Second Oaths for the 10 Orders

[Marmota]

Hey guys!

Just for fun, i was trying to think what should be the second oath for each of the 10 orders, based on the primary/secondary attributes of each Herald. Anyone wanna join me?

Maybe even going further to the third oath hehe. 

 

I would like to see your ideas for the oaths as well, as im not very glad with some of mine yet.

 

This is what i thought so far:

 

Windrunners (Protecting/Leading)

“I will protect those who cannot protect themselves”

 

Skybreaker (Just/Confidant)

“I will put justice above all else”

 

Dustbringers (Brave/Obedient)

“I will overcome my greatest fears”

 

Edgedancer (Loving/Healing)

“I will remember those who have been forgotten”

 

Truthwatcher (Learned/Giving)

“I will sacrifice for the greater good”

 

Lightweaver (Creative/Honest)

-

 

Elsecaller (Wise/Careful)

“I will seek the wisdom to prevent”

 

Willshaper (Resolute/Builder)

“I will succeed no matter what”

 

Stoneward (Dependable/Resourceful)

“I will make from my words the pillars of my existence”

 

Bondsmiths (Pious/Guiding)

“I will unite instead of divide”

Edited September 2, 2014 by Marmota

[Moogle]

Well, we do know the Second Ideal for the Skybreakers is “I will put the law before all else.”  There was a WoB a while back. Stonewards were also revealed to have one saying "I will stand." They were subject to revision though.

 

I also imagine the Lightweavers were not the only Order to be somewhat fluid in their oaths. At a guess, Truthwatchers, Elsecallers, and Willshapers might also not swear any formalized oaths.

Edited September 2, 2014 by Moogle

[Marmota]

Well, we do know the Second Ideal for the Skybreakers is “I will put the law before all else.”  There was a WoB a while back. Stonewards were also revealed to have one saying "I will stand." They were subject to revision though.

 

I also imagine the Lightweavers were not the only Order to be somewhat fluid in their oaths. At a guess, Truthwatchers, Elsecallers, and Willshapers might also not swear any formalized oaths.

 

Yes , i knew that the Skybreaker's oath was already Revealed. I just swap the word law for justice. But what matters in the oaths is the idea not the actual words right? 

 

This one about the Stonewards i wasnt aware. Damm, Sanderson's oaths are way better than mine hahaha 

 

And yes, I also though that the Lightweavers arent the nly order which dont have to say th regular oaths. I just didnt have any ideas to develop in that matter

[Moogle]

And yes, I also though that the Lightweavers arent the nly order which dont have to say th regular oaths. I just didnt have any ideas to develop in that matter

 

Well, it's hard to say. The purpose of the oaths is apparently to produce a certain sort of person. Lightweavers want people who are self-aware, so there's no static set of oaths that can handle that. It could be that the Willshapers value people who follow through with their passions and devote their life to something, so maybe each of their oaths will be them saying they have done a great deed. I don't have many other ideas, since we haven't seen the various orders in much detail.

[maxal]

I have thought of the followings:

 

Dustbringers:

"I will do what is right even if it is wrong"

"I will not let fear stop me" -> imo pretty similar to yours

 

Truthwatchers:
"I will seek knowledge where I can find it"

 

I like the other ones you came up with.

[ericth]

I'm sure one of the orders must have "No, I am a stick" in the sequence somewehre

[Zea mays]

 

Dustbringers:

"I will do what is right even if it is wrong"

I am having a hard time understanding that one.

Clearly I was never meant to be a Dustbringer.

 

In the prologue to WoR, Jasnah meets Ivory just after she publicly proclaims her disbelief in Vorinism. The readers know that a lot of that religion is based on ancient misinformation.  I'm thinking Elsecallers might have a vow of digging out and bringing hidden truths to light

[maxal]

I am having a hard time understanding that one.

Clearly I was never meant to be a Dustbringer.

 

Let me explain then

 

By doing what is right even if it is wrong, I meant being brave enough to do what is needed even if the consequences to yourself are disastrous. There has to be more to being "brave" than just being a reckless fool. You have to have a purpose and I believe the purpose of the Dustbringers is to not being afraid to do what others cannot do.

[The Ja]

I see the Truthwatcher oath as being something to the effect of: "I will be a light to those lost in darkness."

[Savanorn]

I see the Truthwatcher oath as being something to the effect of: "I will be a light to those lost in darkness."

Being learned/giving, that would make sense. 

 

Or something like "I will see where others are blind" given the future sight and relatively common theme of "I will positive instead of negative."

