Jump to content

Search the Community

Showing results for tags 'harmony'.

  • Search By Tags

    Type tags separated by commas.
  • Search By Author

Content Type


Categories

  • Brandon and Book News
  • Events, Signings, & Giveaways
  • Columns and Features
  • Site News
  • Shardcast

Forums

  • 17th Shard
    • Introduce Yourself!
    • 17th Shard Discussion
    • The Coppermind Wiki
    • Arcanum Discussion
  • Brandon Sanderson
    • General Brandon Discussion
    • Events and Signings
    • Sanderson Fan Works
    • Arcanum, the Brandon Sanderson Archive
  • Spoiler Zone
  • The Cosmere
    • Cosmere Q&A
    • Cosmere Discussion
    • Stormlight Archive
    • Mistborn
    • Other Cosmere
  • Non-Cosmere Works
    • Cytoverse
    • Other Non-Cosmere
    • The Wheel of Time
  • Related Works
    • Writing Excuses and Intentionally Blank
    • Reading Excuses
    • Sanderson Curiosities & Unpublished Works
    • TWG Archive
  • Community
    • General Discussion
    • Entertainment Discussion
    • Forum Games & Random Stuff
    • Creator's Corner
    • Roleplaying
    • Social Groups, Clans, & Guilds

Blogs

  • Chaos' Blog
  • Leinton's Blog
  • 17th Shard Blog
  • KChan's Blog
  • Puck's Blag
  • Brandon's Blog
  • The Name of your Blog
  • Darth Squirrely's Blog
  • Tales of a Firebug
  • borborygmus' Blog
  • Zeadman's Blog
  • zas678's Blog
  • The Basement
  • Addy's Avocations
  • Seshperankh's Blog
  • First time reading The Well Of Ascension
  • Zarepath's Blog
  • "I Have Opinions About Books"
  • Test
  • Which actors would you like to see playing the characters of Mistborn?
  • Drifted Mists
  • Jaron's Realm
  • Roshar Speculative Theories
  • ChrisHamatake's Blog
  • Paradox Flint's Blog
  • Deoradhan's Blog
  • Storm Blessed's Blog
  • Elwynn's Blog
  • firstRainbowRose's Blog
  • Rotabush ShardBlog
  • Hoid's Compendium
  • InterContinental Adventures
  • Claincy Creates
  • Theories, quotes, and details to keep it all straight.
  • WoR Thoughts and Questions
  • Blogfalcon
  • David Coppercloud's Blog
  • yurisses' notes and theories
  • Lark Adventures
  • LUNA's Poetry
  • Inspiration Board
  • Trying to be Useful for a Change
  • Cosmere Nerd Things
  • The Way of Toasters
  • An Elephant's Blog
  • Shhh Spoilers for Ronald.
  • Wyn's Adventures in Geekiness
  • Words With Ene
  • Dapper's Blog
  • Things to talk about, stuff to do
  • Zelly's Healthy-Accountability Blog
  • Dapper's Music Blog
  • GM Test Blog
  • Rhythm of War Liveblog
  • Zephy’s Art Blog
  • Axioms Idioms & Adages
  • Weather Reports
  • Unnecessarily Overcomplicated
  • 5
  • The Blog of Dubious Copyright Legality
  • Trutharchivist's Rambles
  • Xino's corner of insanity
  • The Perfect Space Opera
  • My Journey Through Roshar (A Liveblog)
  • Lost Metal Liveblog by ccstat
  • D&D campaign design.
  • My Depression Log
  • Story Ideas and Whatnot
  • deltarune AU concept.
  • How I Relate to Every Character in The Stormlight Archive
  • A thing
  • random jank and jabber.
  • FNF crem

Find results in...

Find results that contain...


Date Created

  • Start

    End


Last Updated

  • Start

    End


Filter by number of...

