[OB] Oathbringer chapters 7-9

[king of nowhere]

I would have liked to see more of Laral. She obviosuly grew up into a capable woman. She still have strange ideas, though. I defnnitely want to see more of her. And I wanted to see more of kaladin's parents reaction to all the changes in kaladin. really, most of the reunion was before kaladin started pulling out reveals.

And the new murder in the tower...  adolin being appointed in charge of investigating himself... damnation, brandon did pull put something NOBODY predicted! That's a crazy feat, considering the number of theories that sprout in this forum. What the hell is up with the copycap murder? Also, we can start bets on how long before shallan will find out the truth, and if it will be either adolin to confess, or shallan to figure out. This also complicates matters a lot, because if adolin is now found responsible of kkillling sadeas, everyone will also assume he killed all those other guys.

[flying_shadow]

I really want to see what's going on in Kholinar. There are riots, we know that, but I need all the details!

[flying_shadow]

1 minute ago, king of nowhere said:

What the hell is up with the copycap murder?

I think that it's either a revenge killing, or an attempt to mess with the person who killed Sadeas. Now, if Adolin admits he was the killer, he will also be suspected of any other murders that happened in a similar way because they happened in the exact same way. Or maybe it's just an attempt to destabilize and cause chaos.

[redbishop]

Speculation:  Regarding the murder, my guess is the Ghostbloods.  They knew that Adolin killed Sadeas, and are stirring things up to put pressure on Adolin, which they will use as a lever on Shallan.  During the course of the investigation, Adolin will probably find hints that lead back to Shallan, and lead to an interesting exchange where she distrusts and eventually confronts him as a murderer, while he distrusts and confronts her as an agent for a secret society.

Also, it looks like spanreeds do, in fact, use stormlight.  We also know where the Oathgates are.

[Nymix]

I'd also like to point out that the culprit must be someone who either 1) Discovered Sadeas' body before everyone else did, or 2) Was present upon discover/ with Dalinar's entourage, as only someone who saw the body originally would be able to imitate it. This is gonna be really interesting.

Edited September 12, 2017 by Nymix

[Daishi5]

Kaladin's new chapter was great, it quickly and responsibly settles all of his issues with going home.

 

Dalinar running around intimidating forces of nature, was also great.

[ccstat]

Lots of new and fascinating magical interactions to speculate about. The one that disturbs me most is Shallan's inability to draw Urithiru. Ominous!

Also, I love that she called Kal "Brightlord Brooding-Eyes"

[Lightspine]

Guys I might be going mad but the vibe i got from Renarin is making me think that he's the copycat. I believe he's trying to frame himself for Sadeas' murder to save Adolin. First off, he certainly knows Adolin was the killer. In addition, he was in a position to see Sadeas' body before it was moved.

[Terra of Roshar]

I spent most of these chapters cackling maniacally, because there was just a new awesome thing every few paragraphs. Kaladin criticizing the soldiers' form and them telling Roshone that yeah... they're not messing with this guy. Summoning syl. Spren genders. Kaladin learning to delegate (albeit at Bladepoint). Him CASUALLY FLYING AND PROCLAIMING HIMSELF A RADIANT. And then Shallan... She's been quiet for the last few chapters for exactly the reason I had assumed, poor girl. She calls Kaladin "Brooding Eyes." And she draws surrealism, omg. And that scout wanting her to be a feminist icon. Maybe once Jasnah gets back she'll be happier, given the cover. Unless, of course, Jasnah and Kaladin are gonna be stuck in Alethkar all book. Hopefully there's enough stormlight to get the Kholinar Oathgate open soon. I'm eager to see what's up with Renarin, he clearly knows things, and Dalinar pulling on other Radiants will be interesting. I'm guessing that's his Bondsmith special, like extra squires is for Windrunners. And Adolin being in charge of investigating the murder he committed... He has a terrible poker face and I suspect more people than Shallan and Renarin will notice soon. My immediate thought was that the Ghostbloods were behind the copycat murders, but I saw Ialai mentioned above and she would make sense, too.Oh, and I REALLY hope they get the Azish Gate open soon and meet Lift

[Argent]

Chapter 7: A Watcher at the Rim

Shut up, I did not choke up when Kaladin went all floaty at the end, you choked up!

