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[OB] Oathbringer chapters 13-15


Mestiv

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18 minutes ago, 17th Splinter said:

5. Parshendi either have new form, or workform

Probably a new form? I don't think workform has carapace at all.

 

Also, literally the thing that caught my attention the most here was that we finally learned that Listeners have very thick strands of hair. Dang. Every time Eshonai said "hair strands" in WoR....I was annoyed. Just say hair Eshonai! But now we know their hair is very differently textured, so. 

I'm a black guy so in my head, I see the Listeners hair as being similar to small plaits or micro braids.

 

Edited by Nymeros
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Regarding Shallan, and multiple personalities. We've seen plenty of examples of the Surges being used physically, in the Physical realm. But I think they can also be used semi- subconsciously. Kaladin has Gravitation, people gravitate to him - Even Elokhar recognizes that he's a natural leader. Dalinar and Kaladin are both leaders and both have Adhesion. 

Shallan is transforming herself, and also lying to herself (illusion) that the transformations aren't just another aspect of herself, but are different. She is the one that practices being Veil, after all.

 

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1 minute ago, Steeldancer said:

Is no one going to pay attention to the whole "if I die, they'll send another one" thing? Is pattern replaceable? 

Is... syl... replaceable?????

This is huge. I thought if you killed a spren, that was IT. But apparently another one would come. That is downright disturbing. 

I imagine it depends on the spren type. Cryptics seemed less emotional about their bonding (more of a test/obligation) while Syl decided to go against orders and bond.

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Just now, Agent34 said:

I imagine it depends on the spren type. Cryptics seemed less emotional about their bonding (more of a test/obligation) while Syl decided to go against orders and bond.

I imagine Dalinar definetly wouldn't be able to do something like that. His spren cares too much about oaths. 

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46 minutes ago, bleeder said:

The Shallan/Adolin stuff is good, though I worry about her taking up too many personas and possibly losing track of who she really is. 

No worries. She'll just imagine up a version of Shallan Radiant who can keep track of them all. If that's too difficult, she can first imagine a version of herself capable of imagining it. Bootstrapping FTW!

 

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1 minute ago, Agent34 said:

I imagine it depends on the spren type. Cryptics seemed less emotional about their bonding (more of a test/obligation) while Syl decided to go against orders and bond.

Exacta. The cryptics planned to create a radiant....they chose Shallan specifically for a reason and Patterns bosses are unlikely to let the matter drop. Syl isn't apart of some spren plan....she just digs Kaladin

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Well, Adolin, this attempt to give a hint to Shallan that the first killer was you, has failed cause of transparency.

Keep trying cause i feel that storm is coming.

Everything is too good for both of you and you are too often say each other that you dont want to screw your relatonships up. I bet you both gonna screw your relationships up.

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2 minutes ago, Steeldancer said:

Is no one going to pay attention to the whole "if I die, they'll send another one" thing? Is pattern replaceable? 

Is... syl... replaceable?????

This is huge. I thought if you killed a spren, that was IT. But apparently another one would come. That is downright disturbing. 

I don't think that's the meaning. Pattern told Shallan that they worked in a group to send him over. He expected to die right from the start it seems. So the Cryptics would presumably pick another Cryptic else to send over but that spren would not be Pattern or like Pattern. Spren might have some kind of hive mind but they are individuals as well. 

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Just now, robardin said:

No worries. She'll just imagine up a version of Shallan Radiant who can keep track of them all. If that's too difficult, she can first imagine a version of herself capable of imagining it. Bootstrapping FTW!

 

Radiant-ception?

Perceptionception?

Personaception? 

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I think my biggest take-aways from these chapters is what @Pagerunneralready mentioned about the similarities between what Shallan is doing, and forging (I specifically thought of Shai during the creation of "Brightness Radiant")

The second is that, as far as I can tell, these new formed Parshmen, while freed of slave form, are still completely unfamiliar with the Rhythms. I'm guessing they can access them, but don't know how. Theres no mention of the cadence of their speech being off. Their voices are indistinguishable from human. 

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19 minutes ago, 17th Splinter said:

Truespren? where is that mentioned?

At Navani and Dalinar's wedding, by the Stormfather

 

Quote

There are no foolish oaths. All are the mark of men and true spren over beasts and subspren. The mark of intelligence, free will, and choice.

The implication, to me, is that all spren capable of forming bonds, or of achieving sapience, are true spren, while everyother spren (life-, rot-, shame-, pain-, rain-, fire-, glory-, etc) are subspren.

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7 minutes ago, 17th Splinter said:

Random thought - What happens when Syl meets the Stormfather? She disobeyed him to bond Kaladin. What happens?

It'll be like in that video by Madonna for "Papa Don't Preach" that ends in a hug.

"But I've made up my mind, I'm keepin' my Radiant"

Edited by robardin
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Just now, Stark said:

At Navani and Dalinar's wedding, by the Stormfather

 

The implication, to me, is that all spren capable of forming bonds, or of achieving sapience, are true spren, while everyother spren (life-, rot-, shame-, pain-, rain-, fire-, glory-, etc) are subspren.

Ohhh. Silly of me to forget that.

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These have been my favorite chapters so far, and Pattern continues to be my favorite spren. 

I was hoping to see more of Veil, but Adolin and Shallan are adorable so I'm fine with waiting another week.

Kaladin keeps the cliffhangers coming, I'm loving where that story is going. So it seems like this group of Listeners is being guided and watched over by a Voidspren, that's so fascinating. And I do think it's a voidspren, the shrill voice and calling those listeners fools doesn't make me think it's one of the good guys.

I expected there to be one or two voidforms in command of a group of non-voidform Listeners. This is really cool though, a free spren can be so much more versatile, as we've seen. 

But now I'm left wondering where it came from. The spren seems very intelligent, so either it's been a while since the spren has crossed over and it has gained sapience through some form of bond, like all the nahel spren do, or there is some mechanism we are not aware of that grants sapience to spren in the physical realm. Maybe it's a critical mass thing, the Stormfather and Nightwatcher are sapient after all, even without being bonded. Either way, I'm very excited about this yellow ribbon. 

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