Does Each Shard Have Only One Pependicularity?

[Khyrindor]

Quick question. It seems fairly accepted or assumed within the fandom that each Shard has only one Shardpool. Granted, we've only seen one per Shard thus far, but it seems likely to me that there are a lot more on each planet. I was just wondering if Brandon has confirmed it himself that there's only one per Shard at some point that i just can't find. Thanks.

[Pagerunner]

No confirmation, as far as I'm aware. In fact, you can make a decent case that Harmony has two because of the Shadows of Self broadsheet. We see a Southerner exiting a northern Shardpool; how did he get to the Cognitive Realm to begin with? The simplest answer, they have a Shardpool in the south as well. We've also only seen god metals near Shardpools (lerasium at the Well, atium at the Pits above the dark lake), so it's reasonable to suggest the Southerners need a Shardpool to get their harmonium.

I think when you parse Rock's description of the Horneater Peaks, you get multiple Shardpools underneath the lakes, as well, but I may be misremembering.

Lastly, we know of three Perpendicularities on Roshar: one in the Purelake, one in the Horneater pools, and Honor's, which is mobile. Odium isn't on Roshar; he's on Braize. So, either one of the Shardpools is his (and it's just on a different planet than he is), or we have multiple Shardpool associated with Cultivation.

[The One Who Connects]

@Pagerunner Was there one in the Purelake? I thought the lake itself was described both as "not very deep" and that "the waters recede when Highstorms go through/are near."

I might be forgetting something, but I don't remember there being a pool near the lake.

[Yata]

10 hours ago, Pagerunner said:

No confirmation, as far as I'm aware. In fact, you can make a decent case that Harmony has two because of the Shadows of Self broadsheet. We see a Southerner exiting a northern Shardpool; how did he get to the Cognitive Realm to begin with? The simplest answer, they have a Shardpool in the south as well. We've also only seen god metals near Shardpools (lerasium at the Well, atium at the Pits above the dark lake), so it's reasonable to suggest the Southerners need a Shardpool to get their harmonium.

The Lerasium wasn't there. Rashek had to search and find It.

About the North and south perpendkcularities...The clues are really doubtful. we know there is at least a Southern descend worldhopper...Maybe someone of this group was Simply returning to Scadrial.

[Pagerunner]

6 hours ago, Yata said:

The Lerasium wasn't there. Rashek had to search and find It.

I think I know the WoB you're referring to. It doesn't address location; it says Rashek didn't create the lerasium beads, and Leras didn't create it for Rashek. Other sources indicate he didn't take all the lerasium he found, so what he left behind (that Hoid and Elend took) must have come from the Well originally.

[Khyrindor]

@Yata, are you of the opinion that there is only one per planet then?

 

I'm personally partial to the idea that there's more than one per Shard, because Brandon has described Perpendicularities as large build-ups of Investiture that kind of make the border between the Three Realms more fuzzy. If that's true, then there is probably a Shardpool or something similar for each city of Spren on Roshar, for example, or each place on Sel that is important to a magical location (like Elantris) where there is likely to be huge build-ups of the Dor. Shardpools might be something different, but there must be more Perpendicularities.

[+Extesian]

4 hours ago, Khyrindor said:

@Yata, are you of the opinion that there is only one per planet then?

 

I'm personally partial to the idea that there's more than one per Shard, because Brandon has described Perpendicularities as large build-ups of Investiture that kind of make the border between the Three Realms more fuzzy. If that's true, then there is probably a Shardpool or something similar for each city of Spren on Roshar, for example, or each place on Sel that is important to a magical location (like Elantris) where there is likely to be huge build-ups of the Dor. Shardpools might be something different, but there must be more Perpendicularities.

I feel like there's many perpendicularities that form but only one 'Shardpool' per Shard. Elsecallers use perpendicularities to transport so I wouldn't be surprised if there are small perpendicularities, stable or temporary, that could form in places with high concentrations of investiture. But I think a Shard only has (or would only typically have) one Perpendicularity, at least per planet, based on this WoB.

Quote

QUESTION

Is it possible that someone could have gotten to the Cognitive Realm on Scadrial without the Well of Ascension?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Yes.

QUESTION

...Can we know how?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Well, how many Shardpools would Scadrial have?

QUESTION

Two, so the Pits of Hathsin would be so?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Yes. So you’ve adopted the term “Shardpool.” That was never really my term, but I’ve started using it. What happens with a Perpendicularity is large concentrations of Investiture, particularly purely attuned to one of the Shards, will create an access point. You’ve seen another one--

QUESTION

Yeah, yeah I know these.

BRANDON SANDERSON

You know which one I’m referencing?

QUESTION

Yes.

BRANDON SANDERSON

That you didn’t see a Pool from?

QUESTION

Oh wait… [Laughter]

BRANDON SANDERSON

Okay, he knows, so… We’ll move on.

QUESTION

Why??!! [general protest, laughter]

BRANDON SANDERSON

Okay, fine. Umm, at the end of Words of Radiance.

ARGENT

There has to be one there because Jasnah has to leave somehow, right?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Yes, but Honor’s Perpendicularity moves.

QUESTION

Woah...so...Highstorm?

BRANDON SANDERSON

[hems and haws]

QUESTION

So, I don’t know if this is a RAFO sort of question, but you call them Perpendicularities, will we see this sort of thing created?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Yeah, Perpendicularities can be created. You’d need a ton of Investiture. But, basically what Jasnah does is create a little mini Perpendicularity and slips herself into the Cognitive Realm.

