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This is a thread to talk all things Wings of Fire, Tui T. Sutherland’s YA book series about dragons! Spoilers ahead! Who are your favorite characters? What are you hoping for/predicting in the next book? So far, my favorite character is Sunny, with Fatespeaker and Cricket as close seconds. Unfortunately, Sunny doesn’t get much development outside of book 5, which disappoints me, and is also why book 5 is my favorite book of the series. Also, what did you think about Dragonslayer? I quite liked it, but I think there were a few people I’ve seen who would have preferred getting book 14 first.

I'm back with another fantasy trope that I am attempting to make more realistic, this time a personal and just all around favorite... Dragons. I believe it's common knowledge at this point that in reality, Dragons would not be able to fly with their current wingspan as in most depictions (And possibly all), and so, I have tried to calculate what an appropriate wingspan would be for Dragons. Now first off, Dragons like Larkons which are the size of birds are probably fine. The ones I'm focusing on are medium dragons (Human size) and Large dragons (Think GoT) Now, for Medium dragons, I took the weight of a 6-foot crocodile, which weighs about 2000 pounds (In reality, it's 2400, but I'm removing 400 for physical differences as well as having a little wiggle room with us being gods of our stories and being able to play around a bit.) Using this equation to calculate wingspan, Wingspan = Weight^.03326; X 2.43, I have determined that a Dragon of this size would have a wingspan of 30 feet, while a Large Dragon weighing 12,000 pounds (Weight of a T-rex) would need a wingspan of 55 feet. So dragons would look a little more like butterflies, where most of them are just wings with their 'little' body in the middle. And these are without including the weight of the wings themselves, and how easy it would be for a dragon to take off with wings that big. I put this here so one, people can check my math and tell me if and why I'm wrong and give me something more accurate for me to use, and two, so we can all talk about how these dragons would work in fantasy because the science behind dragons is quite fascinating. Also, if anyone can, could some draw a dragon with the proportional wingsspan so people an have a visual reference?

This theory has been bouncing around in my head since we first met Chiri-Chiri and, at least in my mind, became incredibly more valid after reading Dawnshard and ROW: there are creatures on Roshar that are either realted to, or are dragons. Now this will mainly be focused on larkin/lanceryn due to a few facts we have been given. 1. Larkin are sapient. Chiri-Chiri can talk and is shown to have complex thought in her interlude, a trait that is not shared by the majority of Rosharan wildlife. 2. This species was tasked to guard the Dawnshard. Given that dawnshards existed pre-Shattering and are extremely powerful, it seems odd that someone would leave them in the hands (claws?) of a random rosharan species. 3. Unique relationship with investiture. They feed off investiture, which is another trait that is, as far as we know, almost exclusive to this species. 4. "shimmering eyes of solid silver." They have metallic eyes, a trait that dragons canonically share. (Frost in the wob with him and Hoid talking on Yolen) 5. Scales. Now this one is a tad bit of a stretch due to in book quotes saying that larkin look like cremlings, but note that when Hoid lightweaves a dragon in his story to Kaladin, Kaladin describes the dragons scales as carapace. They also have faces more alike to axehounds than cremlings, and axehounds have more of a snout, like dragons are depicted in common media. I theorize that larkin were at one point a group of dragons that settled on Roshar maybe for the specific reason of protecting the dawnshard and maybe not. I believe that overtime they began to evolve to look more like rosharan wildlife in a simular manner to that of the Ryshadium. This would likely be even easier for them as they, as far as I am aware, have the most "powerful" or complex shapeshifting we have seen (know about) in the cosmere thus far. I have a whole post about the various shapeshifting in the cosmere and basically dragons can do it with no care for preserving mass. Allow me to enter into my wild speculation faze: larkins are not the only species on roshar that are related to dragons. 1. Greatshells. Tenuous connection at best, but I find it telling that aside from Aimia the larkins can only be found near the largest greatshells on the planet, those large moving island ones that the Reshi live on. This to me smells of a famial tie between those greatshells and the Larkin. Also they seem to be more intelligent than we first gave them credit for. (the chasmfiend at the end of ROW with the listeners) 2. Luckspren/Mandras. Makes sense thematically as madras are required for the larkin to grow, and they are great flying beasts. It is possible, likely even, however that mandras are in fact simply dragon spren in the same way horses have a spren, and humans as well. This leads me to... 3. Starspren. Don't tell me that when Shallan and Adolin see the starpren in the Cognitive Realm that you didn't think dragon I know you're lying, but seriously long necked winged beast with sparkly "carapace" like come on. Also the art of them in the book looks dragony to me. Here are some counterpoints: Singers and Sho-del look like humans more than say rats do, but the singers at least were created by Ado and have no evolutionary relationship to humans. Thus larkin can look like dragons but be a completely different spieces. Most greatshells don't look like dragons. Larkin need spren to grow larger presumably for the same reason as greatshells, and I don't think there are spren on Yolen thus dragons wouldn't need them to grow. I love dragons in fantasy and want to shoehorn more of them into the cosmere so I am biased. Lemme know your thoughts.

