kroen

Is the Cosmere a universe or a galaxy?

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Has Brandon ever specifically stated whether the Cosmere is in fact a whole universe or is it the name of the dwarf galaxy in which his Cosmere books take place? Because if it's the latter, then that means it's possible that other galaxies in his universe include the worlds of the Reckoners, Alcatraz, etc. Which may mean that Calamity is in fact a Shard that managed to galaxy-hop to the galaxy in which the Reckoners books take place. And even if the Cosmere is the name of the whole universe, it's still possible that Calamity is a shard that managed to universe-hop. Is there a WoB that Calamity isn't a shard?

Edited by kroen
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I haven't read Alcatraz/Rithmatist so I don't know if either are based on Earth but I do know that any Earth based series (or 'breather novels' aren't Cosmere and there was confirmation (multiple times i believe) that Brandon has stated it isn't Cosmere, much to the dismay of a fair group of readers. I'll see if i can dig up a WoB.....

 

Here's one

 

 

 

  INTERVIEW: 2013 CHLIS (JANUARY 2013)

Quick question if you're still about; Is this book [Steelheart] part of the Cosmere? Since it's based in Chicago I'm wondering if that maybe isn't the case?

BRANDON SANDERSON

No, most of my "breather novels" are not Cosmere. The Cosmere requires meticulous planning and continuity. That's not usually good for what I'm looking to do when I take a break from a big project for a small one, though occasionally I can fit in a novella or such.

Edited by ParadoxSpren
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brandon has said that all cosmere world are close to each oother, in cosmic distance scales. say, a few hundreds of light years, a few thousands at most. a dwarf gallaxy or a small part of a normal galaxy.

series based on earth are not cosmere.

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The Cosmere is its own universe. It is a universe the size of a dwarf galaxy. Any Earth-based stories are not Cosmere, because Brandon currently does not wish to include Earth in the Cosmere. This rules out Alcatraz, Reckoners, Rithmatist, and many of his novellas and short stories.

 

The Cosmere currently consists of; Elantris, Warbreaker, The Mistborn Trilogy, Alloy of Law, The Stormlight Archive, Shadows for Silence in the Forests of Hell, Sixth of the Dusk, and The Emperor's Soul. I don't think I've missed anything there. Upcoming additions to the Cosmere include Shadows of SelfBands of Mourning, and Brandon is currently writing the first draft of Stormlight 3.

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*RAFO baits*

 

is there anything of interest to the story outside the local cluster (but still inside the dwarf galaxy)?

 

do any other galaxies in this rest of the universe make an appearance?

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Guys, you're not answering to what I asked. I know Earth based stories aren't in the Cosmere, I just asked if the Cosmere is A. a galaxy within a universe or B. an entire universe.

 

If A is true, then that means that even though the Rockoners isn't in the Cosmere galaxy, it could be in another galaxy within the same universe. (Which means that Calamity is a shard that escaped the Cosmere galaxy and travelled to the Rockoners' galaxy.)

 

If B is true, then that means that even though the Rockoners isn't in the Cosmere universe, it could be that Calamity is a shard that found a way to escape the Cosmere universe and get to the Reckoner's universe.

 

I've yet to see WoB on 1. That the Cosmere is an entire universe as opposed to just a galaxy within a larger universe and 2. that Calamity definitely isn't a shard. 

Edited by kroen
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whether the cosmere is the name for the whole universe or only for that local cluster oof stars is completely irrelevant. calamity is not a shard. the non-cosmere stories are not related in any way to the others. no, they are not happpening in a faraway galaxy. they are just totlally unrelated, and that's it.

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Then I find it odd there is no official WoB stating Calamity isn't a shard, considering I'm not the first one who's been wondering it.

Edited by kroen
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Guys, you're not answering to what I asked. I know Earth based stories aren't in the Cosmere, I just asked if the Cosmere is A. a galaxy within a universe or B. an entire universe.

 

If A is true, then that means that even though the Rockoners isn't in the Cosmere galaxy, it could be in another galaxy within the same universe. (Which means that Calamity is a shard that escaped the Cosmere galaxy and travelled to the Rockoners' galaxy.)

Your logic for A is extremely faulty if A = "a galaxy within a universe". Even if the two galaxies are in the same universe (and they're not), that does not mean that Calamity is a shard escaped from the Cosmere galaxy. That is a leap of logic larger than the distance between Earth and the furthest object in our universe relative to earth, a gamma ray burst named GRB 090429B. There is no evidence, none, to support something like you claim.

 

In our own Galaxy, the Milky Way, name me ONE entity that has come into our galaxy from another galaxy? The distance in space between our galaxy and others is vast. The likeliest way entities from another galaxy could possibly be in our galaxy is if the two galaxies are merging. To put this into perspective, the closet Galaxy to the Milky Way is Andromeda. They're 2.5 million light years apart and currently are moving towards each other at 402k kph. At that rate they won't begin to merge for 4 billion years. Thus, the probability of an entity coming from another galaxy into our own at any time is so close to zero we may as well call it zero. 

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Still not answering my second question. Calamity could have universe-hop.

 

@Titan Arum: Our universe doesn't have entities as powerful as Shards.

Edited by kroen
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Still not answering my second question. Calamity could have universe-hop.

 

@Titan Arum: How universe doesn't have entities as powerful as Shards.