Chapter 8: A Powerful Lie

Quote

her toes frigid, coldspren growing up like spikes around her

More new spren! Nice!

Also, huh, Shallan can't draw. It looks like something in her brain her gone funky, and that's a little scary.

Quote

Maybe when Brightlord Brooding-Eyes returned, he could fly her to another peak along the mountain chain.

Official new name!

Quote

She was now “Brightness Radiant,” ostensibly from the Order of Elsecallers. She’d persuaded Dalinar to pretend—in public, at least—that Shallan was from an order that couldn’t make illusions.

Interesting. I suppose nobody has seen much of the Radiants' powers, but I wonder if there is someone in the army who knows about the Orders to go "wait a moment, why isn't she, you know, Elsecalling?"

Quote

Much of the stone exposed thin lines of strata.

You know, I feel like we are getting a lot about these lines of strata. Can we get our geology nerds to look into this, see what's weird about them? Could it be that Urithiru was transported from elsewhere, where such lines are more prevalent? 

Quote

He wore his Bridge Four uniform, but had a blanket over his shoulders and was holding a cup of steaming tea, though the room wasn’t particularly cold.

Why are you cold, little Renarin? 

Quote

“Tezim,” Navani said. “Claims he’s an aspect of the Almighty.”

Hey there, Ishar. How's life?

Quote

Dalinar turned toward her, then clasped his hands behind his back. Storms. He always seemed so… large. Bigger than any room he was in, brow perpetually furrowed by the deepest of thoughts. Dalinar Kholin could make choosing what to have for breakfast look like the most important decision in all of Roshar.

Quote

“And to be frank, Brightlord, I think he’s scared of you.”

“Well, he’s obviously not a fool,” Adolin noted.

Dalinar shot his son a glance.

“Don’t be like that, Father,” Adolin said. “If anyone would be able to go about intimidating forces of nature, it would be you.”

:D:D 

Quote

As he passed Shallan, she felt something unusual. A leaping within her, as if part of her were being pulled by him.

Whaddayaknow, it's almost like there is a bond between them. The passage after that makes it look like Bondsmiths can empower other Radiants, which is certainly an interaction I hadn't seen coming. Either that, or we are seeing more of this "knowledge sharing" we saw between Kaladin and Syl, where (Spiritual?) connections can transfer actual knowledge. The tugging is still weird though...

Quote

“The enemy’s champion,” Dalinar said, eyes narrowing. “In the visions, Honor told me our best chance of survival involved forcing Odium to accept a contest of champions. I’ve seen the enemy’s champion—a creature in black armor, with red eyes. A parshman perhaps. It had nine shadows.”

Nearby, Renarin had turned toward his father, eyes wide, jaw dropping. Nobody else seemed to notice.

WHY WON'T ANYONE TALK TO RENARIN ABOUT THIS??? WHY WON'T RENARIN TALK TO ANYONE ABOUT THIS??? 

Quote

“Brightlord, sir. There’s… there’s been another murder.”

Oh, boy. Adolin, dear, I think you may have opened some people's eyes about the countless ambush possibilities in Urithiru. Let's go see what's going on...

Also, Lyn? Was that the... I don't know, we have seen her before, right?

Chapter 9: The Threads of a Screw

Quote

The strata here spiraled, twisting around the floor, ceiling, and walls like the threads of a screw. It was striking enough that Shallan took a Memory of it for later sketching.

This feels like a really weird thing to name a chapter after.

Quote

The dead man lay at the bottom of the cavity. Shallan steeled herself, but even so found the sight nauseating. He lay on his back, and had been stabbed right through the eye. His face was a bloody mess, his clothing disheveled from what looked to have been an extended fight.

