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  1. Today I was thinking about how the highspren interact with their knights differently than any other order that we've seen so far. For one thing, they hang around in the Physical Realm to observe the squires. This seems weird to me because, if they are like the other radiant spren, they're running the risk of losing their sentience by hanging out too long in the Physical Realm. Second, the knight-spren relationship seems closer to a veteran-rookie relationship than a partnership based on the fact that the spren chooses when the knight completes their Crusade, the knight must get to the Second Oath before bonding a spren, and they seem to hide from their knight even after bonding. The biggest difference is how much control Nale has over the order. He can choose who joins and is the only 5th order knight around. I think there's a potential explanation for these differences: Nale has (maybe by accident) formed protobond with all of the highspren currently found in the Order which allows them to hang around like this and gives him more control over all of them. I think the timeline roughly goes like this: Before Nale joins the order, the differences are mentioned above is minimized outside of the fact that they're concerned with justice as police officers, judges, and etc. Nale joins and immediately has enormous influence due to the fact that he's the Herald of Justice. Nale ascends to the Fifth Order. Every Skybreaker after this feels weird about ascending to the Fifth Order because it would be strange to be his peer. The result is that Nale now is the Skybreaker Herald and routinely commands everyone including the highspren. The highspren get used to him commanding them over the centuries and may even view him like the Honorspren view the Stormfather. Eventually, Nale's "metaphysical mass" (for lack of a better term) as Herald, the centuries spent shaping the order into his own image, and the fact that the spren are used to him bossing them around, they develop a protobond with him which allows them to hang around much longer in the Physical Realm. Because the spren can spend so much time in Physical Realm, they walk into every bond after this with the assumption that they know more than their Radiant and should be treated as the senior member of the partnership. What do you think?
  2. This is a simple observation. Despite Skybreakers being known to follow all laws, and Brandon even saying that the generic Second Oath is "I swear to follow the law", Szeth never swore to follow the law. His second oath was "I swear to seek justice, to let it guide me, until I find a more perfect Ideal". This is not explicitly an oath to follow any law, and considering Szeth being willing to take advantage of technicalities of phrasing (like with the dye-throwing contest), he can get away with breaking laws if he thinks they are unjust and gets his highspren to agree. His Third Ideal is also not to follow exactly the laws of the land (as many Skybreakers do) but rather to follow Dalinar, which still does not explicitly restrict him to legal actions.
  3. Welcome to the order of the Skybreakers. A home for the patriotic, the religiously zealous, and the firm believers in right. The faint in heart and disloyal will find no shelter here. To join, simply speak the hallowed oaths; Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination. I will seek justice until I find a more perfect ideal. I want to hear all about your “perfect ideal”. In a way, everyone swears themselves to something. For me, that something is (apart from my church) upholding American ideals.