Edited September 3, 2014 by Savanorn

[hoser]

The Lightweavers don't have oaths after the first, but that doesn't mean their "truths" can't be categorized.  We know Shallan's fourth truth, but a single sample makes it hard to generalize.  We know two other truths, but they presumably were to recover her relationship w/Pattern so they may not have been like the original truths she used.  On the nearly baseless speculation side, I will go with:

Lightweaver #2: strong emotional truth

Lightweaver #3: strong factual truth

Lightweaver #4: strong truth about past

Lightweaver #5: strong truth about future/purpose

[Jaaxter]

Maxal, I think your last sentence would make an excellently succinct version of the oath: "I will do what others cannot." Said another way (the way I would personally say it if I ever got the chance to take a Dustbringer's oaths), "I will not flinch from a task that others find distasteful." Current speculation is that the Dustbringers are some of the most impulsive and... morally flexible of the Knights Radiant. They might be willing to do something morally unjust if "someone had to do it."

 

Such as (one might offer as an example), putting down a man who had definitively abandoned all moral decency yet still hid within the safety of the law, having done nothing that could be decisively pinned to him in legal proceedings. Classic Al Capone stuff- we all know he did it, but no one can prove it in a court.

 

Of course, that sort of oath might be the third for Dustbringers, after something like "I will destroy those who would harm the innocent." Perhaps that is too similar to the Windrunners second oath, but the Dustbringers seem a more... aggressive order.

[maxal]

Maxal, I think your last sentence would make an excellently succinct version of the oath: "I will do what others cannot." Said another way (the way I would personally say it if I ever got the chance to take a Dustbringer's oaths), "I will not flinch from a task that others find distasteful." Current speculation is that the Dustbringers are some of the most impulsive and... morally flexible of the Knights Radiant. They might be willing to do something morally unjust if "someone had to do it."

 

Yeah, I think both oaths would be applicable. We know the exact wording is not required when making an oath: it is the general sense of the oath that matters. Based on this, I think both our versions could be used as the second oath. About the Dustbringers, I feel their role would be to take direct action for the general good even it is means breaking the law or putting oneself into mortal danger. I guess they are there to pick up the pieces left by orders such as the Windrunners and the Skybreakers who are tightly bond into what they can and more importantly what they cannot do.

 

 

Such as (one might offer as an example), putting down a man who had definitively abandoned all moral decency yet still hid within the safety of the law, having done nothing that could be decisively pinned to him in legal proceedings. Classic Al Capone stuff- we all know he did it, but no one can prove it in a court.

 

Of course. Adolin is such the perfect Dustbringer

 

 

Of course, that sort of oath might be the third for Dustbringers, after something like "I will destroy those who would harm the innocent." Perhaps that is too similar to the Windrunners second oath, but the Dustbringers seem a more... aggressive order.

 

How about "I will removed all threats to those who cannot defend themselves?" It does have a different sense than Windrunners: "I will protect those who cannot" as it implies taking direct action against something as opposed to simply protect. I just can't shake my feeling these two orders, whereas not sharing the same morality, worked together quite well.

[kari-no-sugata]

I've had a few ideas knocking around my head recently. One is that the more action orientated Radiant Orders might have a series of Oaths like this (or maybe I should say the more Honor orientated Radiants):

1. Prime Directive (for all Orders)
2. Core directive (for the specific Order)
3. Qualifier: equality / impartiality (don't pick and chose, don't play favourites)
4. Qualifier: proportionality / reasonableness (don't go overboard)
5. Qualifier: honour / integrity (don't cheat)

side note: the words used in the list above are more to convey general concepts. The exact words used do not matter so much as the general concepts.

 

The "prime directive" (sorry, couldn't resist) is obviously "Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination".

 

For each Order their "core directive" is what they "do". So for Windrunners it's "protection" and for Skybreakers it's "justice" (or "law enforcement"). Stonewards might be "defendence" (or "tanks" to use a role-playing term), Bondsmiths might be about "unity". Not sure about the other Orders but I suspect the Lightweavers are about "hope", not that they actually get Oaths.

 

For the remaining 3 Oaths I suspect they're all "qualifiers" (or "constraints") for the "core directive" to help them keep to it in a good way. So Kaladin's "I will protect even those I hate so long as it is right" fits because it forces him to treat Lighteyed and Darkeyed (and everyone else) as equally deserving protection. I suspect Skybreakers would have something along the lines of "All are equal before the law" and Bondsmiths would be about "equal rights".

 

Getting more speculative here I suspect the 4th Oath is about concepts like proportionality, reasonableness etc. I suspect Skybreakers would have something like "let the punishment fit the crime" while Windrunners would be more like "minimise need to inflict casualties / injuries" and Bondsmiths be about "freedom from oppression".

 

For the final Oath I'm thinking it would be to protect against subverting or perverting their other Oaths - eg you can't make someone do something you couldn't do.

 

While this is a neat little theory I have no idea if it's in any way accurate since we have so few example Oaths. It's certainly not complete since I don't see how orders like the Edgedancers would fit in - even excluding the Lightweavers I don't expect all the orders to follow the exact same pattern. For example, maybe the Edgedancers would be about "standing up for the little guy" (sort of thing) and each of their unique oaths would be about a particular type of "little guy" to stand up for.