Oh, somebody is trying to make this look like Sadeas' murder. As if there is a serial killer around. Storming Ghostbloods...

Quote

The Windrunners needed extra feet, sir

The irony of the Windrunners, the Order famous for flying, needing more feet does not elude me, Brandon. I am onto you.

Quote

As they moved, Shallan felt something prickle at the back of her neck. She shivered, and couldn’t help glancing over her shoulder, hating how this unfathomable building made her feel.

Okay, never mind, there is something else going on. It's not just Shallan's recent trauma that's affecting her, something about Urithiru is messing with her more so than with others. What are you sensing, you ginger...

Quote

Renarin was standing right behind her. She jumped, letting out a pathetic squeak.

Ah. That.

Quote

A few shamespren faded into view around her, floating white and red flower petals. She’d rarely attracted those, which was a wonder. She’d have thought they would take up permanent residence nearby.

Oh, Shallan. <3

Quote

“You want me,” Adolin said, “to investigate who killed Sadeas.”

I can't possibly imagine how this would turn out poorly. 

Quote

She glanced toward Renarin, who still stood up above, on the walkway around the empty pool. He watched Adolin with unblinking sapphire eyes. He was always a little strange, but he seemed to know something she didn’t.

Woah, easy there creeplord. 

Quote

He stalked off, and Shallan hurried after him. Renarin remained in the room, looking down the hall after them until Shallan got far enough away that—over her shoulder—she could no longer see him.

Easy, I said!

[Pammie]

These chapters were great, all of the awkwardness from the first few chapters are gone and the plot is steam-rolling ahead. But since they were mainly plot based, there's not a lot of new material to discuss besides these few nuggets:

• Where the parshment/Voidbringers are gathering and why
• The 'tugging' Shallan experienced from Dalinar that resulted in the light-woven map of places she's never seen
• Shallan's inability to draw Urithiru
• How much Renarin knows about Odium's champion and Adolin's involvement in the murder
• Why no one has thought to ask Renarin ANYTHING. 
• Who the copycat is and why

[Calderis]

OK, gotta say that I love the fact that Kaladin faced his immaturity and calmly took control of the situation before revealing Syl. 

And what I actually found most significant in the Kaladin chapter was that he already thinks of Urithiru as home. He thought that he "couldn't return home" without Stormlight. 

Something is up with Urithiru. Shallan can Navigate it easily by the patterns in the walls... What do you want to bet that it's easily navigable by Radiants and disorienting to normal people? 

Adolin in charge of Sadeas murder investigation is a problem. Whoever performed this second killing knows enough to copy his actions, so perhaps they know he did it. How does he expose the second killer without exposing himself? 

And I believe Renarin already knows what Adolin did. 

[+Extesian]

My usual pre-sleep thought bubbles. haven't read any other comments so apologies if it's redundant

Quote

“It’s your fault for personifying us, so no complaining. Of course, some of the old spren have four genders instead of two.”

“What? Why?”

She poked him in the nose. “Because humans didn’t imagine those ones, silly.” 

Confirmation Listeners pre-dated humans on Roshar

Quote

You need a spanreed? I’ve got one to the queen regent in Kholinar, but that one hasn’t been responsive lately. Fortunately, we do have one to Tashikk, as you asked about. 

Confirmation even little towns had be spanreeds. And what exactly is Laral doing with a spanreed to the queen regent. 

Quote

I know that war is inevitable. I just didn’t want you to have to be a part of it. I’ve seen what it does to men. War flays their souls, and those are wounds I can’t heal.”

Maybe metaphorical but reminds me of the Ten Deaths.

Quote

Down on the plateau, soldiers ran drills. The thought of them all living in that place disturbed Shallan. Which was stupid. It was just a building.

But it was one she couldn’t sketch.

So Urithiru is unsketchable by Shallan. Investiture interfering with investiture?

Quote

Urithiru seemed to have been crafted straight from the rock of a mountain, like a sculpture. Indeed, there weren’t seams at the corners of rooms, nor were there distinct bricks or blocks in the walls. Much of the stone exposed thin lines of strata. Beautiful lines of varied hue, like layers of cloth stacked in a merchant’s shop.

