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Shinovar is Imported


KnightGradient

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Not sure if this has been posted somewhere else. Shinovar is a complete anomaly on Roshar. The Shin look completely different, and have completely different customs than the rest of Roshar. They're land is completely different, along with completely different animals than the rest of Roshar. Its also the most Earth-Like place in Roshar, with trees, dumb grass, and non-crustacean surface life.

 

My theory: That Shinovar originated elsewhere.

 

Remember that Shinovar is alien, secretive, and does not fit in with Rosharan society.  Its a place where walking on stone is considered blasphemy. In Roshar. I don't know how it was transported, but my current theory, with absolutely no basis, is that it was the origin of humanity on Roshar, so Tanavast(Honor) and Cultivation could ease them into Roshar instead of deserting them on a place covered in storms and stone. The Shin that stayed behind stayed true to their original look, while elsewhere in Roshar humans evolved and changed. 

 

Also, could someone please explain Aimia? I haven't seen anything about it here, and it doesn't fit in with the main continent at all.

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I personally think that Shinovar is an area that was (forgive the pun) cultivated solely by Cultivation while the rest of Roshar was of Honor. I suspect the Alethi for example are of Honor (hence the Stormfather calling Kaladin "Son of Honor") while the Shin are of Cultivation.
 

Regarding the Aemian folk, I believe we have a WoB that states they are some crossbreed of Listeners and Humans similar to the Horneaters. I will add the reference later but am currently on my cellphone.

Edited by Iron Eyes
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Not sure if this has been posted somewhere else. Shinovar is a complete anomaly on Roshar. The Shin look completely different, and have completely different customs than the rest of Roshar. They're land is completely different, along with completely different animals than the rest of Roshar. Its also the most Earth-Like place in Roshar, with trees, dumb grass, and non-crustacean surface life.

 

My theory: That Shinovar originated elsewhere.

 

Remember that Shinovar is alien, secretive, and does not fit in with Rosharan society.  Its a place where walking on stone is considered blasphemy. In Roshar. I don't know how it was transported, but my current theory, with absolutely no basis, is that it was the origin of humanity on Roshar, so Tanavast(Honor) and Cultivation could ease them into Roshar instead of deserting them on a place covered in storms and stone. The Shin that stayed behind stayed true to their original look, while elsewhere in Roshar humans evolved and changed. 

 

Also, could someone please explain Aimia? I haven't seen anything about it here, and it doesn't fit in with the main continent at all.

I think that a lot of the points you make about the culture and ecology of Shinovar being so drastically different from the rest of the Roshar have a simpler solution. Their geographic region with the mountains and more earthlike weather enable the ecology to be more Yolen ish. Why the Shin have such an odd culture by any measure, I would definitely be willing to go along with a shard intervening there.

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I had the idea that the storms started sometime in the distant past and Shinovar is simply the only place in the world where the original ecology has survived instead of adapting to the new environment. They explain that it's relatively unaffected by the highstorms due to it's westerly location and being surrounded by mountains, so that was my thinking.

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This theory is interesting. We know that the huge Pangea continent was created, seeing as how there was once no large landmass on Roshar so I would doubt that Shinovar was imported. I'm of the mind that it has something to do with Cultivation, however.

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I always assumed like KeenBlade that shinovar had just been able to survive the high storms unlike the rest of the world which has been scoured by millennia of high storms. I'm not sure why the shin are so different but I have three thoughts: 1. they were inhabitants of roshar before the shattering of adonalsium 2. They came from another world, perhaps the one Brandon has mentioned where people live in the sky 3.They are of cultivation. But knowing Brandon I'm probably wrong on all counts and it will be something even better.

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Come on...we all know where Shinovar really came from. It was born out of Brandon's awesome and fun desire to point out that earthlike plant life is weird to Rosharans. Now he just has to come up with an in-universe reason.

 

I'm pretty sure 50% of all content in books starts this way though, so it's not like I mind at all. Little things like this make me smile. Especially when Brandon does it. He's the master of fresh perspectives on the utterly mundane.

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I don't know if "imported" is the right term, but I also thought of an influence from outer Roshar.

My first feeling reading about warshipping stones was some sort of deja vue - and searching I remembered "Elantris".

There's/was a little god, the protector of stones - Jaddeth.

Not only the coincidence with stones, there is another connection.

In both books this base is transported to a religion which is strongly hierarchic.

And being Brandon Sanderson with his cosmere I can't believe this is only repetition.

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I always assumed like KeenBlade that shinovar had just been able to survive the high storms unlike the rest of the world which has been scoured by millennia of high storms. I'm not sure why the shin are so different but I have three thoughts: 1. they were inhabitants of roshar before the shattering of adonalsium 2. They came from another world, perhaps the one Brandon has mentioned where people live in the sky 3.They are of cultivation. But knowing Brandon I'm probably wrong on all counts and it will be something even better.

 

Many people beleive that the Listeners (read: Parshendi) are the original inhabitants of Roshar.