  4. I know I’m not alone in struggling to see Skybreakers as not sorta evil, particularly in comparison to Windrunners. Like it seems to come down to Honor vs. the Law, which seems pretty biased. Especially when the easiest comparison is best boy Kaladin vs. dumpster fire Szeth. After some thought here’s my outline for how Skybreakers are actually kinda valid. Skybreakers are their core are about consistency and fairness. It's not so much the law, as a willingness to follow a personal code, that Nale is most interested in (WOB). So it’s not really about following the law. It’s about following a code. It’s not supposed to be about abdicating moral decision making. It’s supposed to be about putting fairness over your own opinion. By swearing themselves to a code, Skybreakers are trying to transcend their own biases. This doesn’t mean Skybreakers can’t be flexible. See Szeth choosing to punish the Warden over prisoners (OB). In fact, the pattern of Skybreaker ideals is about developing and understanding your own set of ethics. Kant would probably be a great Skybreaker. 2nd Ideal: “I swear to seek justice, to let it guide me until I find a more perfect Ideal.” and “I will put the law before all else” It's about making a commitment to justice, a promise to follow a higher authority than your own biases. Notably, unlike the next, this ideal gives the flexibility to try out different codes and rules of ethics. A 2nd level Skybreaker is working to eliminating biases and exploring different ethical frameworks. 3rd Oath of Dedication Here the Skybreaker makes a commitment to a specific external code/authority. It could be a person (Dalinar) or it could be "the law of the land" or anything. The Skybreaker has explored what exists and chosen a code they think is most just. 4th Ideal of Crusade I think this is supposed to function as a test of the code they’ve chosen to follow, like a practical version of thought experiments like the Trolley problem. The Radiant has to see how the code they’ve chosen applies to a real-world situation they have a deep personal investment in. It’s both a test of the Skybreaker (how well can you ignore your own bias to apply a code) and also a test of the law they’ve chosen to follow (does it actually work in the real world). 5th Ideal of Law The Skybreaker has gained such an in-depth understanding of ethics and proven ability to ignore bias that they grow beyond the need for an external guide and ‘become the law’. This is were they synthesize everything learned through the other ideals and formulate their own set of ethics. Side Note: An example of a case where a Skybreaker might make a “better” (at least to my view) decision than a Windrunner would be Kaladin’s WOR dilemma. Both a Skybreakers and Windrunner would have a similar problem: help my friend get justice vs. support the assassination of someone I’m guarding. The Windrunner (Kaladin) is supposed to protect people, and people therefore either fall into the ‘protect’ or ‘protect from’ category. Elhokar ends up getting slotted into the ‘protect’ category and Moash into ‘protect from’. He saves someone’s life temporarily but ultimately does nothing to help the underlying issue. Elhokar never has to confront what he did to Moash and Moash still wants blood. A Skybreakers is supposed to find justice. Elhokar doesn’t deserve to die for negligence and being a bad leader but Moash was truly wronged and has valid complaints. To be just would balance that Elhokar both deserves to live but also to be punished. A good (not modern) Skybreaker could better equipped to take in the grey areas of issues. In short, Skybreakers play the role of the legal system while Windrunners are more like first responders. The Windrunner keeps people from being murdered but a Skybreaker's role is to figure out how it got to the point of murder in the first place.
  5. Our aircraft fight each other with guns and missiles. Our preferred position to kill an adversarial aircraft is behind it and often slightly above. This is because Bullets and missiles are much faster than aircraft Sight is best to the front, visually and by radar It is easier to aim the whole aircraft Your missile gets your speed and height To achieve that position you use maneuver. Aircraft differ in their characteristics for maneuvering by direction. It makes a difference whether you are going up and down versus left or right. Airplanes cannot turn on the spot. A user of gravitaion is quite different. They are failing, not flying aerodynamically. Hence: They can go into full reverse. Changing acceleration 180 degrees is an option. You cannot stall. Any attitude is possible in the air. You cannot be behind and above an enemy. Pursuit means that you are under an enemy. You cannot trade height for speed and vice versa. You are always at the very top and falling. You cannot roll with Gravitation The weapons are also quite different. Unless you are going straight down, any missile will always fall behind or sideways quickly, as it does not share your acceleration and the speed you can add to a spear is small compared to the speeds you are falling at. And good luck handling bow and arrow or a crossbow under these conditions. Naively I'd try to get into the position to stab an enemy into the back or to get into grappling range with you facing your enemy's back. Direct pursuit is a bad idea. Anything nasty he drops will hit you. Our maneuvers for air combat as far as they trading potential energy for kinetic energy, will not work.
