.  Moreover, Nightblood (my favorite Cosmere character, BTW) is a wrong Shardblade, one that is broken and alien and Other compared to spren of both Honor and Cultivation.  Imagine a disturbingly lifelike doll with no eyes that moves and acts like a human, but eats people.  That is what Nightblood is like for a Nahel spren.  Would you go near him?

Side note, I'm still holding out hope that we will soon see what Nightblood looks like in Shadesmar.

[shadowwisp]

See I was always under the impression that Nightblood determined evil based on who it was bonded to. 

Which is what made it so particularly dangerous, evil is in the eye of the beholder. 

[StormingTexan]

3 hours ago, Lazarus52980 said:

IIRC, the next book is most likely going to be Szeth's book (Stones unhallowed?) so I'm guessing we won't see TOO much of his perspective until book 4.

 

Quote

 

Questioner

I want to know exactly what happened to Szeth with Nightblood.

Brandon Sanderson

There's some good stuff. His scenes don't start until about three-quarters of the way through. But there's a lot to them when they do.

 

 

[Lazarus52980]

Just now, StormingTexan said:

 

 

That's nice to know actually, since when I looked it up it appears that the next book is Eshonai's book and Szeth's book won't be until book 5!  

[Xavien]

As someone who is already not a fan of Szeth, I think the worst possible thing that could happen to his character arc would be a Nightblood Litmus Test for good/evil.  He's already spent years doing whatever the person holding his stone told him to do so now that he no longer has the stone he'll willingly let a sword tell him what is good/evil?  Despite that, upvote for the OP as it's an interesting theory.

I'm hoping for more along the lines of a moral dialogue between the two on the distinctions of good vs evil and law vs justice.

[The One Who Connects]

21 hours ago, Naerin said:

Perhaps I am just reading into things too much, but I think it is interesting that Szeth had neither reaction to Nightblood.

I think you're reading into it too much. We know that characters who survive contact with Nightblood no longer feel the nausea, so there should be some kind of Realmatic "Line" getting crossed as a side effect of holding the sword. I figured that whatever it may be, Szeth's experiences crossed it as well.

That said, it could be on his motivations as you suggest, so good idea at least.

[WhiteLeeopard]

I thought there may be two ways of having no reaction to Nightblood (other than having bonded it). Either to be neither good nor evil, or to have the same amounts of good and evil. Which is not exactly the same. I couldn't help but wonder which of the two it was when for Szeth when I finished WoK. Of course I have found a ton of WoBs and info since then, so I no longer know what to believe where Nightblood is concerned. Other than its awesome and I can't wait to read more about him .

[Naerin]

12 hours ago, The One Who Connects said:

I think you're reading into it too much. We know that characters who survive contact with Nightblood no longer feel the nausea, so there should be some kind of Realmatic "Line" getting crossed as a side effect of holding the sword. I figured that whatever it may be, Szeth's experiences crossed it as well.

That said, it could be on his motivations as you suggest, so good idea at least.

It's also entirely possible that the scene was just written in a way where it cut off at the natural dramatic moment before showing Szeth's reaction, if any. 
That's interesting about a "Realmatic line" though. I hadn't really considered the mechanics of the Nightblood reaction as it were, and Szeth certainly has been "broken" in a number of ways recently (and we know that "breaking" can have a variety of Realmatic consequences/effects), both metaphorical and literal, so his experiences might certainly be the real factor there.