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Sometimes I second-guess my story because a couple of fantasy cliches. I'm writing it anyway because it's fun for me (in a tedious and frustrating way). Just curious, what do you guys think about tropes and cliches in fantasy? Are there any that would make you immediately stop reading?

I personally hate the strong female character who is supposed to break traditional stereotypes. The girl who prefers trousers to dresses, who hangs out with the boys, who doesn't care about her appearance or girly things, who would rather learn to fight with a sword than to go to the ball, etc. It's just as bad as the damsel-in-distress to me. It strips away all femininity and I'm basically reading about a male character who happens to look like a female. Pardon my rant.

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47 minutes ago, Tristan said:

Sometimes I second-guess my story because a couple of fantasy cliches. I'm writing it anyway because it's fun for me (in a tedious and frustrating way). Just curious, what do you guys think about tropes and cliches in fantasy? Are there any that would make you immediately stop reading?

I personally hate the strong female character who is supposed to break traditional stereotypes. The girl who prefers trousers to dresses, who hangs out with the boys, who doesn't care about her appearance or girly things, who would rather learn to fight with a sword than to go to the ball, etc. It's just as bad as the damsel-in-distress to me. It strips away all femininity and I'm basically reading about a male character who happens to look like a female. Pardon my rant.

Nah, I don't mind cliches as long as they aren't the annoying sort. Like Mary Sues. 

Making fun of tropes/cliches is fun tho :D 

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So, I came up with these two powers while I was taking shower last night. I kind of know what sort of world they're gonna be put in, but I thought I'd come share them and get some thoughts on them.

The first one is called MindJumping. A person who uses it is called a Hivemind. When a Hivemind touches another person (skin-to-skin contact is required), their mind is transferred to the other person. Their original body still has a part of their mind in it and can function by itself, however. Once in a host, they can either hide inside the person's mind, reading their thoughts and looking into their memories, or they can completely take the host over. They can then MindJump into another body, leaving another fragment of their mind in their first host. However, this leaves them vulnerable; there's an invisible link that connects them all the way back to their original body. If any of the bodies along a link are killed (when the body that the Hivemind is currently in is killed, the Hivemind is just returned back to their last host), the original body of the Hivemind would die, stranding the Hivemind in their most recent host. They do not die and can still travel between bodies, but they no longer leave a link behind. There is no quick escape if their current host is killed (this has its advantages and disadvantages).

The other power is Bodyjacking. Bodyjackers can take the DNA of a person, whether it be hair, nail, skin, or blood, and can turn into that person (usually by ingesting the DNA). While in that form, they do not gain that person's memories, although they do inherit behavioral patterns. The fresher the DNA, the longer they can stay in that form, as the form is not permanent. They cannot choose when they revert back to normal, and there is no going back and forth between forms. Once their body has processed all the DNA, they will revert back to normal. A person's blood is the best for long periods that a Bodyjacker need to be in a form. Fresh blood when the person is still living is the most potent, however people in this world know of the people with powers and are very reluctant to give up blood. Blood from someone who has recently died (at least within five minutes of death) is the next on the scale, though blood from later than that can still be used; the duration for this blood is exponentially shorter the longer the person has been dead, however. The more potent the DNA, the more accurate the Bodyjacker's transformation will be, and the more accurate the behavioral patterns will be as well.

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@StrikerEZ Can someone prevent a Hivemind from invading his/her mind without avoiding skin-to-skin contact for the rest of his/her life? If not, it seems like it would be a brutal world to live in. I would think you'd either trust no one at all to a level of paranoia, or you'd develop a deep level of intimacy and vulnerability with every person you come in contact with! Are there laws against MindJumping? If so, how are they enforced?

Can a Bodyjacker get DNA from someone who is currently Bodyjacking? Like if someone Bodyjacks a random dude, can another Bodyjacker Bodyjack the first Bodyjacker to look like the random dude, too? Or would the 2nd one be jacking the first one's real DNA? Can a Bodyjacker commit crimes and leave traces of the other person's DNA to frame him/her? How do people solve murders and such with Bodyjackers around? If a Bodyjacker dies, will he/she stay in that body or revert to the original DNA?

