Focus Theory

[Yezrien]

I'm probably oversimplifying some pretty complex issues here, and retreading some old ground. But, as I understand it, all end-positive magic systems in the Cosmere are basically this thing:

It's called the Fun Factory(tm). You put your Play-Doh(tm) underneath the red flap, then you push the flap down. The pressure forces the Play-Doh through a hole, extruding it into a funny shape.

The blob of Play-Doh that goes into it? That's your investiture source. Preservation. Stormlight. The Dor. It's raw Shardic power. Formless and without specific function.

The Fun Factory is you. The Allomancer, or Surgebinder, or Elantrian. You draw that raw, amorphous power into your body, and you turn it into something direct and specific. A force of repulsion against metal. 'Awesomeness' that reduces friction. A light source, or a deadly fireball.

But what's that blue thing? That's the hole that your Play-Doh is extruded through. And you can swap it out for a different one. This is the piece that determines what shape your Play-Doh takes. In allomancy, this would be your metal. Each metal produces a different effect, channeling your Preservation-power into a different magical ability. In AonDor, it's the Aons themselves. Which Aon you draw determines the magic. It's the same in Forgery, Dakhor, and ChayShan. All across Sel, it's the shape you make that determines your magical action.

On Nalthis, it's about the command. Every awakened object does something different, because each is given a different command.

Metals. Shapes/forms. Commands. This blue thing... is the focus.

So really, I think this is the definition of focus: It's the element of a magic system that determines the magical effect, or the precise action of investiture. It's the category whose internal variation corresponds to the versatility of the magic system as a whole.

(Here's the WoB that backs this up: http://www.theoryland.com/intvsresults.php?kw=allomancy+aon)

Which brings us, inevitably, to the question of Roshar.

A common theory (endorsed by the Coppermind) is that gemstones are Roshar's focus, because Surgebinders and fabrials both rely on gemstones. But my definition disagrees. Kaladin can draw stormlight from any gemstone (or from a non-gem source), and his powers always remain the same. Whether he uses emerald broams or diamond chips, flying is still flying. Lift, notably, doesn't need gems at all.

To find the focus, look for what distinguishes one type of magic from another. What distinguishes an Adhesion-binder from a Transformation-binder? I think there's only one logical answer. 

It's the spren.

Each surgebinder-type bonds with a different spren. Sure, some spren offer overlapping surges, but the basic fact remains: the magic you can do is determined by the spren you bond. The metal you burn. The Aon you draw. The command you give.

And fabrials? Fabrials  use specific gemstones because specific gemstones trap specific spren.

The real exception to this is the Honorblades, which provide surgebinder-bonds, but are not spren.

Or are they?

They look and behave exactly like ordinary shardblades. Bonding, summoning, cutting. They're not self-aware, like spren are, but they're clearly the same type of entity: splinters. Objects made of investiture. Honor's investiture, which seems to be inherently bond-forming, whether it's sentient or not.

So the focus isn't spren, exactly. It's bond-forming splinters -- a category which consists almost entirely of spren, but also includes the Honorblades. 

This opens up some interesting speculations of Voidbinding. Is it done by bonding different spren, i.e. Voidspren? Or is it like on Scadrial, where different magic systems use the same foci? Maybe Voidbinding is just surgebinding, but with a different power source. Maybe Kaladin could intake the 'voidlight' from the mysterious black sphere, and access a new power-set. 

 

Spoiler

As for Taldain... I'd prefer not to speculate. To be honest, I've found Taldain a lot less interesting since Qui-Gon Khriss explained that sandmastery comes from microorganisms.

 

[Hemalurgic Headshot]

That's nice. I'm a Fun Factory.

[Oversleep]

Have a look at that topic where I argue furiously that spren are indeed Roshar's focus:

Hva efun.

[Valtak]

So, using your analogies, using allomancy to fuel feruchemy would be like lining up two fun factories nozzle to nozzle (one representing allomancy, one representing feruchemy), with the same blue attachment on each one, putting a big ole blob of Play-Doh (preservation investiture) in one (the allomancy one), and squeezing it directly through into the other one (the feruchemy one).

Since they both have the same nozzle (for example, gold) the investiture can be stored directly in the feruchemical store. The Play-Doh fits the key perfectly to go into the second fun factory while coming out of the first fun factory. That's why you can compound to dump incredible stores of health into a gold metalmind, even though seeing past selves has nothing to do with healing. You just keyed the power the right way.

You are "cheating" because the feruchemy fun factory isn't supposed to be able to get supplied with extra play doh. You have one can, and only one can, and you are supposed to push it in through the nozzle bit by bit, until you need it, and then you can squeeze it all out at once using the red handle. With compounding, you can grab as many cans of play doh as you want and force it on in there with your handy second fun factory.

Edited January 27, 2017 by Valtak

[Valtak]

Also, I agree with your theory that it has to do with the spren. 

The focus is what shapes what the power becomes. If the focus is even slightly off, you can get different (sometimes disastrous) effects.