Joined

  • Start

    End


Group


Website URL


AIM


MSN


ICQ


Yahoo


Jabber


Skype


Member Title


Location


Interests

  1. I'm probably deeply misguided for thinking this. But hear me out. This has been bugging me for YEARS. Since the first time I read and completed the mistborn trilogy as a teenager. And it seems like no one’s addressed it. At least not comprehensively. So I will attempt to now. I humbly ask that you read the whole thing through before commenting. So you can see the full picture I’m trying to paint. Then judge my argument on its full merit. I am very open to the (probable) reality that I am very wrong. Still, it can't hurt to rant a bit ya? Brandon Sanderson (A living printer & absolute gigachad of an author) has either made the biggest accidental blunder regarding one of the most important magic systems in the Cosmere. Or has been setting up one of the biggest plot twists in the Cosmere’s history. And this is why; Allomancy, which Brandon categorised as ‘Preservation’s power’ in era one. Is NOT actually Preservation’s power, but rather Harmony’s. And I will be attempting to convince you that that is the case. Argument: Allomancy, functionally, has nothing to do with preservation, but in contrast, ferruchemy absolutely does. Ferruchemy’s whole shtick is that it allows its user to preserve attributes within metals for a practically indefinite amount of time for use later on. While allomancy on the other hand, not only doesn’t give one the power to preserve anything. But instead REQUIRES that one destroys metals by burning them in order to gain investiture and abilities. Yes, you get more out than you put in. But the same could be said about splitting an atom in a nuclear fission reaction. You destroy something in order to gain the power to do something. Ruin’s influence within this magic system is quite obvious. And yet we can’t say that it is purely his power, because even though mistborn are walking killing machines. Their power can be used to create and preserve just as well. (Ferruchemy being Preservation’s power also acts as a perfect contrast to hemallurgy. The two are exact mirrors of each other, just as the shards are.) Ferruchemy preserves. Pure and simple. Hemallurgy kills, steals, twists, and decays. Allomancy on the other hand just doesn’t quite fit either shard completely. It’s the odd one out. It always has been. Allomancy is an end-positive power precisely because it is not Preservation, or Ruins’ power singularly. And we can deduce this by looking at the natures of the two shards themselves. On their own, neither shard is capable of creating. Only preserving or destroying. Neither one is capable of producing an end-positive system. It was only when the two shards came together, agreeing to work in harmony. That they had the power to create an entire planet, biosphere, and human race entirely from scratch. Harmony did that. Not Preservation. Not Ruin. But the harmonious efforts of the two shards. And later on at the end of era one. It was only through the unification of the shards into Harmony that all the mistakes and errors made by either shard could be mended, and the world restored to its original state. The entire story is about Harmony. Harmony created the world. But once the world was created, and the agreement between the two shards fulfilled, discord followed. The two shards warred, each motivated by opposing intents. Leading to the gradual destruction of their world. And in the end, it was only the rebirth and re-establishment of Harmony that put it all back together. This thematic truth can also be observed within the characters themselves. One could argue that Vin’s entire story was about finding harmony within herself. Learning to accept the fact that she can’t cling to everything and everyone hoping that they don’t change. That they don’t leave her alone(Preservation.) While simultaneously accepting the darker parts of herself. Her capacity for violence is foremost among them(Ruin.) And through the marriage of these two sides of her, the part that seeks to protect, and the part that causes destruction. She finds harmony within herself. Learning to use that destructive force for the sake of preservation. The ruin within her yields to the preservation within her. And it is that resultant internal harmony that not only makes her so potent a mistborn, but gives her the strength to sacrifice herself to destroy Ati once and for all. Mistborn are children of Harmony. And this truth can also be seen by simply thinking about what separates them from all other allomancers. As well as what separates the normal mistborn from the great ones. Their ability to use all of their abilities in conjunction with each other to accomplish incredible acts. Vin’s creativity, her willingness to experiment, to see how two metals no matter how unrelated their powers may first seem, could work in unison with each other to produce