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Found 2 results

  1. Hey guys, I know I'm new and all but I just couldn't help putting this up here since I found out that not many people seemed to get the Investiture Feruchemy idea and anyway I THINK I have a good idea of what it entails. Anyway, if it's wrong, just point it out because I'd really rather have you tell me what's wrong with the theory so that we can discuss it. Also, if this topic has already been opened somewhere, feel free to remove it (since I'm too much of a newbie to get how to do it anyway). Also, if you haven't read Bands of Mourning for some reason, you might want to refrain from reading the rest of the theory below because some passages WILL DEFINITELY SPOIL YOU SENSELESS. Investiture: Okay, I'd like to propose this. (Note that this theory is not in itself unique - chances are somebody else in the forums has already put forth something similar in nature to what I'm typing here, but since almost every other explanation I've come across in the matters are downright confusing, I'll be presenting a hopefully clearer explanation on the nature of Investiture and Identity). All Allomantic and Feruchemical abilities are a form of Investiture. Everybody knows this of course, but the matter is always interpreted differently. Well, my take on the nature of storing Investiture is that it is absolutely useless when a Soulbearer Ferring is the one storing it. The reason for this is because, ingrained into his Soulweb is only one kind of Investiture - that is storing Investiture itself. (Get it?) But when a Full Feruchemist is the one doing the storing process, things begin working differently. As I've said, all Allomantic and Feruchemical abilities are a form of Investiture - so when a Feruchemist actually does store said attribute, he is actually storing his ability TO STORE ONE OF THE OTHER FIFTEEN ATTRIBUTES. It's like this. A Feruchemist can store Heat within a brass metalmind. But if he has a piece of nicrosil with him, he can instead store within the nicrosil metalmind his ability to STORE HEAT. Having imparted the Investiture of Heat upon the nicrosilmind, for a time being, the Feruchemist loses the ability to store Heat until he taps it again. By itself this ability is useless, that is until the Feruchemist uses this ability in conjunction with aluminum to bypass Identity (more on this later). So the concept behind storing Investiture is that it can transform a non-ferring or non-allomancer (if the Feruchemist in question also happens to be a Mistborn, a Twinborn, or somebody in possession of a Hemalurgical spike) temporarily into a Metalborn of the specific Investiture stored. Using the example I gave above, by tapping the nicrosilmind, for a time being you become a Firesoul! Note: I also think it's possible to store more than one form of Investiture into a nicrosil metalmind, but based on accounts in the book there are also certain complications in doing so. Said account can be read underneath if you'd like. Identity: Now unto that pesky thing we call Identity. Contrary to sources outside the actual books, Identity does not store your physical sense of being, rather that of your spirit's. This means that storing Identity does not actually make you feel like you're parting with anything, because how in the world can your physical senses actually feel that you are parting with a spiritual attribute? That's beyond their range (hence the reason why storing Identity made aluminum Ferrings feel like they were just as useless as aluminum Mistings - even if they were storing something, they had no idea they were actually doing ANYTHING). It's not like speed, where storing it causes you to grow slow, or mental speed, which makes you feel dull and slow-witted during active storage, no, Identity is such an abstract concept that it is beyond comprehension. Ignoring how aluminum Ferrings even began to understand the implications of this ability (unless Harmony clued them in), one cannot help but wonder how they ever got to the point of actually doing something useful with the ability by the time the events of Bands of Mourning occured. For the same reason nicrosil Ferrings are useless on their own, storing Identity is only ever useful for a person with Full Feruchemical powers. You store Identity on an aluminum metalmind (your soul thus becoming something akin to a mirror), then you store Investiture on a nicrosil metalmind. (Pick a power.... any power...) If you simply store Investiture on a nicrosil mentalmind without first rendering yourself completely identity-less, there's still no point to the ability because by the end, only you can still tap the stored Investiture. An example of this can be seen in Bands of Mourning (SPOILER ALERT: DO NOT READ FURTHER IF YOU HAVE NOT READ THE BOOK!) “You think us gods?” Allik said, shaking his head. “You see that? The one you hold? It is very complicated. It is stored with the ability to give yourself a sliver of holiness.” “Investiture,” Waxillium said. “This inner ring is nicrosil. You tap it, and it grants you Investiture —turning you into a temporary Feruchemist who has the ability to fill a metalmind with weight.” He held up the medallion. “The iron on this is for convenience, right? You can fill it, but so long as you’re tapping the Investiture, you could touch any source of iron and turn it into a metalmind.” “You know much about this, Mysterious One,” Allik said. “You are wise and—” “I learn quickly,” Waxillium said, glancing at Marasi. She nodded for him to continue. This was fascinating … but the Metallic Arts was not one of her areas of expertise. Waxillium had a passion for it though. “What’s this other ring built into the medallion?” “That grants the warmth,” Allik said. “It is a grand combination—two attributes, from separate rings. Took us long to make these work, yah? The one I wear now, also grants two. Weight and Connection. I’ve seen medallions with three. Twice in my life only. Every attempt at four has failed.