The corridors often twisted about in strange curves, rarely running straight toward an intersection. Dalinar suggested that perhaps this was to fool invaders, like a castle fortification. The sweeping turns and lack of seams made the corridors feel like tunnels.

Shallan didn’t need a guide—the strata that cut through the walls had distinctive patterns. Others seemed to have trouble telling those apart, and talked of painting the floors with guidelines. Couldn’t they distinguish the pattern here of wide reddish strata alternating with smaller yellow ones? Just go in the direction where the lines were sloping slightly upward, and you’d head toward Dalinar’s quarters

I've been convinced rock stratais important since Tien's rock. I remain so. 

Quote

The youth looked even more spindly than normal when standing beside Dalinar, and though his hair wasn’t as blond as Adolin’s, it was still patched with yellow. He seemed such a strange contrast to Dalinar, cut from almost entirely different cloth.

Confirmation Renarin is adopted. 

Quote

Dalinar turned and walked to fetch a cup of wine from a warmed pitcher near the door. As he passed Shallan, she felt something unusual. A leaping within her, as if part of her were being pulled by him.

 

Well I didn’t do it,” Renarin said. “The Stormlight quite certainly came from you, Brightness.”

“Yes, well, your father was tugging on me at the time.”

“Tugging?” Adolin asked.

“The Stormfather,” Dalinar said. “This is his influence—this is what he sees each time a storm blows across Roshar. It wasn’t me or you, but us. Somehow.”

“Well,” Shallan noted, “you were complaining about not being able to take it all in.”

“How much Stormlight did this take?” Navani asked, rounding the outside of the new, vibrant map.

Shallan checked her satchel. “Um… all of it.”

Is this a Bondmith power? I mean Shallan felt compelled to do an illusion and the information in that illusion, the Memory in it, was from the Stormfather through Dalinar. Can a Bondsmith coopt a surge? Can a Bondsmith create some kind of temporary connection with other surgebinders?

Quote

He’s coming. The man with nine shadows…”

“What’s this?” Shallan said, perking up.

“The enemy’s champion,” Dalinar said, eyes narrowing. “In the visions, Honor told me our best chance of survival involved forcing Odium to accept a contest of champions. I’ve seen the enemy’s champion—a creature in black armor, with red eyes. A parshman perhaps. It had nine shadows.”

Nearby, Renarin had turned toward his father, eyes wide, jaw dropping. Nobody else seemed to notice.

So Renarin has seen the champion? Or Renarin knows that's not the champion? Or Renarin is the champion? (Sorry Feather, adopted and Odium's champ, not a good day for you)

Quote

We start small,” Dalinar said, “with a few of the most important to holding the world. Azir. Jah Keved. Thaylenah. We’ll contact other nations, but our focus is on these three powerhouses. Azir for its organization and political clout. Thaylenah for its shipping and naval prowess. Jah Keved for its manpower. 

Did we know jah Keved is the biggest? Sounds so from this. Or biggest army at least

Quote

“How much Stormlight did this take?” Navani asked, rounding the outside of the new, vibrant map.

Shallan checked her satchel. “Um… all of it.”

...

She tried to suck in some Stormlight—but she’d used it all on that blasted map, which had disintegrated into a puff of Light as they’d left.

 So it takes a lot of stormlight and fails when the surgebinder leaves the immediate area. Unless it was dalinar leaving?

Quote

Dalinar walked down the steps to join Navani, trailed by Peet, Lopen, and—remarkably—Rlain of Bridge Four

I HEART YOU SHEN

Quote

She glanced toward Renarin, who still stood up above, on the walkway around the empty pool. He watched Adolin with unblinking sapphire eyes. He was always a little strange, but he seemed to know something she didn’t.

On her skirt, Pattern hummed softly.

Renarin already knows. Awesome. Just how much can this dude see? And apparently Pattern can tell delicious lies from people he's not bound with. Interesting. 