unexpected and fantastic results. That is what made her a force of nature. Vin is the greatest mistborn we’ve ever seen precisely because she, more than any other character, mastered the art of using ALL her abilities in harmony. Viewing them as complementary pieces within a greater harmonious whole, rather than entirely distinct and separate elements. The way others, such as mistings, typically would. Counter: Platitudes! That’s all a stretch. We know that allomancy is preservation’s power because it comes from consuming beads of lerasium! Rebuttal: Does it though? This wouldn’t be the first time that the characters in the story said one thing about the nature of a metal, only for Brandon to come out later stating the opposite. I.e Atium’s true nature in era 1. So the same thing could be said about ‘Lerasium.’ I think that what we’ve been led to believe is ‘Lerasium’ is actually ‘Harmonium.’ And the fact that the beads are only found around the well of ascension is evidence of this. Why? Because the well of ascension is the location of the final clash between Ruin and Preservation. It is where Preservation died, sacrificing himself to trap ruin. I believe that when the two shards clashed here, the two clashing investitures produced beads of Harmonium as a side effect, scattering them around the well. And that it is the consumption of Harmonium that actually makes one a mistborn, not Lerasium. Counter: But in Era 2 we see what ‘Harmonium’ is actually like. It doesn’t make people mistborn. It stores allomantic charges and is extremely reactive and combustible. It can’t even be consumed! Rebuttal: Aha, exactly! Because what we see in era 2 isn’t actually ‘Harmonium.’ It’s DISCORDIUM! Somewhere in between the end of era one and the start of era two, something went wrong with either Sazed, his shard, or both. And this is what led to the shift in his shard’s capabilities and attributes in era 2. It is why he’s incapable of wielding the same degree of power he did at the end of era one. Because he’s not in harmony any more, he’s discordant. And that subtle shift has been reflected in his god-metal, twisting it from an inert metal, something that creates mistborn, to a hyper reactive metal capable of nuking cities if agitated enough. It also fits with the hero of ages prophecy. “They shall call him discord(not harmony!), and they will love him for it.” Counter: Okay then but if the beads that create mistborn are actually shards of ‘Harmonium’ created when Preservation and Ruin last battled at the well of ascension. Then what does true Lerasium actually do? Where do mistings come from? Why is it that Vin could burn Preservation’s mist to fuel her allomancy? Argument: Simple. Lerasium’s true property is that it creates ferruchemists. And in order to better support that, I need only ask. Why is it that only Sazed’s people have ferruchemy. What distinguishes them from other people on Scadrial? Simple, they are the only group of people that have been living around Preservation’s perpendicularity for centuries. They are the closest to preservation’s influence than any other group of people on the planet. I believe that either through continued exposure to high levels of preservation’s investiture over countless generations. Or the consumption of trace amounts of lerasium forming within the environment around the perpendicularity. Or even just being descended from the initial group of people who discovered the perpendicularity, who perhaps interacted with it and consumed the invesiture there somehow. And then passed on the power genetically. Mistings emerge naturally because all humans on scadrial have souls formed from both preservation and ruin. And I believe that a misting could snap from both the white or the black mist. Vin was able to use preservation’s mists to fuel her allomancy because 1) she aligned with the shard’s intent very strongly, hence why only she had the power to do this. And 2) She could absolutely have done the same thing with Ruin’s black mist if her personality aligned with his shard’s intent instead. Because allomancy arises from the union of both shards’ powers. Whichever one you can use to fuel it is entirely dependant on how strongly you align with the intent and not with the nature of your allomantic abilities. Counter: But in era 2 we see that when Wax splits ettmetal it produces atium and trace amounts of lerasium, which then go on to turn him and Wayne into mistborn! Rebuttal: No, we think that’s what happened, because that’s what the characters think happened. But the truth is, none of the characters actually know what true Lerasium is. Or what it’s supposed to behave like. Heck, they don’t even know what true Atium is like, because we’ve still never seen it! What we’re actually seeing here is the correction of an imbalance within the Ettmetal. The excess influence of ruin’s investiture in the metal is being removed, resulting in a metal that’s perfectly balanced between ruin and preservation. I.e, true ‘Harmonium.’ Ettmetal is actually ‘Discordium.’ It is innately imbalanced, carrying within it a bit more ruin than preservation, making it extremely volatile. But once split in this explosive reaction. The excess ruin investiture becomes malatium(not pure Atium, which we’ve never seen, because of whatever Leras did to ruin’s power in era 1), while the rest which is perfectly balanced with preservation’s investiture becomes true ‘Harmonium.’ And THAT is what turned Wax and Wayne into mistborn. If one wanted to produce actual Lerasium, they’d have to repeat the splitting procedure once more in order to fully split ruin’s investiture from Preservation’s. Producing pure Atium, and pure Lerasium. Whether or not that’s actually possible though is up for debate. Brandon seems to have eluded in past interviews that this should not be possible. The truth is that in era 1, Preservation did something spiritually to ruin’s power that made it so that it spawned into the world not as pure Atium, but rather as a twisted or dirty version/alloy. Malatium. Perhaps because he feared what true, pure Atium could do if people tried to burn it. And Somewhat similarly, there is a spiritual defect within Sazed and his shard that is reflected in his metal. Preventing it from manifesting as pure ‘Harmonium.’ But rather as a hyper reactive alloy, ‘Discordium.’ Which the characters refer to as Ettmetal. The truth is, we have never actually seen pure Atium, or Lerasium in ANY of the books. Only their alloys. I think that this may actually be intentional. And these intricate layers and webs of contradictions, and misconceptions will serve as the catalyst for the conflicts in the upcoming stories. And perfectly explain why Sazed has never been quite the same as the Sazed we saw at the end of Era one. Something insidious is going on. And he might not even be aware. It’s entirely possible that the main reason Sazed struggles to use his shard is because he mistakenly still thinks of the shard as Harmony, when in actuality it is Discord. The shard and the vessel are not in sync, and this is slowly destroying Sazed from within. Perhaps leading to the development of something… other. I personally think that this spiritual defect is a leftover consequence of the conflict between Ati and Leras in the past. We already know thanks to stormlight 4 that new shard holders inherit changes made to their shards by past holders. The shard’s investiture retains those spiritual bonds and quirks from the previous holder. My theory is that Sazed’s problems emerge from a confluence of 1) Whatever Leras did to Ruin’s power when he split it from him. 2) A weakening of preservation’s power, or rather output/influence/capacity, when he put more of himself within humanity than ruin did. 3) His own lack of awareness on the true nature of his shard’s nature and intent, gradually leading to him becoming an unfit vessel for the power, and thus incapable of using his powers as easily as he otherwise should. Setting up massive implications for future stories and conflicts. Conclusion: Perhaps I’m deeply misguided. Perhaps Brandon made a little mistake and I’ve been reading far to deeply into it for all these years. And in actuality none of this means anything. Perhaps Brandon is entirely unaware that this one little categorization choice he made ages ago could potentially yield all these implications. Or, maybe, just maybe. He did all this on purpose. Maybe Sazed was fated to walk the path of Discord from the start. Maybe we’ve all been duped for years and he’s been gradually working towards this grand reveal. If the latter is true my soul would quite literally ascend into the beyond. And I’ll feel like an absolute legend for having seen the whole thing coming from day one. But if not… Frankly speaking I’ll be so mad XD. Lots of love though Brandon! Thanks for the headache *End Note: The implications of all this kind of answers another question that's been bugging me as I’ve watched the grander narrative of the Cosmere slowly unfold. And that's the fact that Scadrians, without a singular doubt, seem like absolute A-holes in every story when viewed from an other-outworlder's POV. They seem exploitative, apathetic, and in many cases, they sow discord wherever they go. E.g. Sunlit Man, most interactions between ghostbloods and other-worlders, & the new secret project prologue. I noticed this because (in case you couldn’t tell by now) Scadrial and it’s people are the closest to my heart in the Cosmere. So their consistent douchebagery in other Cosmere stories has been very glaring to me. If my theory is true, and Sazed is actually Discord. And the traits of a shard can be seen reflected in the people of their world. This would all make perfect sense. Modern day Scadrians are children of Discord and that naturally makes them more prone to A-holery than most.*
