Waning, Ch.8 (L) (1352 words)

[neongrey]

Chapter 8, Savae 2 (Red side 3).

The dialogue between Savae and Kathalania here is criminally expository. Some of these lines are probably good but what I need on this please is which of them are the worst. I think we're fine up until Lady Riruna leaves but after that...

It's been some time since we've seen this half of the story due to my own gaps in submission; there's only been two chapters since we saw these two so I think the actual gap isn't as bad as it feels right now looking.

Previously with Savae: Savae Alevrin is a priest of the human goddess of the moons. Generally unwelcome in Ilidria, they find themself beholden to the crime boss Varael Ashana, who demands that they assist in a scheme to murder one Senator Riruna, using their position as a jeweler to gain a moment of access. Savae's other work in the city interferes before they can accomplish anything: a young woman claiming to have murdered the goddess Alia stumbles into their shop. They learn shortly thereafter that s/he is too called upon by the Lady of the Moons, and swiftly 'recruits' Ka/thalan/ia to their aid, though they don't exactly provide many alternative options.

This half of the story is a little 'behind' the other half; we're still establishing action; it also escalates differently so I'm not too worried as yet, and it hits its 'second act' at the same time as the other so I think it'll work out. 

Last time: Eshrin is disgruntled with Adrichel.
This time: Savae is disgruntled with Kathalania.
Next time: Lasila is disgruntled with Varinen.

[Yados]

Oh boy, you are speaking my language here. Love the style and the third person present. 

Totally lost on the jewelsmithing, it's chapter 8 so that's not an issue. 

I think the exposition really comes to a boil at the end where you have Savae kind of just states what she's doing and why. I'd be more engaged with this background political situation if I felt like the character had immediate stakes when the scene is being focused around. But then, you're framing it around a conversation so aside from flashbacks or a different structure, your hands are kind of tied. Personally, I try to put a lot of motivation/weighing options stuff in the inner narrative. But then it doesn't seem as if your PoV character is that conflicted, just resolving the question of her action to the other character. I don't know. It depends on what you want to convey and how you want to have it conveyed. 

You have a great sense of style and inner narrative and dialogue. Definitely a feather in your cap. Nice chapter!

[Mandamon]

Oh yeah, Savae is a jeweler. Haven't had a POV from them in a while.

pg 1: "so they continue." to "perhaps only one or two who spare even the slightest bit of skill on jewelry." is somewhat interesting, but could probably be cut or reduced.  Not sure what noting the number of archmagi of earth adds, since I don't know what they do.

pg 1: "image of Kathalania drowning in her own blood."
--this is a bit over the top, especially after thinking well of her a little bit ago. Was Savae thinking Kathalania did the sketch?

pg 2: "I'm bloody well beholden to your doodles now,"
--Ah. I guess she did. Savae gives a better explanation for their rage here, but it seems excessive when they first realize it.

pg 2: "I-- but why's it such a problem?" 
--can probably be cut. Her question comes out in the next sentence.

pg 2: "If she doesn't buy the piece, I've lost my chance." The clay melts around their fingers, twisting and warping into shape. But it's not right, it's too fluid."I should just kill him. Save some trouble, keep Varael storming Ashana from pissing after even more of my time."
--this was hard to follow the first time. Had to read the next paragraph and come
back to understand.

Aside from that, I didn't really have a problem with this. I think laying out the political system at the end of the chapter gives us a better glimpse into what's going on. It's at least in dialogue, and done while Savae is staring at a wall or something.

[Vreeah]

Ah yes, I am ready to witness the disgruntled.

Dialogue analysis, yes? I'm right on it.

Ooo, commanding. Yes, do tell how these will please. I see that the command isn't directly answered. Instead, the jeweler goes on rather poetically about trends and how her skill would impress. I like that she's talking herself up.

Hahaha, oh, the bit with the amateur sketch. That's a nice scene.

After the customer left, the outrage involve a pretty complicated sentence. I'm surprised they are so controlled, is that an important character trait? Always composed, even among the storm.

I think I spot some pride in that bit of confidence.

"But it's her husband, and she's buying for her husband."
-Could probably be shortened. I would expect some repetition of points from someone who is angry, but this jeweler seems composed enough to stay direct and on the point.

In the middle of this sentence, when the jeweler begins to mold the modelling clay, I didn't realize she still had the clay in hand. The previous action was to toss the clay onto the workbench, implying that the clay left her hands. The next action implies that the clay is in the middle of being molded.

"... pissing after even more of my time."
-What? I don't understand this part. I don't think the "Pardon?" that follows is meant to echo my confusion about the wording.

At the beginning of the next part, the jeweler starts to fold and stretch the clay. I think this is a better follow up after tossing the clay on the bench earlier. If it isn't important, you could get away with cutting how the clay felt fluid.

The rambling about how to do the killing was detailed enough to give me the full picture. If you wanted to, you could get the same point across while making the rambling sound more broken. But if the goal was to give me the full picture, then it's fine.

The very last block of dialogue has the jeweler repeating the word "now" very noticeably. I'd cut a couple of those if that wasn't intentional.

[neongrey]

22 hours ago, Yados said:

Oh boy, you are speaking my language here. Love the style and the third person present. 

Totally lost on the jewelsmithing, it's chapter 8 so that's not an issue. 

I think the exposition really comes to a boil at the end where you have Savae kind of just states what she's doing and why. I'd be more engaged with this background political situation if I felt like the character had immediate stakes when the scene is being focused around.

Savae is a they, please. But yeah, that dialogue between them and Kathalania is where it falls apart. Otherwise, FWIW this is a follow-up on a previous scene so I'm hoping that helps on the backgrounding. I'm hoping that in a proper readthrough it won't feel as far apart, though I have concerns they'll forget who Senator Riruna is.