Dragonsteel is a substance that the Yolish Dragons seem to be able to produce naturally from their own bodies. Dragonsteel also sounds awfully like a godmetal. In the Dragonsteel chapters, the Sho Del apparently use it somehow in order to be able to reproduce and the short story, The Traveler seemed to imply that the substance could be used to view events happening on other Shardworlds (as Frost's eyes were rimmed with a silvery metallic sheen) Dragons are also apparently naturally immortal and shape-shifters, which depending on their method of doing so sound like they could be Investiture intensive. The former is usually a result of holding a high concentration of Investiture. The latter is true shape-shifting, not illusory. Dragons are not like the Mistwraiths & Kandra with messed up Spiritual Identity and Cognitive blockage and fooling your sDNA regarding your species is no simple Forgery, this sounds like it should require a lot of Investiture.

Hey there, so I know there are already official tabletop games for the likes of Mistborn but I'm wondering if anyone out there has created their own homebrew games or adventures? I'm trying to homebrew a DnD 5e adventure and got thinking of setting it upon Nalthis, most likely have the party teleported to the world so they are strangers to the land just as the player will be. I think it would be best if I just ignore certain facts of cannon in the Warbreaker world to make the adventuring smoother, and to run with the idea that upon entering Nalthis our adventurers becomes invested/awaken to the fact that they now possess a breath and can eventually learn the intricacies of Breath and Heightening. All this I hope to simply stack on top of the core Dungeons and Dragons mechanics rule set. Anyone out there who has tried making their own RPG adaption got any pointers or advice on how to organise this kind of cross over?

So I was reading the coppermind and I noticed that it says shard vessels don't have to be human. And we know that there is a shard that "just wants to hide and survive." I know it's probably not Frost, but I don't want to totally rule that out. Does this mean, though, that one of the vessels could be another dragon?

In the latest Shardcast the idea of Iriali metallic hair being from dragons is discussed. https://www.17thshard.com/news/shardcast/shardcast-history-of-roshar-part-2-r474/ I would argue that they have metallic hair because they have Elantrian ancestry and Elantrians have metallic silver hair. https://coppermind.net/wiki/Elantrian#Physical_Changes Its also in their name Iri like the Ire who are world hopping Elantrians Kelsier meets in MB:SH. https://coppermind.net/wiki/Ire In addition people from that region tend to have Aonic-ish 3 letter names like Evi and Toh.

Is there any specific times Brandon has said Hoid isn't a dragon? There's probably some really solid answer to this, but I thought that I'd just see if anyone knows off the top of their head rather than me deep-diving into the archives.

