What's a Seawolf? Posted July 3, 2017 Report Share Posted July 3, 2017 On 7/2/2017 at 8:37 AM, Oversleep said: If you want to kill a planet, I think Hemalurgy will do - just fire a really long spike from the orbit at such an angle so that it comes out, ripping off the Spiritweb. Repeat if necessary. Cosmere Death Star? Hoid as Red 5 in Mistborn Era 4? Sign me up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenod Posted July 3, 2017 Report Share Posted July 3, 2017 18 hours ago, Faceless Mist-Wraith said: Joking aside, if you were going to kill a planet with a shard shovel, wouldn't you have to use the shovel on some vital part of the planet? Normal living things don't die from a shardblade unless you hit something vital like the spine, so I imagine you would have to do something similar with the planet. Also there is the fact that a planet, especially Sel, is super Invested so there may be a chance that it may be able to heal the damage caused to its soul. If it heals faster than you can dig, it may just be impossible to "kill" a planet. If you could calculate the friction a Shardblade undergoes from cutting through the rock, you could probably hook one up to an orbital cannon, use a living blade, give it a good, stable streamlined form, and use some kind of orbital launch system (and maybe gravity), to shoot it right into the core. But a bit more serious (but not by much), I think that the Sel wouldn't really be a living being, but more like an oversized spren, a bit like Nightblood. So we would have to find out how well Shardblades work on cognitive entities. If they do work, we'll also have to get data on the amount of Investure contained in the landscape, to be sure our Shardblade can actually cut through it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanatos Posted July 3, 2017 Report Share Posted July 3, 2017 So if the landscape around Sel is becoming sentient, would its sentience eventually expand to the whole planet. If so could it travel the Cosmere like the moon in The Expanse tv show? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrikerEZ Posted July 3, 2017 Report Share Posted July 3, 2017 1 minute ago, Thanatos said: So if the landscape around Sel is becoming sentient, would its sentience eventually expand to the whole planet. If so could it travel the Cosmere like the moon in The Expanse tv show? Well, Sel is the name of the entire planet. Hmmm...I don't know that show, but I'm gonna say no, probably not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanatos Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 (edited) Sorry i ment landscape around Elantris. Edited July 4, 2017 by Thanatos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fezzik Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 1 hour ago, Thanatos said: Sorry i ment landscape around Elantris. The entire planet's landscape is already invested. Dakhor bones resemble their landscape, and stamps resemble mai pon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanatos Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 I think its insinuated that its the landscape around Elantris thats becoming sentient. Due to the crack that caused the aons to stop working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrikerEZ Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 4 minutes ago, Thanatos said: I think its insinuated that its the landscape around Elantris thats becoming sentient. Due to the crack that caused the aons to stop working. No, the WoB specifies that the entire planet is becoming sentient, due to so much Investiture being shoved in the CR of Sel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One Who Connects Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 1 minute ago, Thanatos said: I think its insinuated that its the landscape around Elantris that's becoming sentient. Due to the crack that caused the Aons to stop working. Not exactly. Quote AARON So the Reod is a natural reaction to an unnatural occurrence. BRANDON SANDERSON Yes. JOSH And wasn’t it because there was like magical strain on the land? BRANDON SANDERSON That is certainly part of what was going on. The quake causing the Reod was unnatural, but the magical strain was only part of what was going on. I feel that the strain is planet-wide, as the cognitive(where the Investiture is) is planet-wide. That strain only being part of it implies there was something else going on. Khriss only says that the "landscape" is becoming sentient, right after talking about the CR. I'm inclined to take that assumption at face value. And ninja'd by Striker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 According to the AU essay that I typed out, @StrikerEZand The One Who Connects are correct. It talks about the magics of Sel, which are multitude. It doesn't specifically mention Elantris or Aons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanatos Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 If it was the planet then they would say that. All landscape talk in Elantis relates to the Aons. Chapter 49. He studied Aon after Aon, noticing other features of the landscape in their forms. Aon Eno, the character for water, included a wiggling line that matched the meanderings of the Aredel River. The character for wood—Aon Dii—included several circles that represented the southern forests. The Aons were maps of the land, each one a slightly different rendering of the same general picture. Each one had the three basic lines—the coast line, the mountain line, and the dot for Lake Alonoe. Many often had a line at the bottom to represent the Kalomo River, which separated Arelon from Duladel. Some of the features completely baffled... Chapter 53. ..."The Chasm,” Spirit explained. “It caused the Reod. It was enough of a change in the landscape that its presence needs to be reflected in the Aons." The power of Aons is related to the landscape of surrounding Elantris. I have not seen any insinuation about it being the whole planet. Just the local landscape of Elantris. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One Who Connects Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 Just now, Thanatos said: If it was the planet then they would say that. All landscape talk in Elantris relates to the Aons. All the talk in the book is about the land around Elantris. However, all talk about the sentient landscape is outside of the book. Quote This overlap between language, location, and magic on the planet has become so integral to the system that subtle changes in one can have profound effects on how the Dor is accessed. Indeed, I believe that the very landscape itself has become Invested to the point that it has a growing self-awareness, in a way unseen on other planets in the Cosmere. Khriss pulls the planetary comparison, not other regions, but other planets. As I said earlier about face value, the face value of this is that the planet is becoming self-aware. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 3 minutes ago, Thanatos said: If it was the planet then they would say that. All landscape talk in Elantis relates to the Aons. Chapter 49. He studied Aon after Aon, noticing other features of the landscape in their forms. Aon Eno, the character for water, included a wiggling line that matched the meanderings of the Aredel River. The character for wood—Aon Dii—included several circles that represented the southern forests. The Aons were maps of the land, each one a slightly different rendering of the same general picture. Each one had the three basic lines—the coast line, the mountain line, and the dot for Lake Alonoe. Many often had a line at the bottom to represent the Kalomo River, which separated Arelon from Duladel. Some of the features completely baffled... Chapter 53. ..."The Chasm,” Spirit explained. “It caused the Reod. It was enough of a change in the landscape that its presence needs to be reflected in the Aons." The power of Aons is related to the landscape of surrounding Elantris. I have not seen any insinuation about it being the whole planet. Just the local landscape of Elantris. And Elantris deal only with the Aons. The Emporor's soul mentions that the central part of a soulstamp looks like MaiPon. This is a planet wide phenomenon, tied to why all of the magic systems are location dependant. It isn't just Elantris. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanatos Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 (edited) Kriss relating the landscape to other planets confirms it. If the planet was becoming self aware then she would say Sel is becoming self aware in a way unseen on other planets. Not landscape. Its not been confirmed yet by Brandon if its the landscape or planet. So happy to agree to disagree. No biggy. ...edit. Landscape definition. all the visible features of an area of land, often considered in terms of their aesthetic appeal. . its just an area of land. Not the whole planet Edited July 4, 2017 by Thanatos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 2 minutes ago, Thanatos said: Kriss relating the landscape to other planets confirms it. If the planet was becoming self aware then she would say Sel is becoming self aware in a way unseen on other planets. Not landscape. Its not been confirmed yet by Brandon if its the landscape or planet. So happy to agree to disagree. No biggy. The "landscape" is the surface of the planet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Extesian Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 Let me interject here. I think the distinction is in Sel's regionalisation. Yeah, the landscape is the surface of the planet and the surface of the planet is the landscape. But there are regional variations as we know through the different magic systems. The distinction between landscape and planet is, I think, that the entire planet isn't gaining a single sentience, but the landscapes in the different regions are gaining sentience of their own. I'm not saying this is certain, but it does bridge those two diverging views on what Khriss is saying. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 3 minutes ago, Extesian said: Let me interject here. I think the distinction is in Sel's regionalisation. Yeah, the landscape is the surface of the planet and the surface of the planet is the landscape. But there are regional variations as we know through the different magic systems. The distinction between landscape and planet is, I think, that the entire planet isn't gaining a single sentience, but the landscapes in the different regions are gaining sentience of their own. I'm not saying this is certain, but it does bridge those two diverging views on what Khriss is saying. Thank you. It's a distinction I took for granted, but needed to be said. So yes there's a sentience developing for each area, not just the one specific to Arelon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanatos Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 Just in case it was missed when i edited my post. Landscape definition. all the visible features of an area of land, often considered in terms of their aesthetic appeal. . its just an area of land. Not the whole planet 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One Who Connects Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 4 minutes ago, Thanatos said: its just an area of land. Not the whole planet As whomever downvoted you likely thinks, a planet is an area of land. Case in point, "the martian landscape." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Thanatos said: Just in case it was missed when i edited my post. Landscape definition. all the visible features of an area of land, often considered in terms of their aesthetic appeal. . its just an area of land. Not the whole planet I understand the definition. But she says the Landscape of Sel. Not the Landscape of Elantris. Or the Landscape of Arelon. The Regional magic systems are tied to the phenomenon causing the landscape to develop sentience. This means where there is a Magic system, there is a sentient landscape tied to it. This means, a sentient Landscape for AonDor, Dahkor, Forging, ChayShan, and any other magic systems we haven't seen. And with an entire unseen continent on Sel, there are ones we probably haven't seen. Edit: and as much as I disagree with the statement, there's nothing offensive in what was stated. We shouldn't be down voting for differences in opinion. Edited July 4, 2017 by Calderis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrikerEZ Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 @Thanatos I upvoted you, because I agree with what @Calderis said. Just because you have a different theory than what is generally accepted does not mean you deserve to be downvoted. But I do think that you're taking the use of the word landscape a little too seriously here. I can definitely see each region/magic system have it's own sentience, but I'm a proponent of the theory that all of Sel is gaining sentience, not just the area around Elantris. Of course, whether this is due to each region gaining sentience or the entire planet itself gaining sentience is not explicitly confirmed, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanatos Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 Its all good. I dont come here for up or down votes. Doesnt come into my notice so not worried about it. Im happy to agree to disagree until we get a WoB or confirmation from a new book. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Extesian Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 (edited) I don’t like talking about who I upvote (or very occasionally downvote). But I will explain why I downvoted Thanatos. It wasn’t because of his opinion, or because of asking questions – those things are non-judgement-zone matters and in fact, for newer members, I’ll regularly upvote basic questions that show some insight. I’ve upvoted one of Thanatos’ other posts on this very thread. My downvote wasn’t designed to punish, or criticise a different view. It was simply because he (?) asked questions, got quite a large number of insightful comments and suggestions, and instead of acknowledging any of it, he just repeated a dictionary definition he put up earlier. I think people lose sight of the fact that upvotes and downvotes are supposed to be a system that represents, as a whole, how useful your posts are to other members. I’m not sure I’ve ever gotten a downvote and if I do I’ll probably be a bit cut. In fact, I expect I’ll get a couple of downvotes for this post, for admitting to a downvote that people disagreed with. But that’s ok. The point was only that I do find it a bit rude to have people go to the effort of addressing a question then disregard the answers and simply repeat yourself. I have no problem with Thanatos having a different opinion, I just had a problem with that approach. But then I’m also quite sensitive about politeness and debate (rather than blanket statements) so maybe I’m the chull-lord here. So @Thanatos I hope it didn’t make you feel like your contribution isn’t welcome. If it did, I apologize for downvoting you rather than simply PMing or directing a comment your way. You ask some good questions on here and post some interesting ideas. And I appreciate your mature, zen comment you've just posted. I actually am feeling like a bit of a cremling now. And that’s the last I’ll say on it, I feel a bit uncouth talking about rep in a serious way. I just wanted to make sure I hadn’t offended, and if I had to apologize for my approach! Edited July 4, 2017 by Extesian 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 (edited) @Extesian sorry. I understand the rationale. @Thanatos I don't expect this to change your opinion, but with the knowledge shown, you're asking at this point for an explicit WoB. In that Essay Kriss says the the landscape and the magic are interconnected. We know the Aons are shaped to mimic Arelon. We know from The Emporor's Soul, that Soulstamps contain the shape of MaiPon. We know (I don't remember the source, I'll look for it) that Dahkor bone patterns look like Fjordell runes, which with the other information means those runes incorporate the shape of Fjordell. On Sel, Language and the landscape are interconnected, just like landscape and the magic systems. Under that logic, if the landscape that effects AonDor is sentient, the landscape associated with the others should be as well. It's all or nothing. If the Chasm had formed in MaiPon, Soulstamps would have stopped working correctly. We have all the information we need to understand this problem. Edited July 4, 2017 by Calderis 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanatos Posted July 4, 2017 Report Share Posted July 4, 2017 (edited) Cool thanks for the comments. Just a heads up, i do read all but im on a mobile and usually at work in my 5min smoke breaks when responding. So i dont have time to respond to all comments. Edited July 4, 2017 by Thanatos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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