This is really interesting; I'd like to hear more about it! :)

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@Tristan I hadn't quite thought of how to make sure Hiveminds aren't overpowered yet. I'm still really thinking about this idea, so I haven't quite got there yet. Or even to the laws either. I'll probably post once I've solved those problems.

When a Bodyjacker takes another person's form, all of their cells absorb that person's DNA, hiding the Bodyjacker's own DNA (though it is still there if you look close enough). This absorption of the DNA is only temporary, so the cells would eventually revert back to normal, albeit at a lot slower pace than the Bodyjacker, since the cell is not having to produce more cells and wasting the stolen DNA. A Bodyjacker can commit crimes while impersonating someone, as they are technically the other person and leave behind that person's DNA. At this point in time in the world (this book takes place in a fantasy world where these powers originate, however far into the future and with advanced technology), one of the first tests done when someone is killed is to check for hidden Bodyjacker DNA. This is quite expensive, however, so while it should legally be done for every case, detectives fake the records on easier cases and only use the test where they think it is obvious that Bodyjackers were involved. When a Bodyjacker has died while in another form, they will eventually revert back to their original form, albeit at a much slower pace.

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5 hours ago, StrikerEZ said:

When a Bodyjacker takes another person's form, all of their cells absorb that person's DNA, hiding the Bodyjacker's own DNA (though it is still there if you look close enough). This absorption of the DNA is only temporary, so the cells would eventually revert back to normal, albeit at a lot slower pace than the Bodyjacker, since the cell is not having to produce more cells and wasting the stolen DNA. A Bodyjacker can commit crimes while impersonating someone, as they are technically the other person and leave behind that person's DNA. At this point in time in the world (this book takes place in a fantasy world where these powers originate, however far into the future and with advanced technology), one of the first tests done when someone is killed is to check for hidden Bodyjacker DNA. This is quite expensive, however, so while it should legally be done for every case, detectives fake the records on easier cases and only use the test where they think it is obvious that Bodyjackers were involved. When a Bodyjacker has died while in another form, they will eventually revert back to their original form, albeit at a much slower pace.

I don't understand, how does the body not instantly reject the foreign substances. And how do you change height/bones/muscle-structure. Stem-cells aren't enough. Is there nanotechnology? If this is a "magic" form, then yeah, a fair bit of balancing is in dire need. Making it a science-fiction however could open up alot of paths (Though I'd rather you didn't, I'm working on a MASSIVE techno-mythological saga, and nanotech plays a large part in it, as does body augmenting and things)

Also, here's another idea. Perhaps you can make it like a sort of dual-time reality. Sort of like Schrodinger's cat. Except, both here and there. So like, you tune into the other person's body, and they are you and they are themselves. You retain what you look like, but it appears as if the other person is you. And as such, their clothing is both there and here, so people will feel the texture of it and everything. And they will feel people touching them as well, hear the things you hear etc etc so it works both ways, except the person who you're impersonating won't look like you, and won't know where you are etc. I reckon this works alot better, as people would be able to tell if they are being Bodyjacked, and then they can be intuitive and listen to speech, chatter etc etc to figure out where you are and what you are doing etc etc.

 

damnation...now I want to use this idea...

Edited by Darkness Ascendant
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On April 5, 2017 at 0:59 PM, Tristan said:

Sometimes I second-guess my story because a couple of fantasy cliches. I'm writing it anyway because it's fun for me (in a tedious and frustrating way). Just curious, what do you guys think about tropes and cliches in fantasy? Are there any that would make you immediately stop reading?

I personally hate the strong female character who is supposed to break traditional stereotypes. The girl who prefers trousers to dresses, who hangs out with the boys, who doesn't care about her appearance or girly things, who would rather learn to fight with a sword than to go to the ball, etc. It's just as bad as the damsel-in-distress to me. It strips away all femininity and I'm basically reading about a male character who happens to look like a female. Pardon my rant.