Just a short little opinion on shapeshiting within the cosmere, and the most powerful form of it we’ve seen (from least to most): Siah Aimians- shapeshifting is limited to adding pigment to the skin, as far as we know. Decendents Of Returned- Siri and Viv, have the ability to change hair color, as well as mildly modify their features, such as Viv adding scars and folds to her eyes. Dakor Monks- Easily forgotten about, but they have shown the ability to change facial features and body composition. This is what begins to separate the shapeshifters in my opinion. The ability to change the mass of your person as you shapeshift. Kandra- Now I know it is stated that Kandra cannot change their mass while shapeshifting, but given Ten Soon’s ability to “eat” a dog, horse, and a human. We are going to assume that is not quite true. Dysian Aimians- In truth this spot is interchangeable with kandra imo. We do not know enough about these cremlingbodied fellows to tell for sure the limit of their abilities, but they can flawlessly replicate a human body and features and can presumably replicate anyone’s faster than a kandra can and without killing them. Returned/Heralds/Cognitive Shadows- This is where we start getting into the least understood and arguably most powerful, and versatile forms of shapeshifting. Due to their nature as cognitive entities, Returned can change their features and body composition simply by thought. It is extreme enough to allow Vasher to take a significant amount of his mass away as he is in his human disguise. Heralds either highjack a body of a human and change it to match their features, or form a body out of pure investiture, which is pushing the boundaries of what I call shapeshifting but is an important magical ability. Kelsier also may posses similar abilities to the heralds. Dragons- Now the shapeshifting abilities of dragons are teetering on the edge of cannon, that said within dragonsteel prime they have shown extreme mass reduction from a full size dragon form to human. Whether this is the limit of their abilities is something I would love to discuss in the replies. I hope everyone enjoyed a refresher list of shapeshifting in the cosmere, if I missed anything, or you disagree with my list let me know!

So, no WoBs or anything, because I don't have my copperminds with me today, so I'll check The Coppermind, but there are dragons in the Cosmere. But what is a Cosmerean Dragon? By the deeds of Brandon Tropebreaker, I doubt that such dragons would be the winged beasts that we are all very familiar with in common fantasy. This is not common fantasy, this is High Fantasy of the Highest Order! So what would a dragon be? Would it have wings, be quadrupedal or bipedal (I think it's safe to say they are reptilian), etc? Share your thoughts on the Dragons of the Cosmere.

When reading through Words of Radiance I noticed a similarity between the map of the Shattered Plains and the picture at the beginning of The Way of Kings that depicted the glyphs for the KR and their surges (see pictures below). Both of these images appear to have two dragons facing each other (or at least what I think are dragons, for they look a lot like what I would imagine a dragon looking like). In the case of the KR picture, you can see the entire body of both the dragons, while in the map of the Shattered Plains only the heads can be seen, yet they are unmistakably the same heads as the ones in the picture of the KR. If you think they look like something else be sure to comment it! I am unsure about what this means, but I believe that it most likely has to do with the reason the plains are shattered in addition to something about, most likely the founding of, the Knights Radiant. There is also a glyph repeated, forming a frame, around the side of the picture of the KR. I have drawn it so it can be seen easier. I am unsure what this glyph means, though I am pretty sure it is important as it is in the very first page of the Stormlight Archive in addition to being displayed largely on Sanderson's webpage, or if the meaning of it is known. If the meaning of it is known please tell me! Here are the photos that were talked about. I have circled and labeled the parts I talked about for your convenience. KR: Shattered Plains: I apologize if it is hard to read. Look for the text and then follow the arrows from them if you cannot find the circles.

Hello all. I am trying to make a D&D world fit with Cosmere rules, in the hopes that eventually I will be running it as a campaign world for my friends. I have much of it nailed down (e.g., all D&D planes save the Prime Material, the Astral, and the Far Realms no longer exist as planes in their own right, I have Shards in place for multiple magic systems, etc., I have a not-quite Earthlike planetary system in place for visual interest, but all of those are separate topics). However, what I'm having trouble with is the physiology of the dragons. (And I want to have dragons because they're in the storming title of the storming system, and I think I can do something interesting with them) An adult dragon (upwards of 100 years of age) has not 6 limbs, but 10: 5 pairs of arms, legs, and/or wings, decided upon during their previous age categories. With age comes an increased facility with manipulating their Cognitive selves, such that they can convert much of their mass into Investiture and in so doing take humanoid shape. However, how exactly that Investiture gets into their system in the first place is what I'm having trouble pinning down. D20srd says "A dragon’s metabolism operates like a highly efficient furnace and can metabolize even inorganic material," which I'm sort of using as a starting point, but the details beyond that elude me. Do they ingest Investiture-viable things like Mistborn do? Do they absorb it directly like Taldaini sand does or like Knights Radiant do? Do they go a third route altogether? I'm not certain. And this one question will decide a lot of other things about how dragons work.