  2. Sorry if this is in the wrong thread, first post and unsure where exactly to put it, but have tagged spoilers. If Harmony's Intent did shift to Discord, would he get a new God Metal and Perpendicularity? Or is his metal and location just linked to the fact that he holds both Shards, not the Intent of the joined shard?
  3. Stomlight/Mistborn era 1/2 spoilers in here. Had this theory stewing for a while and wanted to get it off my chest. Disclaimer: I'm not fully up to speed on all WoBs/interviews and the main theories present from people. I'm also not going all out with finding quotes here, though I'm pretty sure you can do that. So, the basis of my theory is that either era 4 or the back half of the stormlight archive will focus on a shardic conflict between the shards featured in Mistborn and Stormlight. Where all the shards on each side are combined: Honor, Odium, and Cultivation against Harmony and Autonomy, setting up a set of novels where there is no true 'bad guy' - both sides involve people trying to do what's best. Let's take the Scadrial side of things first. We know Harmony has issues taking action, and era 3 will likely in some part involve him morphing into Discord. The main conflict will probably be with Autonomy. I think the endgame here will feature a solution that says "Hey, ya know what might help Harmony/Discord deal with not being able to take action, or taking too much action? Let's give him a little Autonomy!" Which sets up a nice play on words - what do you think you could call a nice, harmonious version of Autonomy? Freedom! In the end, my guess is that era 3 closes with (hopefully) Sazed being a vessel for all three of Ruin/Preservation/Autonomy, and being named Freedom. Scadrial will, thus, be primarily oriented towards letting different communities in the cosmere be free to grow on their own. On the Roshar side, meanwhile, we already know what the combination of various parts of those three shards takes. We know Honor/Odium would likely be called War or something to that effect (in sprit at least; the names of the lights don't necessarily directly translate to shard names). What could War + Cultivation be? I'm going to go with Society, or Civilization, or something. The fact that Dalinar continuously gets told to Unite them can come into play too. The 'Them' in that quote continuously gets expanded - and there's no reason it couldn't continue in that way. In the end, I'm betting he unites the shards of Roshar themselves, and in doing so unites all their people's. Which sets Roshar up to be a group more focused on creating a big tent, and interacting with other worlds and such more to bring them into the fold themselves rather than letting them grow and develop alone. Which really sets up nicely for a conflict between Roshar and Scadrial where none of the people are bad, and each side has the powers of three shards. One side wants to unite and bring people together, the other side wants to let each world have freedom to grow and change by themselves. Us readers will have sympathies on both sides, having been a part of both mentalities development, and neither side is truly wrong, setting up a very nice final conflict. (As an aside, I'm not sure how or if other shards like Devotion/Sel and such play into this). TLDR: Harmony/Discord + Autonomy = Freedom, Honor + Odium = War + Cultivation = Society/Civilization. Final conflict: Freedom vs Society.
  4. In chapter 71 of TLM, Harmony gives Wayne "the faintest bit of lerasium", Preservation's godmetal that granted Allomantic access to all metals. Harmony said that Wax created it while trying to split harmonium with trellium. Then, later on, in Kelsier's Epilogue, he says that lerasium is all annihilated in the explosion between those two godmetals. Hence, the question: Why did Harmony lie to Kelsier? My theory on this: Harmony represents equilibrium and stillness, not change, right? Then telling Kelsier about this new discovery (harmonium can be split and lerasium can be created) would mean that he would soon be producing lerasium (even though just in little quantities, as Autonomy has retreated from Scadrial and the trellium (bavadinum) available is scarce), a fact that would bring obvious change to the world. Let me put this in other words: Harmony telling Kelsier about lerasium equals acting towards change, and that's why god didn't say a word about it. It's kind of a weak theory, too simple if you ask me, but it fits. Anyway, what are your thoughts on this?