22 hours ago, Yados said:

But then, you're framing it around a conversation so aside from flashbacks or a different structure, your hands are kind of tied. Personally, I try to put a lot of motivation/weighing options stuff in the inner narrative. But then it doesn't seem as if your PoV character is that conflicted, just resolving the question of her action to the other character. I don't know. It depends on what you want to convey and how you want to have it conveyed.

Yeah, Savae is somewhat distinct from a character like Lasila, who will, brick by brick, lay out their every perception, pick it up and rattle it a little, and put it back down. They're not per se impulsive but they definitely wish to be perceived that way.

As a person they're far more conflicted than someone like Lasila, but not, as a rule, moment-to-moment. 

Their plot's got... issues.

21 hours ago, Mandamon said:

pg 1: "image of Kathalania drowning in her own blood."
--this is a bit over the top, especially after thinking well of her a little bit ago. Was Savae thinking Kathalania did the sketch?

pg 2: "I'm bloody well beholden to your doodles now,"
--Ah. I guess she did. Savae gives a better explanation for their rage here, but it seems excessive when they first realize it.

It's definitely a case of 'there's no one else who could have done it'.

Regardless, excessive is pretty much exactly where I want that. If you're stopping entirely on that, that's about what I want.

21 hours ago, Mandamon said:

pg 2: "If she doesn't buy the piece, I've lost my chance." The clay melts around their fingers, twisting and warping into shape. But it's not right, it's too fluid."I should just kill him. Save some trouble, keep Varael storming Ashana from pissing after even more of my time."
--this was hard to follow the first time. Had to read the next paragraph and come
back to understand.

Yeah, this seems to be a problem line here. Which is not the one I would have picked for tripping people up, so... hey, that's what getting eyes on it is for.

21 hours ago, Vreeah said:

Ooo, commanding. Yes, do tell how these will please. I see that the command isn't directly answered. Instead, the jeweler goes on rather poetically about trends and how her skill would impress. I like that she's talking herself up.

Hahaha, oh, the bit with the amateur sketch. That's a nice scene.

Their, please, for Savae.

I do like this bit; there's a lot of cliches I really don't like surrounding 'this thing is outside of the current style' and related cliches about the people wearing them; I didn't want Lady Riruna jumping on something clearly ugly either for the same reason... I think it worked out, in this respect.

22 hours ago, Vreeah said:

I think I spot some pride in that bit of confidence.

Oh, definitely. But Kathalania's not great in three-dimensional space. Savae read it as earrings because they're a jeweler, and Lady Riruna read it as earrings because they were expecting jewelry. But the picture's tattoo flash.

Can probably space out the exposition some by working in what it actually is, now that I think about it.

22 hours ago, Vreeah said:

"But it's her husband, and she's buying for her husband."
-Could probably be shortened. I would expect some repetition of points from someone who is angry, but this jeweler seems composed enough to stay direct and on the point.

In the middle of this sentence, when the jeweler begins to mold the modelling clay, I didn't realize she still had the clay in hand. The previous action was to toss the clay onto the workbench, implying that the clay left her hands. The next action implies that the clay is in the middle of being molded.

Hmmmm. Yeah, I can look at that. Thanks.

23 hours ago, Vreeah said:

The rambling about how to do the killing was detailed enough to give me the full picture. If you wanted to, you could get the same point across while making the rambling sound more broken. But if the goal was to give me the full picture, then it's fine.

Yeah, ultimately this bit is... less important than it seems, beyond that we know Savae certainly intends murder. I think I like it as-is, but this can probably be shaved some.

23 hours ago, Vreeah said:

The very last block of dialogue has the jeweler repeating the word "now" very noticeably. I'd cut a couple of those if that wasn't intentional.

Yeah, it probably wasn't. I do that sort of thing.

Thanks!

[rdpulfer]

- I like how her assistant has already scurried off, and Savae remarks the girl has potential because of this. It's just a really nice transition/observation.

- You had me at "commissioning a human".

- I agree with Vreech - "Its her husband, and she's buying for her husband came off as a little clunky redundant.

- I actually liked this chapter a lot. I liked the interplay between Savae and Kathalana. I didn't really have many notes beyond some grammatical errors. \

[kais]

Overall

It's a neat scene, but I had a hard time making sense of it. The first half is pretty clear and I always love a Savae chapter. The second half seems to jump to tension very suddenly, and I'm confused in the interactions and politics talk. I want to point out specific sentences, as you requested, but after the Lady leaves the dialogue confuses me enough that I don't know what to suggest for cuts, because I don't really understand what they are talking about. I did love the doodle incident, however. Ah, apprentices.

 

As I go

- The second paragraph is a little stilted. It doesn't flow quite right. None of the sentences are strange, but I think how they are put together doesn't read... quite right. Just a little tweaking needed, I think.

- They are placed-- not where the eye falls naturally, but near to it. They compel the onlooker, lure the eye from its own inclination. The alternative is to give glory unto the current style in its last moments. Suggest to cut one of these sentences. One works. Two is alright, three and I start to wander. And I like jewelry. After these sentences the talk moves towards world building and jewelry, which is very attention holding. 

- and these opals would be the very mirror of your tears, well heck, I'd buy it!

- . It's really nothing to do with you, other than that if I get beaten to death, you're homeless. This sentence is confusing and seems a bit off-beat

- Save some trouble, keep Varael storming Ashana from pissing after even more of my time." Same here. Unsure what you're trying to say

- page two: wait, I missed a transition somewhere. Was Savae originally considering kill the husband? Did this thought just occur to them?

- After the quote above, I get lost. I understand that Important Things are being discussed, but they're.... muddled and I'm having a hard time parsing them out.