  6. So I’ve been bouncing this idea around for a while, and finally decided to type it up. So we know that Pattern bonded Shallan when she was younger, to the point that she could summon her shardblade (to kill her mum). After this she regresses somehow, possibly due to her self-forgetting stuff. Another example we know much less about is Tien, Kaladin’s younger brother. We don’t know a lot about what he did in Amaram’s army, but it is implied that he had reached a point in his Ideals that caught the attention of the Skybreakers enough that Nale felt he needed to be eliminated. I personally think he was at the first Ideal, but have little proof to back that up. So: what are the common threads in these two young lives? My theory: not their own lies, but the lies of those around them. We know that (Pattern at least) Cryptics are very curious about humans. Lyrin was hiding the gem theft, and we know that this caused a lot of strife in Hearthstone. Shallan’s mother was involved somehow with the Skybreakers before her death, and Lin was dealing with political issues (or was that just after Shallan’s mum died?) as well as dealing with debts. Also maybe the Ghostbloods. We know that Pattern is interested in the lies of people besides Shallan. Shallan and Tien are both “the light” of their respective households. The Lightweavers have been described as the “spiritual sustainers” of the Radiants. They are both artistic, and very curious about the world around them. If Cryptics are the spren of natural forces and the laws of nature, the interests of the spren and the knight would align in this. A few other parallels I don’t think are relevant: Shallan and Tien each have depressed older brothers. They are both interested in the creatures around them. They like gentle rains. Please point out anything that I’ve missed!
  7. In OB did we see any skybreakers mention having shardplate or getting shardplate ?
  8. From the album: Fanart

    Another version of my picture of Szeth with some fancy stormlight and Nightblood effects.
  9. From the album: Fanart

    I had this piece in my mind for far too long and I'm so happy I finally came around drawing it!
  10. "This Ideal is also called the Ideal of Crusade, and requires that a Skybreaker undertake a personal quest and complete it to the satisfaction of their highspren. Once completed, the Skybreaker is elevated to the rank of master."- The Coppermind. So what are all of your personal quests? Have some fun with it! I will cleanse my room of all disorder, so long as my procrastination agrees. -Zallek Windblade
  11. In Oathbringer we see Szeth and some other Skybreaker 'squires'/hopefuls progress from squire to a Knight Radiant. We've also seen Bridge Four having squires under Kaladin and some of them became Windrunners themselves. It struck me that there's a huge difference between the process of how the Skybreakers and Windrunners we've seen become squires and (full) Radiants after that. Gathering facts: (I will assume that Szeth follows the standard Skybreaker procedure) Kaladin is able to breathe in Stormlight after he speaks his First Ideal, but Szeth is only able to breathe in Stormlight after he speaks his Second Ideal. In all cases we've seen the Radiant speaks his/her Ideal to his/her spren, but when a Skybreaker swears the First and Second Ideal it is accepted by higher members of the order, in other words: by humans. Kaladin and Shallan get squires (who can breathe in Stormlight and can Surgebind without their own spren) out of people whom they see as part of their group. Skybreakers can only Surgebind and breathe in Stormlight after they speak the Second Ideal, but they still don't have their own Spren at that moment. Kaladin thinks of Bridge Four as 'his men' no matter if they're squire or not, but Skybreaker master wait to accept a squire as 'their apprentice' until the squire has sworn the Second Ideal. Windrunners bond a spren with the First Ideal, but Skybreakers bond a spren with the Third Ideal. In both orders a squire seems to be more likely to attract a spren than a non-squire. My interpretation: I think that Skybreaker hopefuls are trained to have the characteristics and personality of a full Skybreaker in order to be more likely to attract an own highspren. If my theory is correct, nothing really happens when a Skybreaker swears his First and Second Ideal, but they will be living up to the Ideals they have already sworn. After speaking the Second Ideal a Skybreaker master is willing to accept a hopeful as his/her squire, and for that reason they get access to Surgebinding and Stormlight from that point onwards (if only when their master is near). This way Skybreakers can already begin their training before they have even started to attract a spren, but will probably impress a highspren sooner or later because of this training. Then we see Szeth bond his highspren. But hey ...!? Didn't he swear his Third Ideal at that moment? Yes he did. This would mean that Szeth actually only became a squire at his Second Ideal (before that he was just a hopeful), and when he finally bonded his highspren he instantaneously promoted from squire to full Radiant of the Third Ideal.