*” So let's review, kay? The amulet Waxillium was holding had three parts: 1.) An outer-ring of Brass 2.) An inner-ring of Nicrosil 3.) A circle of Iron on the middle So the Nicrosilring had two attributes stored inside - namely Skimmer Investiture and Firesoul Investiture. If I had to hazard a guess, the Nicrosilring had been stored with Investiture while the Full Feruchemist in question had no Identity. When Allik held it, since it had no Identity, he could tap on the Nicrosilring's Investiture becoming a temporary Skimmer and Firesoul along with his pre-existing power. The ring of Brass and circle of Iron though were there because even if you had the ring of Nicrosil in there, you couldn't actually use it to store weight or heat - only the capacity to do so. So you tap Nicrosil, then store heat into the Brass ring and weight into the Iron circle. *Theoretically, it's also possible to store more than two forms of Investiture into a nicrosil metalmind, as evidenced by the passage up above, but the same passage also gives us this tidbit: “So wear multiple medallions,” Waxillium said. “Strap thirty-two to your body, and have all the abilities.” “I’m sorry, great Wise One,” Allik said. “You are obviously very knowledgeable about this, and know things that none of us would ever think to try. How could we be so foolish as to not realize that we could simply—” “Shut it,” Waxillium growled. Allik flinched. “Doesn’t work?” Waxillium asked. Allik shook his head. “They interfere with each other.” “So to create one with multiple powers…” “You must be very skilled,” Allik said. “More skilled than any who has lived among us. Or…” He chuckled. “Or you’d have to have all the powers, rather than adding yours to the medallion, then passing it to another to have it added to! If that were the case, you’d be a great god indeed. As powerful as the Sovereign.” If you were a Nicrosil Twinborn, I also think it's possible for you to store your Allomantic Investiture into the nicrosilmind - but if you can't get rid of your spiritual identity, you still can't make just about anybody into a Misting. =) So guys, what do you think? Hope it wasn't too long for my first ever theory (clarification, explanation, whatever). I hope it also made sense to you people.
  2. Believe it or not, the spoilers come from a WoB posted in the MAG. I know the usual rule about the canonicity of the MAG, but this comes directly from one of the few quotes Mr. Sanderson has in the book. My question is this. Could a Trueself (an Aluminum Ferring) steal Breath? Per the MAG: ((Upvotes to anyone who can provide additional quotes on the subject)) On Nalthis, you cannot take Breaths from people, you can only retrieve them from Type III Awakened Objects. If you give it to another person, that Breath is now theirs. If you use it to Awaken a Lifeless, a Type II Awakened Object, you cannot get the Breath back. Here is Vasher's explanation, from chapter 46: Yet only a few paragraphs later, he admits: I typically refrain from contradicting an in-world expert, and in my personal estimation, Vasher is in the Top Three experts in his personal Arcanum, alongside Shai and Silence. However, his own admission that there's a lot he doesn't understand leads me to humbly suggest that there might be a more elegant, simpler solution. We've got a few Words of Brandon on the subject. source I know I've also read WoB that Lifeless are a lot less mindless than people suspect, I know it's lightly reference in the annotation to chapter 57. EDIT: There's also this quote, provided by Kurkistan, that provides WoB support that Lifeless are more aware than people realize, from the annotations to chapter 47. Not hard-and-fast, I admit. Still, taken together, I have a theory that I think has some merit. The reason you cannot take a Breath back from a Lifeless is the same reason you cannot take it back from your neighbor; a Lifeless has enough Identity that the Breath becomes his. Mr. Sanderson even says, a Lifeless could give up its own Breath (if it were sentient enough). This leads to feruchemy. An aluminum ferring can adapt their own identity in some way to hack access to the metalminds belonging to someone else. What if this same trick lets them do the same with Breath? Let's say an Awakener Awakens a rope to Grab Things, and it ties up a Trueself. Maybe the Trueself could do a trick with his own Identity, say "Your Breath to mine," and the rope would fall to the ground, while the Trueself would now have the Breath. A further, and disturbing theory; what if he could do this with people? Walk through a crowd, taking the Breath from every shoulder he bumps against? Or what if he could remove the single Breath from Lifeless? Of course, this is all flagrant speculation. As Vasher himself says, there could be something unique in a (quasi)-living human body that truly does "stick" stronger to Breath (this would explain why objects try to take on human form when they are Awakened). I still like the idea of a Returned, with a hemalurgic spike for feruchemical aluminum, roaming the world, stealing the Breath a week he needs to survive. EDIT: Formatting EDIT2: Added an additional quote.
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