QUESTION

So it’s just a question of skill, not a question of--

BRANDON SANDERSON

Yeah. It’s hard to pull off...but some of the powers are built to do it.

Source

Thetext in bold is not conclusive but makes it sound like there is only one per Shard. Of course he could just be talking about a minimum ninety. I picture it as a Shard mostly being on other realms but their presence in the physical realm can only be in one physical place, and that's where the perpendicularity forms, so only one per Shard according to where they started investing in the physical realm. But then anywhere there are local intense manifestations of investiture they can form. Those are from a Shard's power but are not the Shardpool (I know it's not his term but it's useful to distinguish, if that idea is right).

[Yata]

As far as we could extrapolate from the text. There is a single Perpendicularity as a result of a specific Shard investiment into a specific Shardworld.

This mean in a Planet with n stable Shards. You will find n Perpendicularities. One for every Shard.

This don't remove the possibility for other Perpendicularities to be there, High concentration of Investiture could bent and spikes the Realms but they are not at the level of a Shardpool Perpendicularity (for example the First of the Sun's One)

Some weirdness could happen but mostly this is the mechanism to me.

Harmony's case is weird because depending of the merging state of R&P he could have one Harmony's Perpendicularity or a couple of R&P's Perpendicularities.

[Full Metal Rithmatist]

On 07/04/2017 at 7:41 PM, Pagerunner said:

No confirmation, as far as I'm aware. In fact, you can make a decent case that Harmony has two because of the Shadows of Self broadsheet. We see a Southerner exiting a northern Shardpool; how did he get to the Cognitive Realm to begin with? The simplest answer, they have a Shardpool in the south as well. We've also only seen god metals near Shardpools (lerasium at the Well, atium at the Pits above the dark lake), so it's reasonable to suggest the Southerners need a Shardpool to get their harmonium.

I think when you parse Rock's description of the Horneater Peaks, you get multiple Shardpools underneath the lakes, as well, but I may be misremembering.

Lastly, we know of three Perpendicularities on Roshar: one in the Purelake, one in the Horneater pools, and Honor's, which is mobile. Odium isn't on Roshar; he's on Braize. So, either one of the Shardpools is his (and it's just on a different planet than he is), or we have multiple Shardpool associated with Cultivation.

Would be cool if harmonys perpendicularity ran all the way through the center of scadrial down its axis

Edited April 18, 2017 by Full Metal Rithmatist

[RonaldinhoReagan]

But on Sel, isn't the magic (the Dor) really a combination of both Dominion and Devotion being splintered? I don't see the pool from Elantris as specific to either Shard, and don't know of any other perpendicularities on Sel. Scadrial with the Well and the Pits of Hathsin I believe is the only world (at least Era 1) that has perpendicularities that are blatantly attuned to one specific Shard.

[Yata]

36 minutes ago, RonaldinhoReagan said:

But on Sel, isn't the magic (the Dor) really a combination of both Dominion and Devotion being splintered? I don't see the pool from Elantris as specific to either Shard, and don't know of any other perpendicularities on Sel. Scadrial with the Well and the Pits of Hathsin I believe is the only world (at least Era 1) that has perpendicularities that are blatantly attuned to one specific Shard.

Unless the pools are removed, Devotion and Dominion's pool have to be still on Sel. You may notice also that Roshar has at least two Perpendicularities. On Nalthis the thing is right, because only Endowment is there

Edited April 18, 2017 by Yata

[+Extesian]

6 hours ago, Yata said:

Unless the pools are removed, Devotion and Dominion's pool have to be still on Sel. You may notice also that Roshar has at least two Perpendicularities. On Nalthis the thing is right, because only Endowment is there

Yara is right, the perpendicularities will still be there unless something happened to remove them.

Quote

QUESTION

I asked him what happens to the perpendicularity when a Shard dies.

BRANDON SANDERSON

He said that if the Shard's power is still there, even without a consciousness, the perpendicularity still work fine, but there are other ways of destroying them

If a Shard divests the perpendicularity will disappear (without something to keep it) but Devotion and Dominion did not divest, their Vessels were killed.

The Dor is an amalgam magic system but the Shards are not combined like Harmony. It's more like feruchemy as far as I know, a system made from the joined investiture of two separate Shards.

[Jondesu]

On 4/18/2017 at 1:48 PM, RonaldinhoReagan said:

But on Sel, isn't the magic (the Dor) really a combination of both Dominion and Devotion being splintered? I don't see the pool from Elantris as specific to either Shard, and don't know of any other perpendicularities on Sel. Scadrial with the Well and the Pits of Hathsin I believe is the only world (at least Era 1) that has perpendicularities that are blatantly attuned to one specific Shard.

It's confirmed (I believe) that there is a Perpendicularity on the top of the Horneater Peaks (which we could fairly safely assume from the in-book information anyways) as well as a "mobile" Perpendicularity belonging to Honor, which many of us assume is in the highstorms, though there may be other possibilities.

On Sel, I suspect the second Shardpool is in the area where Jaddeth is said to be imprisoned, or perhaps in another part of the world entirely with a civilization we haven't yet seen.  The Skaze are confirmed splinters of Dominion while the Seons are splinters of Devotion, so there are still some separate parts of them, even though the Dor itself is an amalgamation of both (and certainly could be argued to perhaps be merging into a single Shard, a theory I like).