  12. From the album: General SA Art

    Law is light, and darkness does not serve it. Finally finished this! My favorite order other than the Lightweavers =) Highspren are just so cool! More KR lineup pieces to come!
  13. So do we have confirmation (via WoB) that Oathbringer was the Bondsmith book? Brandon has confirmed that just because a books flashback is about one character, doesn’t mean the Knights Radiant Order focused on in the book has to be theirs. My question stems from the fact that other than Dalinar’s whole Unity thing going on, which we don’t understand yet anyway, plus a little showcase of his Surges, how much info did we get about Bondsmiths in general. (As I write this I realize there were all the conversations about the Sibling, but still, not that much stuff) On the other hand, we learn ALOT about Nale and the Skybreakers, their training, their hierarchy, their mindset, their ideals. In fact, this is the only Order of Radiants that we’ve seen even hinting at the 5th ideal. I haven’t seen much about this but if I’m missing something, please fill me in
  14. So I was rereading era two and I thought wax would make a pretty awesome skybreaker. He said he always told on other children when they broke the rules and the fact that he is a lawman could make it work. Combining it with being a crasher would be amazing There will probably be mistborn spoilers and possible oathbringer spoilers since we see the skybreakers there
  15. From the album: Stormlight Archive desktop wallpapers

    I decided to create some more simplistic version of the different order wallpapers, starting with the Skybreakers.
  16. From the album: Stormlight Archive desktop wallpapers

    1920x1080 wallpaper using the general Skybreaker's second ideal. (If you'd like a version with one of Szeth's ideals, just comment.)
  17. Epic matchup: Szeth Son Son Vallano V.R.S. Hulk, Iron Man, Captain America, Hawkeye, Thor, Black Widow, War Machine, Falcon, and Spider Man. Who do you guys think would win? In my opinion it would be Szeth, because he could just draw Nightblood and throw it at Hulk’s feet. Hulk would destroy the Avengers and Szeth would finish them off.
  18. Ok so I have a couple theories on some of the things that Division can do in the Stormlight Archive. •Rot: someone using Division could theoretically cause something to rot, mold and die. •Blasts of Stormlight: similar to how Kaladin fire blasts of adhesive Stormlight that causes people and things to stick to it, a Skybreaker/Dustbringer can in theory fire blasts of Stormlight that burn through any thing or person that it touches.
  19. So I want to talk about the Skybreakers. I know that they are conflicted because of their oaths, but it doesn't seem as straight forward as "we will support the parshmen as the lawful heirs of Roshar." I don't think that the Skybreakers are going to simply start taking orders from Odium. The Fused want to eliminate humanity from Roshar and Odium seems to have promised this to them. But it seems like Shinovar was given to the human so I can't see the Skybreakers supporting an Odium/Fused assault on Shinovar. The Aimians also seem to be native to Roshar, so I can't see the Skybreakers supporting Odium over the Aimians. There are humans with Parshendi heritage. I think that the Skybreakers will have trouble working against them. This includes the Horneaters, the Herazidans, and perhaps the Natanatans and even some of the people from Jah Keved. Odium is the interloping shard, Honor and Cultivation are in some sense the native shards, so it becomes difficult to support Odium over Honor and Cultivation. The translated stele says that the Parshendi were commanded by their gods to welcome the humans, that seems to legitimize human presence on Roshar. The Skybreakers are in a tough place, but I don't think that their oaths require them to support a genocidal campaign against the humans.