Eh, I'm not sure femininity requires all of those things. I'm a girl and sometimes I care about these things, sometimes I don't. When I was younger, I was obsessed with dresses, but not I'm not. Sure, I like the way some dresses look, and if I was to go shopping for a prom dress, there are some things that I would absolutely drool over. However, I can probably count the number of times I've worn a dress or a skirt in the last year (that was not assigned attire) with two hands. I like pants, trousers, leggings, etc much better. Most of the time, I also don't care much about my appearance. I've only worn makeup for team events, where it's required. I've been planning to put on some sparkly red nail polish that was a Christmas gift, but I keep on putting it off because of a lack of time. I've also gone alone to a few school dances before and was absolutely bored to death. I can't say that I'd ever want to fight with a sword, because I'm more likely to slice myself up with it than anything else. I did learn Krav Maga for a while last summer, and it was much more engaging than those two school dances. I might not be a perfect example of the Strong Female Character, but I feel like I'm closer to that than Damsel In Distress.

Edited by Arraenae
Autocorrect corrected wrong
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On 4/5/2017 at 2:59 PM, Tristan said:

Sometimes I second-guess my story because a couple of fantasy cliches. I'm writing it anyway because it's fun for me (in a tedious and frustrating way). Just curious, what do you guys think about tropes and cliches in fantasy? Are there any that would make you immediately stop reading?

I personally hate the strong female character who is supposed to break traditional stereotypes. The girl who prefers trousers to dresses, who hangs out with the boys, who doesn't care about her appearance or girly things, who would rather learn to fight with a sword than to go to the ball, etc. It's just as bad as the damsel-in-distress to me. It strips away all femininity and I'm basically reading about a male character who happens to look like a female. Pardon my rant.

One trope that usually gets me to stop reading is too much emphasis on the romance. I read fantasy to visit fantastic worlds and meet the people who live there. 

To clarify, I don't mind romance. A little enhances the story, in my opinion, especially if the two characters have a complex relationship that feels real. But when a story chooses to gloss over worldbuilding, character development, and the bigger good-vs-evil conflict in order to put more focus on two characters making smoopy eyes at each other, then there's a very good chance I'll put the book down. 

I'm not fond of the "aggressor deserves whatever I choose to dish out on him" trope, either. Don't get me wrong, I'm fine with revenge stories. Catharsis is great, and a character who repays an unrepentant aggressor back measure for measure (especially when the authorities have been established as useless or against the protagonist all along) can make for a good story. I've enjoyed several of them in the past. What I don't like is when the aggressor insults the protagonist, which somehow entitles the protagonist to physically assault the aggressor at every turn—or worse, completely ruin the aggressor's life, dooming them to a fate worse than death. The punishment doesn't fit the crime, and a protagonist who pretends it does loses major sympathy points, in my book. 

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Yesterday a plotbunny jumped into my head. A woman is turning around with her eyes narrowed in suspicion as she unsheathes her sword. The image is captioned "I miss the days when I could salk outside without a wearing armor."

Edited by Arraenae
Mobile spelling/grammar errors
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16 hours ago, Darkness Ascendant said:

I don't understand, how does the body not instantly reject the foreign substances. And how do you change height/bones/muscle-structure. Stem-cells aren't enough. Is there nanotechnology? If this is a "magic" form, then yeah, a fair bit of balancing is in dire need. Making it a science-fiction however could open up alot of paths (Though I'd rather you didn't, I'm working on a MASSIVE techno-mythological saga, and nanotech plays a large part in it, as does body augmenting and things)

Also, here's another idea. Perhaps you can make it like a sort of dual-time reality. Sort of like Schrodinger's cat. Except, both here and there. So like, you tune into the other person's body, and they are you and they are themselves. You retain what you look like, but it appears as if the other person is you. And as such, their clothing is both there and here, so people will feel the texture of it and everything. And they will feel people touching them as well, hear the things you hear etc etc so it works both ways, except the person who you're impersonating won't look like you, and won't know where you are etc. I reckon this works alot better, as people would be able to tell if they are being Bodyjacked, and then they can be intuitive and listen to speech, chatter etc etc to figure out where you are and what you are doing etc etc.