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I don't know if "imported" is the right term, but I also thought of an influence from outer Roshar.

My first feeling reading about warshipping stones was some sort of deja vue - and searching I remembered "Elantris".

There's/was a little god, the protector of stones - Jaddeth.

Not only the coincidence with stones, there is another connection.

In both books this base is transported to a religion which is strongly hierarchic.

And being Brandon Sanderson with his cosmere I can't believe this is only repetition.

Also interesting, in this Elantris tangent, is that the folk of MaiPon associate meteorites with a mysterious Unknown God. Hmmm....

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Back from a round of thinking...

Why do we think of a religion warshipping stones as strange on a planet where we find life based on crystalline forms?

Humans are imported, the origins are the Parshendi.

It is possible the Shin know more about them.

On another note - Odium has attacked both worlds with stone-cults.

Perhaps this stone-god is his goal and that's the reason why this god is on the run.

A shard like Protect and Ruin, but instead of metal he is connected to stone.

And on the run...hiding...

I confess to have a little obsession with this shard whose only intention is to hide.

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Back from a round of thinking...

Why do we think of a religion warshipping stones as strange on a planet where we find life based on crystalline forms?

Humans are imported, the origins are the Parshendi.

It is possible the Shin know more about them.

On another note - Odium has attacked both worlds with stone-cults.

Perhaps this stone-god is his goal and that's the reason why this god is on the run.

A shard like Protect and Ruin, but instead of metal he is connected to stone.

And on the run...hiding...

I confess to have a little obsession with this shard whose only intention is to hide.

A shard that hides? Interesting idea though isn't odium kind of busy attacking Roshar than to be raising cults of Shu-Dereth and isn't he also closer to Rosar? No I think Dominion was behind Jaddeth and Devotion is behind Domi.

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A shard that hides? Interesting idea though isn't odium kind of busy attacking Roshar than to be raising cults of Shu-Dereth and isn't he also closer to Rosar? No I think Dominion was behind Jaddeth and Devotion is behind Domi.

http://coppermind.net/wiki/Survival_Shard

I believe this is what hypatia is talking about.

 

Back from a round of thinking...

Why do we think of a religion warshipping stones as strange on a planet where we find life based on crystalline forms?

Humans are imported, the origins are the Parshendi.

It is possible the Shin know more about them.

On another note - Odium has attacked both worlds with stone-cults.

Perhaps this stone-god is his goal and that's the reason why this god is on the run.

A shard like Protect and Ruin, but instead of metal he is connected to stone.

And on the run...hiding...

I confess to have a little obsession with this shard whose only intention is to hide.

I like this theory a lot, though it brings us to the question: What do rocks have to do with survival?

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Maybe since it is difficult to destroy stone, it can survive? That's a pretty big stretch, yet again, ask yourself, what does metal have to do with Ruining or Preserving something?

That one has nothing to do with either of those and everything to do with Scadrial itself.

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I should have made myself more clear:

Metals have nothing to do with their shards, stone has nothing to do with ...?...

There isn't a "Stoneshard" - if this is based on a Shard it could be anything including Cultivation - but why is there a stone-religion on two different shardworlds?

Over all I don't think Odium is the only Shard able to go on tour through the Cosmere, the others just have no reason to look after their fellow-shards.

Odium is on his way to splinter, but there can be other reasons - one of them is to hide.

This Shard wouldn't fight, only hide or run.

My personal fascination is with a society based on a Survival-Shard, I always thought of a seclusive culture, who wouldn't want to attract attention.

Back to the topic - if the Shin are from another planet I would bet on Sel.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I had the idea that the storms started sometime in the distant past and Shinovar is simply the only place in the world where the original ecology has survived instead of adapting to the new environment. They explain that it's relatively unaffected by the highstorms due to it's westerly location and being surrounded by mountains, so that was my thinking.

I'm not really a fan of that theory. The ecology on most of roshar seems too alien to be something that evolved from earth like flora and fauna. I don't see how you get from modern earth style crustaceans to an Axe Hound. The evolutionary jump seems even more vast when consider the greatshells (some of which are the size of islands) which have a distinctly non-terrestrial spren/stormlight oriented life cycle. 

 

It also begs the question. If most Roshar life is supposed to be radically evolved terran life forms...why are all the distinctly avian and Mammalian creatures from Shinovar so static in their appearance? Wouldn't a time span that allowed hermit crabs to evolve into greatshells also allow horses/mice/birds to evolve into different species as well? I'm not sure how you explain an evolutionary gap like that.

 

 

It seems that earth like organisms being transplanted to Roshar is a much simpler explanation (but besides humans and small pests, only really flourished in Shinovar due to the ecology). There's even some textual basis for this theory. We know that the Greater Roshar star system has three inhabitable planets on it. And the whole mythology behind the Tranquiline Halls seems like it could easily fit humanity being driven off a terrestrial planet to Roshar by Odium. 

Edited by Numuhuku
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