  5. I think Harmony is a misnomer and I doubt that’s controversial. I feel it important to note that as far as I know the idea that Ruin is stronger than Preservation within Harmony has never been confirmed by a reliable source. Kel while awesome and smart is NOT an authority on shards. Consider that together Leras and Ati MADE a planet. That means that when evenly matched they could create. But Leras alone could only make a vague plan and hope that humans would sort it out. That, to me, sounds much more like what Sazed managed with his sword plan. I don’t know how but I think that *Preservation* is actually stronger within Harmony (Guess Fermata would be a better name in this case) So here's the thought. Sazed simply makes several highly invested people. They would likely need to be near to Elantrian levels, maybe greater. There are countless issues here but I think it’d be possible to even out the shards in this way whilst making Swords to defend the world. One issue that I’m sure will be brought up is the potential for abuse but I don’t think it’s there. That amount of Preservation in someone could force them to stagnate, locking their personality into whatever it was at the moment of investment and prevent any LR situations.
  6. We know that Tin Allomancers can see through the Mist better than they should due to Allomancy and the Mists both being of Preservation, so I'm wondering if Tin Feruchemists could do the same thing to Harmony's Mists in Era 2 due to Feruchemy and the new Mists both being of Harmony?
  7. OK, I don't know if I've seen this theory before, but I think it's definitely possible: Discord will be more Preservation than Ruin. Most people assume that Discord will be more Ruin than Preservation for several reasons. But I don't think that is the case. I'm going to try to articulate in a few points: (1) Atium was burned by Elend and crew right before Sazed took up the shards of Preservation and Ruin; (2) Major discord happened in Era 1 because of Preservation's influence; (3) Sanderson uses music and psychophysics a lot to help us understand the shards (i.e., discord happens a lot when you are "preserving" a note too long). 1) From what I understand, Leras splintered off a part of Ati's power to create Atium. As long as Leras, as Preservation, could block Ati from retrieving it, Ati was somewhat weakened. This helped make sure Ruin could not overpower Preservation. When Vin takes up Preservation's power, she is equal to Ati's power. Ati's goal was to get the Atium and thus have the upper hand. However, Elend and his Atium mistings burned it before he could regain it. The atium should theoretically regenerate, but that takes time. The power that was burned is in a transition state, waiting to seep back into the world at the Pits of Hathsin. But this takes hundreds of years. Merely minutes after all the Atium was burned by Elend, Vin kills Ati, and Sazed takes up their shards. The Atium in the transition state would not turn back into Atium. It would turn into Harmonium, equal parts Preservation and Ruin. Half of the Atium that was burned got converted into Preservation's power. Sazed, holding both shards, would have access to it (i.e., Leras is dead, and no one is acting as a gatekeeper). Harmony, therefore, has a tiny bit more Preservation in them than they do Ruin. 2) Discord happens whenever the two shards are out of balance. It doesn't just happen when Ruin is stronger than Preservation. Case in point, Era 1 was dominated by Preservation's influence. Preservation had "locked up" Ruin in the Well of Ascension. The Lord Ruler was Preservation's idea, and the Lord Ruler was not a harmonious leader. As a matter of fact, I would argue he created quite a bit of discord. 3) If there's anything we've learned from the Rhythm of War, it's that Brandon Sanderson uses music to help us understand investiture. The right musical harmonies can be used to combine stormlight and voidlight for example. Harmony, meaning Sazed, is currently in harmony, when using music as a metaphor. But how could there be discord (i.e., something not in harmony)? Well, there are a couple ways. One way would be to play sort of random notes that aren't octaves, perfect fifths etc. That would be something like "ruining" the music. People would hate that. Another way, however, is to keep playing a note even as the rest of the music moves on. You're "preserving" a note that doesn't harmonize with new chords. This creates discord. People LOVE discord in music, especially when it is mixed with harmony. You're not ruining the music, but making it better. Hence the " His name shall be Discord, yet they shall love him for it." Just a crazy idea (that I think is just crazy enough to be correct)!
  8. Originally I thought allomancy was the art of preservation, hemalurgy was ruin's, and feruchemy was just kind of there. Later I read something that said allomancy was ruins magic due to it destroying the metal used which made sense to me because hemalurgy was a cosmere-wide thing. Now I've come around to thinking that feruchemy is purely preservation, hemalurgy is wholly from ruin, and then allomancy is the combination of the two. It preserves the user and destroys the metal kind of a thing. This would then also make sense as to why both God metals, atium and lerasium, both have to do with allomancy instead of their respective gods magic. My question now is why hemalurgy is a cosmere-wide magic when ruin is now harmony. Please also let me know if my understanding of the metallic arts is flawed in any way.