  20. So - let’s talk about the Skybreakers. They are all about the law. Nale has been convinced that the law he should be following in this conflict is that of the Singers (something that he wasn’t previously convinced of, but has later decided upon). This is terrible. And makes me think he needs Lift to hug him again. Why is this terrible? Because Odium. Odium has corrupted the singers, and by proxy their law. Much as he was corrupting the Alethi, but even more pervasively. But Nale is right in this - humans aren’t exactly innocents, and their laws aren’t necessarily trustworthy. Plus, the Singers ought to be treated fairly. So what does Nale need? He needs the Geneva Conventions. Less anachronistically, he and his Skybreakers need to get outside of the Singer/Human conflict and fight for true Justice. They need to fight against war crimes. They need to protect non-combatants and punish war criminals. In this way, they would support both the humans and the Singers while foiling Odium, because what does Odium crave? What does he inspire? Hate. And hate leads to war crimes (as war crimes lead to more hate). So we need Nale to get his head together and set up the International Court of Justice.
  21. Hey Sharders! Sorry about the title, it just feels right though. I know this theory has some holes in it. I can see some main ones myself. But I'm still going to post it. For me it started like this: Could the screams that Szeth hears be related to the screams of the dead Shardblades? I then thought that Szeth could have already been bonded to a spren, and that was why he heard screams. One of the things that go against this is that his Blade is not a spren, and therefore would not scream when he touches it. I also found a WoB that says directly that Szeth isn't bonded to a spren, so... Obviously, Szeth has had some emotional and mental trauma. (Hearing screams whenever you blink can do that to a person.) Anyway, his Honorblade once belonged to a Herald who had to go to a place of pain and torture between Desolations. Could this mean that his Blade "remembers" the pain and makes it's wielder hear screams? That's one idea. Another is that when Honor died, the Honorblades suffered and now scream, or something like that. In short it's like this: He hears screams because he's already bonded to a spren. (I'm pretty sure this one is false) He hears screams because he mentally unstable and his Blade had decided to be reminiscent. (More plausible than the first one) The Honorblades were somehow broken or are suffering now that Honor is dead. (Also plausible) Let me know what you guys think.
  22. So I was wondering why szeth didn't become a skybreaker a long time ago,and I must say I'm surprised even baffled that szeth hasn't yet bonded or at least attracted a highspren,given how that guy sticks with the law to the very end,hell even the order's patron was attracted to szeth and even invited him to the order,I know some people will object that no spren will choose szeth because some of the things that he does are evil even kaladin mentioned it,but I don't think the highspren will worry about that,skybreakers are all about following the law no matter what,their second ideal is "I will put the law before all else." And to szeth he is just following the laws of the shin. Skybreakers don't care if their actions seem evil or not right,if you break the law they will execute you without any hesitancy and with no mercy,look at how Nale for example executed ym because he unwittingly played a part in the poisoning and death of a person or how he wanted to execute lift (who's a child) for petty stealing,so I doubt skybreakers and highspren will bother much about szeth previous killings and assassinations because he was technically following the law Why do you think he doesn't have a spren? Or is that he has already attracted a spren but that the spren hasn't revealed itself to him yet? Like how syl was following kaladin since when he was in amaram's army but never revealed herself to him until he later became a slave in the wagon,personally I do think in my opinion that even if szeth doesn't have a spren now,he'll eventually attract one now that he has been officially invited to the order.