On Sel, a single line on your focus is the difference between an elantrian and someone suffering from the Shaod. On Scadrial, having your allomantic alloy off by a few percent is the difference between allomantic power and sickness or death.

Now, what does this have to do with Roshar? Well, Brandon has said that the surgebinding granted to the knights radiant is the result of spren imitating what Honor did to make the Honorblades and grant the heralds their powers. He has also said that the powers the Radiants have are not exactly the same as the ones the heralds of their orders have. Slight differences exist. This is totally in line with your theory - the spren are imitating the focus that they see Honor having created in the honorblades, but it isn't a perfect imitation. It's damnation close, so the powers are super similar, but not a perfect copy.

In Selish terms, it would be like a new elantrian copying an Aon he saw a veteran elantrian draw, and making a miniscule error that weakened the power of his magic. 

So, this rationale has me totally believing your theory.

*Edit* is there some strange thing on this forum that replaces "damnation" with "damnation"? I keep editing to fix it and it won't take.

*Edit 2* Ha! Apparently there is.

Edited January 27, 2017 by Valtak

[Oversleep]

6 minutes ago, Valtak said:

*Edit* is there some strange thing on this forum that replaces "damnation" with "damnation"? I keep editing to fix it and it won't take.

We have curse words filter which changes them into Cosmere swears (mostly Rosharan ones). F-word becomes storm/storming, A-word becomes chull, S-word becomes rust etc

Edited January 27, 2017 by Oversleep

[Valtak]

1 minute ago, Oversleep said:

We have curse words filter which changes them into Cosmere swears (mostly Rosharan ones). F-word becomes storm, A-word becomes chull etc

Ha, I love it. I'm still very new here, just learning all of these quirks.

[Hemalurgic Headshot]

55 minutes ago, Oversleep said:

We have curse words filter which changes them into Cosmere swears (mostly Rosharan ones). F-word becomes storm/storming, A-word becomes chull, S-word becomes rust etc

That's interesting. I don't swear, so I haven't seen it first hand. On the other hand, if you see me throwing around "storms" or "storming", don't freak out, I just like Rosharan curses.

[Oversleep]

3 minutes ago, Hemalurgic_Headshot said:

That's interesting. I don't swear, so I haven't seen it first hand. On the other hand, if you see me throwing around "storms" or "storming", don't freak out, I just like Rosharan curses.

By now people are just typing Rosharan words.

Another cool thing the filter does is that when you type a/f + metal it changes to Allomantic/Feruchemical metal. It's a nice shortcut: for example, just type asilver and you get Allomantic silver (I used silver as example since it doesn't work).

[Spoolofwhool]

I've always taken surgebinding to be end-neutral because you have to gather the stormlight then use it, like awakening. No matters.

Good write-up. Makes sense. Playdoh was fun to play with when I was a kid, not to eat though. Not everyone can eat rocks like a horneater. 

I've known spren are the important aspect of the manifestations of Roshar for awhile, but mentioning gemstones just made be think of something. Conjoined fabrials, like spanreeds, operate by taking a gem then splitting it in two. Does this mean you're splitting a spren in two, or are there two spren that are linked? Weird thought. Storming weird.  

2 hours ago, Belzedar said:

This opens up some interesting speculations of Voidbinding. Is it done by bonding different spren, i.e. Voidspren? Or is it like on Scadrial, where different magic systems use the same foci? Maybe Voidbinding is just surgebinding, but with a different power source. Maybe Kaladin could intake the 'voidlight' from the mysterious black sphere, and access a new power-set. 

Brandon has referred to voidbinding as a different system so I feel like it's definitely separate. 

[Yezrien]

23 hours ago, Spoolofwhool said:

I've always taken surgebinding to be end-neutral because you have to gather the stormlight then use it, like awakening. No matters.

I'm pretty sure it's end-positive, because stormlight isn't part of the surgebinder. It's an external power source that you draw upon, like Preservation for Allomancers. The difference is that Preservation is easier to access, probably because it hasn't been splintered -- or because Scadrians have an unusually intimate attunement to Preservation, having been created (and invested) by it. 

I think any system where the body absorbs investiture is end-positive. If it loses investiture, it's end-negative. If it loses some, and then gains it back without loss, that's end-neutral. (If you gain some, and then lose the same amount, that's technically end-neutral, because the net gain/loss is zero... but then Allomancy would be end-neutral. So I think we have to define that as end-positive.)

On 1/26/2017 at 7:53 PM, Oversleep said:

Have a look at that topic where I argue furiously that spren are indeed Roshar's focus:.

Yeah, I figured a lot of these ideas had been posited before. And you hit the nail (Nale?) on the head with this:

Quote

Anyway, how do I see magic:

Investiture -> focus -> effect

I'd like to think my Playdoh theory unifies some older ideas. Connecting hypotheses with evidence.

Edited January 28, 2017 by Belzedar

[Jondesu]

That's an amazing analogy that fits very well with what we know and have theorized. Great job!