Ha. That's a horrible argument too. Is a black hole not powerful? It sure isn't sentient, but it's very powerful! There are forces in our universe, thus entities, that are very powerful. Heck, atomic bombs are powerful. Humanity is powerful. 

 

The point is, we KNOW the books that are not Cosmere are not in our universe let alone in our galaxy. With your B scenario they are in different universes, right? Ok, then if Universe B is not Cosmere, it probably isn't ruled by Realmatic theory. Thus it'd be impossible for a Shard to worldhop to a new universe. And why would it do that when there are PLENTY of other planets to do stuff on in it's already small star cluster within its galaxy that the Cosmere is set in? It could just hide somewhere else in its own galaxy. Which, actually, a Shard IS doing. 

 

This hiding Shard is the Calamity you've been looking for.

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Still not answering my second question. Calamity could have universe-hop.

 

@Titan Arum: How universe doesn't have entities as powerful as Shards.

 

If its not Cosmere then its not a shard. If it universe hopped then that would make it Cosmere because it would have ties to Cosmere. I would be profoundly disappointed if something like Calamity being a shard happened.

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Point taken.

 

I still wish we had WoB that Calamity isn't a shard. A quick google search reveals many people that wondered the same thing. Seems an easy enoguh task for Brandon to just say it isn't and be done with it.

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INTERVIEW: Mar 21st, 2014

WOR Signing Table Q&A (Verbatim)

QUESTION

What came first, Pattern or Chalklings?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Pattern was before Chalklings, good question. For some part of its existence, the Rithmatist was in the Cosmere, until I decided I just don't want Earth in the Cosmere at all, even a bizarre sort of version of Earth

http://www.theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=1052#70

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Maybe 'Cosmere-canon' and 'Reckoners-canon' would be a better choice of words when dealing with Sanderson stuff. His worldbuilding leaves a lot of speculation where the literary meaning of 'universe' and the spacial meaning can get confusing.

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Guys, you're not answering to what I asked. I know Earth based stories aren't in the Cosmere, I just asked if the Cosmere is A. a galaxy within a universe or B. an entire universe.

 

If A is true, then that means that even though the Rockoners isn't in the Cosmere galaxy, it could be in another galaxy within the same universe. (Which means that Calamity is a shard that escaped the Cosmere galaxy and travelled to the Rockoners' galaxy.)

 

If B is true, then that means that even though the Rockoners isn't in the Cosmere universe, it could be that Calamity is a shard that found a way to escape the Cosmere universe and get to the Reckoner's universe.

 

I've yet to see WoB on 1. That the Cosmere is an entire universe as opposed to just a galaxy within a larger universe and 2. that Calamity definitely isn't a shard. 

 

Actually, look up; you just got a Word of Peter that the Cosmere worlds are contained within a small star cluster.  He's pretty much as close to a fresh WoB as you're going to get on the boards.

 

And this makes sense, given that the Shards probably hopped over to the nearest inhabitable planets after the Shattering.

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QUESTION: I know the Reckoners series isn't Cosmere, but Calamity acts quite a bit like a shard in it. I've argued that, were it a shard its Shardic Intent would be temptation. Do you agree?

Brandon: I wouldn't argue against that interpretation.

If Calamity were a shard, he probably would have pointed that out here. 

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/books/comments/2ytg2h/im_novelist_brandon_sanderson_ama/cs6251t

We already know about nine shard (eight named) along with at least one most likely being on the Dragonsteel world. Also there is one "that just wants to survive." So potentially there are already around eleven shards accounted for. There are only sixteen in total. 

Edited by NavySealsGuy
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The Dragonsteel world is Yolen, the homeland of humanity and where Adonalsium Shattered. Is there any evidence of there being a shard there?

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If Calamity were a shard, he probably would have pointed that out here. 

To that I can say that if Calamity wasn't a shard he probably would have pointed that out here.

 

Dunno, to me his answer seems pretty vague. Suspiciously so.

 

@Titan Arum: Are you seriously trying to compare our universe to a fictional one? how do you even measure the power of black hole against that of a shard? regardless, we know worldhoppers can hop between worlds via Shadesmar without having to actually travel the distance of point A to point B. And if worldhoppers can hop between worlds, who's to say that shards (which are much more powerful) can't hop between galaxies or even universes?

Edited by kroen
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regardless, we know worldhoppers can hop between worlds via Shadesmar without having to actually travel the distance of point A to point B.

 

To my knowledge this is a misrepresentation of what is happening, "worldhopping" is not instantaneous like you imply here, the worldhoppers do still have to travel that distance, but do to the nature of the Cognitive Realm it is greatly reduced.

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Are we really arguing over the Cosmere-ness of Reckoners of all things?

The meme thread already has all the responses we can say about that.

Why can't we measure a black hole against a shard anyway? We can have a hypothetical shard divert all its power to one massive reverse lashing to see which has the stronger gravitational pull. In fields of terraforming and genetic modification they're known to surpass humanity in accuracy and scale. If we are to be blunt they can resurrect people faster than Jesus Christ. They almost entirely operate towards the end result of bending physics to produce phenomenon that ought not to be there. Very much comparable to real life occurrences.

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The Dragonsteel world is Yolen, the homeland of humanity and where Adonalsium Shattered. Is there any evidence of there being a shard there?

Not that I know of. I am just assuming it has at least one, since Dragonsteel is suppose to be a pretty significant Cosmere series. 

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