 

All in all i STORMING LOVED EVERY WORD OF THOSE CHAPTERS 

Any more questions?

[Erunion]

@Argent perhaps that's the chapter title because here is where Adolin realizes he's royally screwed? 

(More serious - threads of the screw implies that things are getting tightened up in urithiru) 

 

Adolin investigating himself? Not what he wants to deal with right now. Poor guy, but he's got to confront his problems, his sins as it were. Murder is right there at the top of that list. 

I want to sit down and have a long chat with Renarin.

And poor Shallan could use a break!

[signspace13]

 

On 13/09/2017 at 0:28 AM, Calderis said:

Something is up with Urithiru. Shallan can Navigate it easily by the patterns in the walls... What do you want to bet that it's easily navigable by Radiants and disorienting to normal people? 

I like this! The idea that their is something about the city that confuddles people who can't infuse, it's a good thing they have bridge 4 doing the scouting then.

This could also link up to why Shallan is having trouble drawing it, and why their were so few records of it to begin with, it can't be drawn in a realistic way to prevent the dissemination of maps.

Edited September 16, 2017 by signspace13

[Nymeros]

"....the bridgemen—for all their fine qualities—have no experience with this sort of thing."

Ha! I love Dalinar. He's so patient with Bridge 4 because he recognizes their potential. 

I do love Bridge 4. Cannot wait until they quit searching tunnels and actually get involved.

It seems like Shallan actually learning their names unlike Dalinar and Adolin who just say 'the herdazian' or 'the small azish.'

 

 

It's a shame though that Dalinar doesn't have easy access to an Azish Worldsinger to use when formulating his plans....

Edited September 12, 2017 by Nymeros

[Pagerunner]

Nothing too groundbreaking from a theorizing perspective. It was nice to see that Kaladin realized he was backsliding and stopped (although I would have still preferred he had never done it in the first place). And Adolin investigating his own crime is a fun sequence of events, although for the brief moment where we as the readers may have thought he carried out both murders sent all kinds of possibilities through my heads. But this one will be interesting.

Four genders for spren, from before humans were there, is definitely an allusion to the Listeners. But I thought that spren couldn't achieve a high enough level of sentience with just the Listeners? Or is that referring to only in the Physical Realm?

Shallan's inability to draw Urithiru makes me wonder what is going on in the surrounding CR. Is it fortified against spren incursion, using impossible arrangements like the movie Inception? Or maybe it's a side effect of the Oathgates?

Speaking of Oathgates, our general consensus was only wrong in two areas. We were wrong about the Makabaki Oathgate; I thought for sure it would be in Sesemelax Dar, while it wound up in Azimir. And the Rishir Oathgate is a lot farther west than I thought it would be; it's not in northern Alethkar, it's in easter Rira. My suspicions for the Sela Tales and Iri ones were confirmed, although it really was pretty much a tossup for the former. All we have yet to learn is where the Shin Oathgate is.

[Worldhopper]

17 minutes ago, Argent said:

Chapter 7: A Watcher at the Rim

Shut up, I did not choke up when Kaladin went all floaty at the end, you choked up!

 

One of down sides to reading this at work.

'You ok over there?'

'Yeah, yeah, just these legal documents get me all emotion at times.' 

[Jaconis]

16 minutes ago, Argent said:

WHY WON'T ANYONE TALK TO RENARIN ABOUT THIS??? WHY WON'T RENARIN TALK TO ANYONE ABOUT THIS??? 

Woah, easy there creeplord. 

Yes, Renarin seems pretty creepy and suspicious right now. I really hope he doesn't end up being Odium's champion, if for no other reason that the introvert-awkward-smart-guy-with-glasses-turns-evil thing is a huge trope I hope Brandon avoids. 