[Fezzik]

@Belzedar Did you mean

22 hours ago, Belzedar said:

 I think any system where the body absorbs investiture is end-positive. If it loses investiture, it's end-neutral. If it loses some, and then gains it back without loss, that's end-neutral. 

For if it looses investiture, it's end-negative?

[Yezrien]

@john203 Yep. Correction made! Thanks!

[QuantumSpren]

I really like this theory, but some surgebinding (like soulcasting) does depend on the gemstone. As this does not effect most surges, I tend to agree with you that the focus is spren, it's just interesting that there is this exception.

[Fezzik]

Certain gemstones capture certain spren, so I would imagine soulcasting requires not the gemstones specifically, but the spren they contain.

[Jondesu]

1 hour ago, john203 said:

Certain gemstones capture certain spren, so I would imagine soulcasting requires not the gemstones specifically, but the spren they contain.

I think it's indicated that Soulcasters don't require trapped spren in the gems (part of why they haven't managed to replicate them). There's more to them, though.

[Oversleep]

10 hours ago, Jondesu said:

That's an amazing analogy that fits very well with what we know and have theorized. Great job!

You know that Brandon used that very analogy when first explaining magic to us?

[Blightsong]

When ever people bring up focuses I want to point this out. Brandon has said that focuses are an in universe method of an attempt at understanding the mechanics of magic systems, their may not be similar parallels in all magic systems.

[Pagerunner]

Here's a WoB you might find relevant.

[+Extesian]

48 minutes ago, Pagerunner said:

Here's a WoB you might find relevant.

Doesn't get much more relevant! So more than being a focus, it's kind of a filter, which I guess applies to the systems on Scadrial (through metals), Roshar (through spren) and Sel (through Aons/soulstone/Dakhor bone shapes). Then I guess the systems on Nalthis and Taldain don't have those filters but instead use something local to activate the flow of investiture (color, water from the body) and intent to give command to what the investiture does. 

[+hwiles]

On 1/26/2017 at 7:56 PM, Valtak said:

So, using your analogies, using allomancy to fuel feruchemy would be like lining up two fun factories nozzle to nozzle (one representing allomancy, one representing feruchemy), with the same blue attachment on each one, putting a big ole blob of Play-Doh (preservation investiture) in one (the allomancy one), and squeezing it directly through into the other one (the feruchemy one).

Since they both have the same nozzle (for example, gold) the investiture can be stored directly in the feruchemical store. The Play-Doh fits the key perfectly to go into the second fun factory while coming out of the first fun factory. That's why you can compound to dump incredible stores of health into a gold metalmind, even though seeing past selves has nothing to do with healing. You just keyed the power the right way.

You are "cheating" because the feruchemy fun factory isn't supposed to be able to get supplied with extra play doh. You have one can, and only one can, and you are supposed to push it in through the nozzle bit by bit, until you need it, and then you can squeeze it all out at once using the red handle. With compounding, you can grab as many cans of play doh as you want and force it on in there with your handy second fun factory.

This is without a doubt the most intelligent, simple, and intuitive explanation of how and why compounding works that I've yet encountered.  Simply excellent, I'd upvote it twice if I could.

[cometaryorbit]

Great explanation of focuses!

As for Roshar, though... I am sort of falling on the side of "gems are the focus", but only sort of. I think Surgebinding is weird.

On Scadrial, metals are clearly the focus. But Vin could burn mists to get Allomantic effects without using any actual metal -- and then Elend did the same thing with power given to him directly by Vin-as-Preservation. So with a powerful enough source of "raw Investiture", you can apparently bypass the need for a focus.

Well, Stormlight seems to be "raw Investiture". I think gems are the "real" focus for Roshar -- as seen in fabrials -- but Surgebinding is the equivalent of "burning the mists", not using any actual focus. Except for Soulcasting*, possibly because making substances is so complex that you really do need the focus.

*and there might be other exceptions - we've never seen Division, Tension, or Cohesion "on-screen".

[Yata]

I may understand that your point is to propose "Spren" as Roshar's Focus and the counterproofs to Gemstone as focus is needed.

But why did you not mention the other candidate ? (I ask it because it's the one I actual see as main candidate for Roshar's focus)

The "bonds" as Roshar's focus is a theory well know on the forum. I think it's a more elegant idea instead to propose the "power" (and a Splinter is just this...living power) as Roshar's way to access other powers.

PS: For a Realmatic reason, I think we may remove Gemstones from the Candidates of Roshar's Focus. But the topic isn't on them.

[Calderis]

I lurk on and off here and rarely post, but I have to chime in here to agree with @Yata. I've always thought the focus was bonds. It's the only thing that encompasses everything. 

Surgebinders have a bond with their spren. Shard bearers bond their blades. A Ryshadium bonds with its chosen rider. Spren a forcibly bonded (bound) within gemstones. The Parshendi bond to a spren similarly to a gemstone holding them strongly enough to change their physical shape. Conjoined fabrials function by manipulating the bond between pieces of a split gem. Stormlight itself is bound to gems. 

And finally oaths. A verbal pact made to strengthen a bond of trust, which is exactly its function in the nahel bond.