18th Shard Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 On what planet have we seen Frost? A recent WOB states the quote below, and we know that Frost is from Yolen. This thread discusses whether Braize may be Yolen. However, my biggest question is: the WOB implies that we have seen Frost on his home planet. Thus, unless Brandon means seen as in know about, Yolen is Roshar, Sel, Nalthis, First of the Sun, Threnody, or Scadrial. Let the Frost searching commence! Quote Q: Third, what non-worldhopper character we've seen so far is the most cosmere-savy?A: Frost or Sazed, most likely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Left Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 (edited) If I'm remembering correctly, Frost is the dragon that Hoid writes to. Not exactly seeing, but he does write a response....so I can see Brandon counting it as the same. Edited September 11, 2015 by ScottLeft 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orlion Blight Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 If I'm remembering correctly, Frost is the dragon that Houd writes to. Not exactly seeing, but he does write a response....so I can see Brandon counting it as the same. Yeah, that's my understanding as well. Pretty much everything we know about Frost (including his name) seems to be from WoB. I do not think we have anything definitive in the books yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil_Reptile Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 If I'm remembering correctly, Frost is the dragon that Hoid writes to. Not exactly seeing, but he does write a response....so I can see Brandon counting it as the same. Well, since Hoid wrote a letter to Frost, and as far as we know, there's even less evidence for worldhopper mail service than that for us having seen Frost, I think we may have actually seen him. Presumably on Roshar, since Hoid's letter was in The Stormlight Archive, Yolen may well be Roshar. So, to start off, Frost said that he took an oath of non-interference, so we have to find somebody who doesn't interfere in Voidbringer-related stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natc Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 I know little of Yolen, but from what I know it is not just nothing but stone all over. Far from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil_Reptile Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 I know little of Yolen, but from what I know it is not just nothing but stone all over. Far from it. Perhaps the Desolations made things desolate. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParadoxicalZen Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 I'm of the opinion that 'seen' doesn't mean physically and that it is just referring to the Letter's reply. Presuming that he actually is a reptile/dragon, I would argue he could be present on Nalthis (that vague dragon mention in-book) but seeing as he hasn't worldhopped, that would be unlikely. Unless....*aluminum-foil hat* plot-twist...Endowment could be Frost What the WoB doesn't say if Frost has ever Worldhopped/ever used to Worldhop but doesn't now due to some event in the past Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 Hoid starts his letter off by noting that the recipient is now immortal. This implies, to me, that the person holds a Shard. (This assumes Frost is the recipient. I don't think we have confirmation of this fact, though I believe it is rather likely.) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParadoxicalZen Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 (edited) Hoid starts his letter off by noting that the recipient is now immortal. This implies, to me, that the person holds a Shard. (This assumes Frost is the recipient. I don't think we have confirmation of this fact, though I believe it is rather likely.) This is also true, unless he has achieved immortality through another means. There was a WoB saying Odium had splintered one other Shard we haven't seen. Nor has it been clarified/confirmed if someone can transfer a Shard's power without having to die to drop it. Can a Shard even write a letter? Is it even letter Physical letter? o.O Hoy, too many questions. Interesting thought; the sceptre that Hoid tried to steal in MaiPon, did it have a gem in it? As i was thinking that might relate to what is mentioned at the start of the second letter. Edited September 11, 2015 by ParadoxSpren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 This is also true, unless he has achieved immortality through another means. There was a WoB saying Odium had splintered one other Shard we haven't seen. Nor has it been clarified/confirmed if someone can transfer a Shard's power without having to die to drop it. Can a Shard even write a letter? Is it even letter Physical letter? o.O Hoy, too many questions. Well, Preservation's power could reshape mountains, so I would think that they could make and teleport letters around? I'm not sure. It's an interesting thought. Interesting thought; the sceptre that Hoid tried to steal in MaiPon, did it have a gem in it? As i was thinking that might relate to what is mentioned at the start of the second letter. That could be it! We know the sceptre is related to the "proximity problem" of Sel's magics, but