  23. So, I've put this idea out in passing on some other threads, and thought that such an important event deserved its own thread. Basically, who tried to kill Amaram on the battlefield? Who was Helaran working for? Now, the two most likely options, based off of textual evidence between WoK and WoR, are the Skybreakers and the Ghostbloods. After the assassination, Amaram mentions the Ghostbloods as the prime suspects. However, Mraize tells Shallan that Helaran had looked for the Skybreakers. Personally, my feeling is that Helaran was working for Nalan and the Skybreakers, and I will explain why. First off, the Skybreakers definitely have the resources to get a shardblade and plate, as Nalan is carrying one around with him. Even if that is actually Nalan's honorblade, which it might be, it would provide the Skybreakers with the capabilities to forcefully take another blade and plate, which Szeth could have done 10 times with Jezrien's honorblade. Second, the evidence does not suggest that the Ghostbloods want to kill Amaram. Instead, the evidence suggests that they want to capture him, and Helaran's charge does not suggest that the be the intent. The poison dart at the end of WoR was coated with a paralysis poison, not a fatal one. Now, some people may ask "Why would Nalan want to kill Amaram? He's busy killing surgebinders!". Nalan is not simply killing surgebinders, he is attempting to prevent a desolation from occurring, and surgebinding causes (or Nalan thinks it causes) desolations to occur. Not so incidentally, Amaram and the Sons of Honor are attempting to start a new desolation to cause the Heralds to return, and appeared to be attempting to drive the Parshendi to adopt stormform (perhaps Restares supplied Venli with the stormspren?). This would be more than enough reason for Nalan to arrange for a special kill. To be clear, Nalan could not have killed Amaram himself. Nalan is a constable in Azir, and likely holds similar positions in all the kingdoms and provinces of those kingdoms, meaning that Amaram would be off-limits to him, since he did not commit a crime. However, a random member of the Skybreakers with no prior affiliation to Amaram would have free reign to... say... join an army that Amaram happened to be fighting at the time, bring some shards, ride into battle, then make a beeline for Amaram and kill him. Essentially, Helaran was said Skybreaker. As for why Nalan didn't make another attempt on Amaram's life, that's easy. Amaram's leg was completely shattered. In fact, his bridge run with Sadeas was almost certainly his first combat action since the injury, so Nalan didn't have another opportunity to kill him in battle. In addition, Nalan likely did not know about Kaladin, or else he likely would have executed Amaram immediately. And for the final reason, Amaram and Sadeas were fighting together, and it would be too risky to attack multiple shardbearers and risk even more of the Skybreaker's resources. And there we go. Who agrees with my "Nalan sent Helaran to kill Amaram on the Battlefield" theory? Who disagrees? Who has any new culprits that could have pulled off the attempt? Please discuss! Edit: Oudeis suggested that Helaran's intent may not have actually been to kill Amaram. I do not believe this to be the case. Amaram's leg got pinned by Helaran. A slightly different position easily could have severed an artery and killed Amaram. For a capture mission, that would have way too large of a risk of killing him.
  24. Several months ago I posted a theory on what the surges of Cohesion and Tension do. Here is a link to that post, but I'll sum it up below: Cohesion: Weaken, or even dissolve the intermolecular bonds within a substance. Tension: Strengthen the bonds within a substance However, this theory has a major problem: the actual force of cohesion (wikipedia page) holds substances together, while in my theory Cohesion breaks them apart. Also, my idea for the Surge of Tension doesn't have much to do with what Tension actually is. (and the Coppermind page says that it alters the stiffness of an object.) So, here is my new theory for what the Surges of Cohesion, Division, and Tension do: Cohesion: Strengthen the intermolecular/atomic bonds within a substance or object. Example uses: - Create a wall of solid air by strengthening the bonds between the air molecules. - Make your armor virtually impregnable by strengthening the metallic bonding. Tension: Make a substance stiffer--increase its tension Example uses: - Stiffen a carpet, allowing people to walk on it--and then when they've fallen for your trap, release it, and watch them fall into your strategically located pit. - Walk on water by increasing its surface tension Division: Weaken, or even dissolve the bonds that hold an object together. The opposite of Cohesion. Example uses: - Weaken the intermolecular bonds that hold your enemies together, and watch them dissolve into piles of sludge. - Destroy the bonds that hold a wall together, allowing you to walk right through. That's my new theory. Please reply with feedback, speculation, and/or possible uses for these powers.
  25. This has been bugging me. Which organization do these two belong to? My conclussions: Restares is a Son of Honor who was second in command before Gavilar's assassination. Now that Gavilar is dead, I believe that Restares is in charge because Mraize refers to Amaram (speculation) as one of Restares cronies.
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