 

damnation...now I want to use this idea...

See, like I said, this is still a fairly new magic system (a few days old). And it especially needs tweaking and balancing. Thanks for the feedback and critique though! I hadn't really thought about how the body would be most likely to reject the DNA.

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I'm extremely shy about my writing, but I'd like to share something--partially to talk it out with myself, and partially to get feedback. 

In my story, magic used by humans comes from titans (name is WIP), which humans think are gods. When a titan dies, its energy is dispersed into the world around it, and it leaks from the Rift (also WIP), which is a hidden shadowland where the titans and other magical beings reside. Humans who are sensitive to the dead titan's energy can use magic in two main ways:

1. Those who are sensitive to but not conscious of it just let the magic flow through them without knowing what's happening. These are mostly clairants (people whose intuition and spiritual connectedness is enhanced to a level of clairvoyance/clairaudience/clairsentience, etc), and empaths (people who can sense and slightly manipulate the emotions of other people). 

2. Those who are highly sensitive to the dead titan's magic and who are also conscious of it have the ability to store it in their body and use it for more physical purposes, though they may have some of the passive traits of clairants and/or empaths as well. These people are called shadowlings, and for the most part they're very rare. Keeping and using the titan's magic for extended periods of time will deteriorate the user's humanity and/or sanity, however, and the more powerful a human becomes through exploring the new abilities, the more his/her physiology changes. Titan magic will eventually turn someone into a titan-like creature if used too long, without any trace of humanity left.

This process can be slowed significantly, however, if the shadowling learns how to link to other humans. Linking to people, especially in large crowds, can be a sort of outlet to let some of the magic flow through the clairants and empaths (as it doesn't change them). Some of them call it grounding themselves. They can also steal energy from people--if someone is dreaming in R.E.M. sleep, for example, a shadowling can link to that person and essentially eat the dream, siphoning the benefits of the R.E.M. sleep so he/she can feel rested for longer periods of time. 

The shadowlings can see tears in the Rift and enter into them, as well, but spending time in the Rift accelerates the transformation into a titan creature.

In my story, the shadowlings are noticing a huge surge of magic and many are being killed off because they don't know how to use their magic and they're changing too quickly, scaring the public. This means that titans are dying, so something in the Rift is killing them off suddenly. To save themselves the shadowlings have to find what's killing the titans and put an end to it, before the rest of the humans kill them first.

Sorry that was so long-winded! 

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5 hours ago, Tristan said:

I'm extremely shy about my writing, but I'd like to share something--partially to talk it out with myself, and partially to get feedback. 

In my story, magic used by humans comes from titans (name is WIP), which humans think are gods. When a titan dies, its energy is dispersed into the world around it, and it leaks from the Rift (also WIP), which is a hidden shadowland where the titans and other magical beings reside. Humans who are sensitive to the dead titan's energy can use magic in two main ways:

1. Those who are sensitive to but not conscious of it just let the magic flow through them without knowing what's happening. These are mostly clairants (people whose intuition and spiritual connectedness is enhanced to a level of clairvoyance/clairaudience/clairsentience, etc), and empaths (people who can sense and slightly manipulate the emotions of other people). 

2. Those who are highly sensitive to the dead titan's magic and who are also conscious of it have the ability to store it in their body and use it for more physical purposes, though they may have some of the passive traits of clairants and/or empaths as well. These people are called shadowlings, and for the most part they're very rare. Keeping and using the titan's magic for extended periods of time will deteriorate the user's humanity and/or sanity, however, and the more powerful a human becomes through exploring the new abilities, the more his/her physiology changes. Titan magic will eventually turn someone into a titan-like creature if used too long, without any trace of humanity left.