nothing else. There's also a WoB that refers to a "Topaz" in Dragonsteel - that might be one of Hoid's names, and might explain the comment about the gem from the letter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParadoxicalZen Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 (edited) http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/6533-the-second-letter-spoilers/?p=107048 based on that post from the Second Letter topic, we're 99% sure that Frost is sending it. Also, going by Hoid's comment about "your friends of the 17th Shard", it looks like Frost might not actually be a part of the organisation itself but is just on really good terms with them. Hmm.... Definitely leaning towards being a Shardholder now, but his comments on not taking the life of another of the 16 and mourning the great suffering Rayse has caused, makes the whole thing sound rather impersonal i.e. he sounds like the act of a killing a Shard wouldn't really affect him much, much like a dispassionate scientist lamenting an unfortunate but inevitable outcome to an experiment or something. Edited September 11, 2015 by ParadoxSpren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/6533-the-second-letter-spoilers/?p=107048 based on that post from the Second Letter topic, we're 99% sure that Frost is sending it. Also, going by Hoid's comment about "your friends of the 17th Shard", it looks like Frost might not actually be a part of the organisation itself but is just on really good terms with them. Hmm.... Definitely leaning towards being a Shardholder now, but his comments on not taking the life of another of the 16 and mourning the great suffering Rayse has caused, makes the whole thing sound rather impersonal i.e. he sounds like the act of a killing a Shard wouldn't really affect him much, much like a dispassionate scientist lamenting an unfortunate but inevitable outcome to an experiment or something. But if He held a "Passive Intent" Shard. This is possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelsier Kenobi Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 Hoid starts his letter off by noting that the recipient is now immortal. This implies, to me, that the person holds a Shard. (This assumes Frost is the recipient. I don't think we have confirmation of this fact, though I believe it is rather likely.) Isn't Hoid "essentially immortal" though too? He certainly doesn't hold a shard. In Frost's response to Hoid (again, I'm assuming like you are) he writes of Rayse "I suspect that he is now more a force than an individual now" if Frost were holding a Shard himself isn't that something he would know, not suspect? Personally I view Frost and Hoid as non-shardholders that were likely present at the shattering who are now on opposite signs of the coin. Hoid has an agenda and is actively trying to accomplish something. Frost is trying to keep Hoid from interfering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 Isn't Hoid "essentially immortal" though too? He certainly doesn't hold a shard. In Frost's response to Hoid (again, I'm assuming like you are) he writes of Rayse "I suspect that he is now more a force than an individual now" if Frost were holding a Shard himself isn't that something he would know, not suspect? Personally I view Frost and Hoid as non-shardholders that were likely present at the shattering who are now on opposite signs of the coin. Hoid has an agenda and is actively trying to accomplish something. Frost is trying to keep Hoid from interfering. It's certainly possible he doesn't hold a Shard and is just like Hoid. But, if he doesn't worldhop, how would he get Breaths/other magic systems that might give him immortality? Either way, Frost founded(?) or is friends with the 17th Shard, so I'd give decent odds for him not being a Shard. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParadoxicalZen Posted September 11, 2015 Report Share Posted September 11, 2015 (edited) It's certainly possible he doesn't hold a Shard and is just like Hoid. But, if he doesn't worldhop, how would he get Breaths/other magic systems that might give him immortality? Either way, Frost founded(?) or is friends with the 17th Shard, so I'd give decent odds for him not being a Shard. Not to mention that I'm not getting any vibe of Intent from the second letter, unless it is either Apathy, Scorn, Meh or the Intent doesn't really allow him the intervene x) (not that that really matters seeing as he won't intervene anyway). Granted we don't know the timescale of when these letters were sent/received or the Cosmere's timeline (after all, these characters have been alive for millenia, so the perception of 'now' could be something that happened centuries ago) It is possible that what makes Hoid so different (perhaps where his longevity comes from also) could make Frost the same or perhaps whichever Shardword Frost is on provides him with the magic system to do so. Edited September 11, 2015 by ParadoxSpren 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corax Posted September 12, 2015 Report Share Posted September 12, 2015 Please forgive my brief reply, but might Frost be the Shard who simply wishes to hide and survive? This corresponds with the statement by the Writer (presumably Hoid) of the Recipient's code of noninterference. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Witborn Posted September 12, 2015 Report Share Posted September 12, 2015 It's certainly possible he doesn't hold a Shard and is just like Hoid. But, if he doesn't worldhop, how would he get Breaths/other magic systems that might give him immortality? Either way, Frost founded(?) or is friends with the 17th Shard, so I'd give decent odds for him not being a Shard. Well he could have one of his friends from the 17th shard go to Nalthis and get a bunch of breaths then come back to Frost and give them to him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natc Posted September 12, 2015 Report Share Posted September 12, 2015 Please forgive my brief reply, but might Frost be the Shard who simply wishes to hide and survive? This corresponds with the statement by the Writer (presumably Hoid) of the Recipient's code of noninterference. As has been brought up, he seems to have a bit too impersonal of a reaction to Odium's deeds if he was a target himself, especially if he's actively hiding. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corax Posted September 12, 2015 Report Share Posted September 12, 2015 As has been brought up, he seems to have a bit too impersonal of a reaction to Odium's deeds if he was a target himself, especially if he's actively hiding. I don't know, that seems to be exactly the point the Writer is trying to make to the Recipient. 'Odium is dangerous, why aren't you more active about this?' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParadoxicalZen Posted September 14, 2015 Report Share Posted September 14, 2015 (edited) Interesting WoB i found that can be interpreted either way Interview: Mar 16th, 2012 A "Late-Breaking" Report (Paraphrased)BRANDON SANDERSON (paraphrased)Brandon said offhandedly, "It is not random who got which Shard." Also, Shards very rarely change hands. Brandon emphasized the "very" there. http://www.theoryland.com/intvsresults.php?kwt='shardholders' So two conclusions I draw are; Frost either became immortal through a magic system; or this was one of the very rare circumstances where a Shard changed hands. There is a WoB that was RAFO'd, asking if all the original Shardholders were Human. Edited September 14, 2015 by ParadoxSpren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ascendant Warrior Posted September 14, 2015 Report Share Posted September 14, 2015 Even though this quote is paraphrased, I doubt this has anything to do with Frost. The "very rare" instance of Shards changing hands is referring to Sazed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParadoxicalZen Posted September 14, 2015 Report Share Posted September 14, 2015 One of the main reasons why i thought it relevant is because I believe there was a WoB that was RAFO'd asking if all the remaining Shards are held by the original holders, but i can't remember if i'm thinking of a different scenario or not. I have found another relating to this topic but it also equally vague and just reiterates that he is functionally immortal (he doesn't age) but he can be killed (which applies to Shards as demonstrated by Aona, Skai, Leras and Ati + another we don't know the name of) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corax Posted September 15, 2015 Report Share Posted September 15, 2015 (edited) On my phone, so this'll be brief, but it seems pertinent to the discussion. Frost is confirmed to be from Yolen, yes? And recent WoB (from the absurdly long AMA) confirms that Frost is not a worldhopper. Therefore, frost is still on Yolen. Edited September 15, 2015 by Corax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sovereign Posted September 15, 2015 Report Share Posted September 15, 2015 (edited) On my phone, so this'll be brief, but it seems pertinent to the discussion. Frost is confirmed to be from Yolen, yes? And recent WoB (from the absurdly long AMA) confirms that Frost is not a worldhopper. Therefore, frost is still on Yolen. I've got you Corax: A couple of things regarding this question. Per WoB we know that Frost is from Yolen, we also know that he is NOT a worldhopper. As of the Stormlight Archive he is alive and therefore Yolen is still around. Relevant WoB: Q: Third, what non-worldhopper character we've seen so far is the most cosmere-savy?A: Frost or Sazed, most likely Edited September 15, 2015 by Iron Eyes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ari Posted September 17, 2015 Report Share Posted September 17, 2015 (edited) Hoid starts his letter off by noting that the recipient is now immortal. This implies, to me, that the person holds a Shard. (This assumes Frost is the recipient. I don't think we have confirmation of this fact, though I believe it is rather likely.) Aside from the previous objection to this that Hoid is functionally immortal as well and not a Shard, I'd like to raise another: Do you really need to write a letter to a Shard? Wouldn't it be able to find out what you want to say without you writing it using a manner similar to Scadrial's piercings? Frost is a Dragon. He (he?) doesn't need to be a shard as well until and unless we have some positive evidence for that. Edited September 17, 2015 by Ari Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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