Radiant Returned Posted July 4, 2016 Report Share Posted July 4, 2016 Just finished White Sand Volume 1 and I'm trying to figure out where chronologically it fits. On the Coppermind (Chronology page, under Speculation) it states that White Sand takes place sometime after Elantris, since Elantris and Dragonsteel are supposed to be the first two series in the timeline. This doesn't make sense to me. We know that Khriss is a native of Taldain so I'm speculating that during WS she is not ultra-cosmere aware and worldhopping yet. But we also know that she write the Ars Arcana, and there was one in Elantris, along with a map from Nazh. So she had to be cosmere-aware during that novel? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagerunner Posted July 4, 2016 Report Share Posted July 4, 2016 The source for that speculation may not be referring to in-universe chronology, but rather out-of-universe order, i.e. which book was written first. As you can see here, Elantris was written before Dragonsteel, and both were written before White Sand. So, when Brandon said that Elantris and Dragonsteel are the first two books in the Cosmere cycle, he might have just meant the first two that he wrote. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young Bard Posted July 4, 2016 Report Share Posted July 4, 2016 34 minutes ago, Pagerunner said: The source for that speculation may not be referring to in-universe chronology, but rather out-of-universe order, i.e. which book was written first. As you can see here, Elantris was written before Dragonsteel, and both were written before White Sand. So, when Brandon said that Elantris and Dragonsteel are the first two books in the Cosmere cycle, he might have just meant the first two that he wrote. No, Elantris and Dragonsteel are the first two chronologically. The in-world explanation for the Elantris Ars Arcanum is that it was written retrospectively, well after the actual events of Elantris. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radiant Returned Posted July 4, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2016 14 hours ago, The Young Bard said: No, Elantris and Dragonsteel are the first two chronologically. The in-world explanation for the Elantris Ars Arcanum is that it was written retrospectively, well after the actual events of Elantris. Is there a WoB confirming this anywhere? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathfinder Posted July 5, 2016 Report Share Posted July 5, 2016 (edited) On 7/4/2016 at 2:25 PM, Radiant Returned said: Is there a WoB confirming this anywhere? I cannot locate it, but there was a WoB where he explained that the first bunch of books published were released in chronological order. It is only recently that he said it has changed as he has multiple projects occurring he is working on at the same time and take place at different times. Edited July 5, 2016 by Pathfinder 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagerunner Posted July 5, 2016 Report Share Posted July 5, 2016 29 minutes ago, Pathfinder said: I cannot locate it, but there was a WoB where he explained that the first bunch of books published were released in chronological order. It is only recently that he said it has changed as he has multiple projects occurring he is working on at the same time and take place at different times. Is this or this what you're looking for? All they say is that Elantris-Mistborn-Warbreaker-Stormlight happened in the order they were published in, but that there will be future Cosmere novels (i.e. Dragonsteel, White Sand) that will be set before Stormlight. (He must be talking about publication, because he wrote Way of Kings before Mistborn.) And, actually, I just discovered a WoB that indicates White Sand's place in the timeline wasn't finalized as recently as April of this year. Not sure if it's a "Is it before or after Elantris?" or a "How far exactly is it set between Elantris and Dragonsteel/Mistborn?" So, I guess it isn't really conclusive for this argument. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathfinder Posted July 5, 2016 Report Share Posted July 5, 2016 Yes that is the WoB, and that's what I meant. That Elantris's place is chronologically correct, because at least at first, they were ordered as they were published, but as time went on he would revisit earlier parts. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagerunner Posted July 5, 2016 Report Share Posted July 5, 2016 Wait, are we in agreement or disagreement about White Sand's place in respect to Elantris? Because while we knew Elantris was the earliest in-universe of the published novels, I don't think we know that it was the first after Dragonsteel (especially since Brandon has referred to White Sand as one of the very earliest). Basically, the Coppermind article posits that Elantris happens before White Sand. I don't think we know that for certain; it's certainly not impossible, but I was under the impression that White Sand happened before Elantris (and this was reinforced by the existence of Elantris's Ars Arcanum). Brandon has been intentionally iffy on the chronology, so I haven't seen anything to definitively state one way or the other. I can't make a definitive case for my interpretation, but I don't think the other side can make a definitive case, either. If there's a new WoB to bring to the table to say that the Elantris Ars Arcanum was not written roughly concurrent with the events of the novel, or that Elantris is the first novel post-Shattering, then I would love to see it. Because, from what I've seen thus far, I think it could go either way. It might be a good things to add to the Ultimate List of Questions and see if we can get a definitive quote, now that at least a portion of White Sand has been published. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathfinder Posted July 5, 2016 Report Share Posted July 5, 2016 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Pagerunner said: Wait, are we in agreement or disagreement about White Sand's place in respect to Elantris? Because while we knew Elantris was the earliest in-universe of the published novels, I don't think we know that it was the first after Dragonsteel (especially since Brandon has referred to White Sand as one of the very earliest). Basically, the Coppermind article posits that Elantris happens before White Sand. I don't think we know that for certain; it's certainly not impossible, but I was under the impression that White Sand happened before Elantris (and this was reinforced by the existence of Elantris's Ars Arcanum). Brandon has been intentionally iffy on the chronology, so I haven't seen anything to definitively state one way or the other. I can't make a definitive case for my interpretation, but I don't think the other side can make a definitive case, either. If there's a new WoB to bring to the table to say that the Elantris Ars Arcanum was not written roughly concurrent with the events of the novel, or that Elantris is the first novel post-Shattering, then I would love to see it. Because, from what I've seen thus far, I think it could go either way. It might be a good things to add to the Ultimate List of Questions and see if we can get a definitive quote, now that at least a portion of White Sand has been published. Lol I believe you are over complicating things. I was only stating Elantris came near the beginning as per Brandon's comment about how at least when the books first started being published, they were in chronological order. And I also did state, as you did, that recently that changed. Nothing deeper than that lol. Edited July 5, 2016 by Pathfinder 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSC01 Posted July 5, 2016 Report Share Posted July 5, 2016 (edited) All I can add is that, on April 11th, I asked Peter Ahlstrom (via Twitter) about whether White Sand has a canonical place in the chronology yet, and he said, "Not yet, but I suspect it's after Elantris." Personally, I thought that White Sand must have happened a considerable amount of time before Elantris, but clearly I'm wrong about that. Edited July 5, 2016 by DSC01 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radiant Returned Posted July 5, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2016 24 minutes ago, DSC01 said: All I can add is that, on April 11th, I asked Peter Ahlstrom (via Twitter) about whether White Sand has a canonical place in the chronology yet, and he said, "Not yet, but I suspect it's after Elantris." Personally, I thought that White Sand must have happened a considerable amount of time before Elantris, but clearly I'm wrong about that. This is the most valid thing I've seen posted on this subject so far. No one is doubting that Elantris was the first chronologically before White Sand was published, it's just a bit more blurry now because Sanderson and his team haven't definitively stated either way. To me, it makes the most sense that White Sand was before Elantris because of the Khriss/Ars Arcanum factor, but according to Peter that's not the way they're leaning. So I'm going off the assumption that the current chronological order is: 1. Elantris 2. White Sand 3. Mistborn Era 1 etc. At least until further clarification. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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