I think his actions here perfectly match the very little we know about Truthwatchers from in world Words of Radiance:

Quote

Now, as the Truthwatchers were esoteric in nature, their order being formed entirely of those who never spoke or wrote of what they did, in this lies frustration for those who would see their exceeding secrecy from the outside; they were not naturally inclined to explanation; and in the case of Corberon’s disagreements, their silence was not a sign of an exceeding abundance of disdain, but rather an exceeding abundance of tact.

They know things, but don't talk about it. I have speculated that their abilities involve some form of future sight, and, either as part of that or separate, they can tell when people aren't telling the truth. It would make sense, with either of those powers, to be quiet and generally secretive. I'd be morose and seem creepy too if I knew how everyone around me was going to die. And I wouldn't talk about it either. That knowledge is a burden that people shouldn't need to deal with (ask terminally ill patients how they feel about knowing even their general time and means of death). I also wouldn't want to be someone who constantly was pointing out people's harmless white lies, but would struggle with, say, knowing my brother killed someone, arguably justifiably. Overall it makes for an interesting character to me that we unfortunately just don't get to know much about just yet. 

[Stark]

I'm going to jump into the train of being happy Rlain is still with Bridge Four!

[lordofsoup]

Really glad there was a Kaladin chapter.  I don't think I would have  been able to handle waiting another week to resolve punching Roshone.

The Kaladin and Laral reunion was poorly handled but that's Kal's mo by this point so I shouldn't be surprised.  

Why haven't we been introduced to Mara yet?  Kal mentions that she was in the other room, so he has to have seen her.  She got a name so I thought she would have more impact.  

Also where are Gaz and the rest of Shallan's soldiers?

Edited September 12, 2017 by lordofsoup
Grammar

[Ciridae]

15 minutes ago, Argent said:

Why are you cold, little Renarin? 

I have no idea why but this made me laugh.

So Renarin knows what's up all around. He knows about the champion, he knows about Adolin. Definitely not the last murder either, my money is on either Renarin or the Ghostbloods as well.

Coldspren. Cool. Always fun to get new spren. 

Urithiru is super weird, I don't think it could have been soulcast anymore. It feels like it was grown naturally, maybe cohesion could do it but I'm not sure. The Windblades in Kholinar are described in a similar way, right? 

And I think we may have just seen what the Bondsmith resonance can do, I dig it.

[WhiteLeeopard]

Just read chapter 7, and not seen any comments.

That was awesome. We should have expected coming home to be bittersweet. Ch 6 was sweet, ch 7 bitter.

How much like Lirin to not give a crem worth about the slave brands, only to reject him for the Shardblade.

I knew Syl wouldn't care about the punch!

Huh, wasn't expecting him to be embarrased about it. Come on a KR doesn't mean to stop been human, was just a tiny punch ^^.

He pulled Shardblade as predicted, not ashamed of who he is. Although I'm shocked he didn't burst a gut at been called Brightlord.

Laral...surprised she was happy, but the rest was as expected. 

So! Little brother! I half thought it would be a sister, as sisters are safe from recruitment, would have given more peace to his parents if it were a girl most likely.

Back to reading!

[+robardin]

What a great way to start, a terrific wrap-up for Kaladin's homecoming to Hearthstone.

So Kaladin can "feel" his eyes going light now. Interesting.

So there's something about Bondsmiths can invoke "command performances" of other Radiants' powers?! Whoa.

I can't believe I didn't see that coming: Dalinar appointing Adolin to investigate Sadeas' murder. WHOA.

And a completely unrelated murder, of an ostensibly innocent person, in a style to suggest some kind of serial killer at work in Urithiru? WHOAAAAAA. [Ghostbloods in da house? But why?]

Is this anywhere close to where Adolin ditched Oathbringer, the Shardblade most recently bonded to Sadeas?

Renarin the self-named Truthwatcher seemed to recognize Dalinar's description of Odium's champion... But isn't seeing the future something of Odium? Does he "see" that Adolin killed Sadeas?
 

Edited September 12, 2017 by robardin

[Hero-of-Pages]

I don't know why, but the fact that weapons have spren, and that they gain gender based on perception gives me the feeling that Adolin will be able to awaken his blade.