This process can be slowed significantly, however, if the shadowling learns how to link to other humans. Linking to people, especially in large crowds, can be a sort of outlet to let some of the magic flow through the clairants and empaths (as it doesn't change them). Some of them call it grounding themselves. They can also steal energy from people--if someone is dreaming in R.E.M. sleep, for example, a shadowling can link to that person and essentially eat the dream, siphoning the benefits of the R.E.M. sleep so he/she can feel rested for longer periods of time. 

The shadowlings can see tears in the Rift and enter into them, as well, but spending time in the Rift accelerates the transformation into a titan creature.

In my story, the shadowlings are noticing a huge surge of magic and many are being killed off because they don't know how to use their magic and they're changing too quickly, scaring the public. This means that titans are dying, so something in the Rift is killing them off suddenly. To save themselves the shadowlings have to find what's killing the titans and put an end to it, before the rest of the humans kill them first.

Sorry that was so long-winded! 

This sounds really cool! I can't wait to hear more about it, if you're willing to share.

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18 minutes ago, Tristan said:

Thank you! :D I'll post a snippet here and there as I continue to work out the kinks and such. 

You're welcome. Also, I was wondering if you could describe the type of magic a shadowling can do? I know it's physical and messes with their sanity, but could you be more specific?

On an unrelated note, I have lots of what I think are really good ideas for books, but I don't know if I should share them all.

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@StrikerEZ It depends. There are a lot of possibilities open, and shadowlings are constantly tempted to explore those possibilities, but the more they develop new abilities, the quicker they change. I have a character who can mimic a titan voice, enabling her to summon shadow beings, if they answer her call. The stronger her resolution, the more commanding her titan voice becomes. Another character can form weapons from smoke, and since he has empathic abilities as well, the more passionate or angry he is, the stronger the weapon will be. He has to constantly check his emotions when he forges something, to make sure he's not overdoing it and accelerating the change. Titan magic amplifies a shadowling's personality and characteristics. Results may vary. Lol

Edited by Tristan
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21 minutes ago, Tristan said:

Great minds think alike!

I'm calling mine the Rift for now because I haven't thought of anything else yet. Lol

Mines a place basically with unlimited energy, and there are these parasite cell things that live there. And when they come into the real world they basically are gods 

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9 hours ago, Tristan said:

Destructive gods I imagine?

Nah domination gods. Then the rift closed and basically everything resets. The gods were called Eternals, but they are now Remnants because they only retain a fraction of their power. Humanity basically goes extinct and earth is a barren wasteland. One of the remnants (something to do with gaea) sacrifices herself to rejuvenate the earth and restart the world.

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10 hours ago, A Budgie said:

Meanwhile, I'm writing a murder mystery and my magic system is really simple, and doesn't even get too much page-time in my story...
All your ideas sound really cool.

What's your magic system? I would think a murder mystery would need a low-magic setting to be feasible, so it's probably a good call.

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1 hour ago, Tristan said:

What's your magic system? I would think a murder mystery would need a low-magic setting to be feasible, so it's probably a good call.

Yeah, the magic system is more of a background magic system. In fact, it's only until after the murder is committed that you even find out it exists (although there are hints and inconsistencies).

Basically, in this world (which has fairly low-level technology) people have magic inside of them. Different parts of a person's body are more powerful than others, with things like blood, bones and organs being the most powerful. This magic is also inside animals of the region.
For the magic to be used, however, it has to accompanied by some emotion.
Because the magic is either new, or hasn't really been discovered (not completely sure which), it has manifested in strange ways, by people putting strong emotions into or while weilding objects containing body parts (wow that sounds dark).
One of the biggest ways this has manifested and effected their world has been through various forms of art.
Like music: many instruments were once made using body parts. Intestines were really common for strings, hair is used for bows, and bone is sometimes used for ornamentation. Put enough emotion into your music while playing, and things happen.

So yeah, this is what I've come up with for my world's magic...

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