  9. I've recently listened to Mistborn 1 and Alloy of Law within a short span of time. I noticed something that I thought was pretty cool and wanted to share it. To set the stage, here's the end of Mistborn: The Final Empire. Spoilers of course. Vin sets off to confront the immortal Lord Ruler in his palace, Kredik Shaw. She gets captured by Inquisitors and put in prison, her mistcloak and metals stripped from her. Skipping forward a bit, Sazed gets himself captured so that he can come to her aid by ripping the door off of her cell. They run down the hall defeating soldiers, Sazed low on attributes, Vin drained of metal reserves. They come across Elend Venture accompanied by guards, who have come to save Vin. Vin and Sazed prepare to flee, until Vin spots a tassel from her mistcloak sticking out of the closed lid of a trunk. She recovers her lost cloak and metal reserves, saves her future husband, and continues on to confront the Lord Ruler. There she draws upon the mist and defeats the immortal Lord even while he was in the process of crushing her to death by his Steelpush. Fast forward 300 years to the end of The Alloy of Law. Even more spoilers. Waxillium sits in the Breaknaught with Vindication, carried by the Vanishers to their lair, preparing to confront the nigh-indestructible Miles Hundredlives. There the door to the vault is ripped off by the Vanishers, and Wax causes havoc among the gang members. He, Wayne, and Marasi fight until they are low on weaponry, metals, and Feruchemical storages. Wax gets injured in an explosion and hides among some crates. There he calls upon Harmony, Sazed, for some help. Sazed responds and sends him a little help in the form of a trunk with his old possessions, marked by the tassel of his mistcloak duster sticking from beneath the lid. Guns and cloak recovered, Wax goes on to save his future wife (possibly draws upon the mists) and defeats Miles with the help of Marasi, even while Miles was methodically beating him to death. It's such a little detail, a tassel of a mistcloak signaling a hidden reserve of resources that brought victory, but Sazed was there for both of them. I doubt Wax knew the significance of the event that Sazed was alluding to with the tassel, but I think Sazed was honoring Wax by connecting him to Vin. There's always another secret, and Brandon still surprises me with books that I read a decade ago.
  10. Alright, so, 1st post here, but something clicked in my mind and I wanted to know what you all think about it. Shallan is used to having multiple voices (Intents?) in her head, to find a common path among them. Would she be more ready than most other people to hold 2 shards with conflicting Intents? (or even 3, given the ones in Roshar and the fact that 3 were the main personalities she's had). Is it too far fetched to think that her psyche's situation could be foreshadowing/preparation for this possibility?
  11. So, I was just thinking about how God Metals somewhat reflect the properties of their Shard (Lerasium Connects someone to Preservation, Atium makes people into efficient killing machines) and thought of something. Harmony's God Metal is so reactive because his two halves are polarised against each other and are locked in an uneasy equilibrium, and so is pressurized in a sense, which is why it seeks to escape by reacting with something. If Harmony's Intent switches to Discord, and the two halves are no longer in equilibrium, that pressure of them straining against each other goes away. We know from a WoB that I can't find right now that a God Metal's properties can change over time if the Vessel changes; could the same be true for a shift in Intent and the nature of the Shard? Once Harmony becomes Discord, could Harmonium (Discordium?) become less or even unreactive, and therefore be used to finally test out its Allomantic, Feruchemical, and Hemalurgiv properties? What are your thoughts?
  12. I've been thinking about this for a while, and I have an optimistic theory about Discord that I think is counter to the general community's consensus. I believe that Discord is what Sazed believes himself to be, rather than what he truly is. To explain myself further, I think it's pretty clear that Harmony/Discord is 1 shard, rather than 2 shards in one vessel. The 2 intents have combined, which is indicated by Harmony's godmetal being it's own separate thing rather than an alloy of Lerasium and Atium. I recognize that this itself is debatable, but I think I think it meshes best with the themes of Era 1, and with the idea of adonalisium itself. The shards are shards of Adonalsium, and when you put two together you now have 1, larger shard. Anyway, I propose that Sazed actually believes himself to be Discord, and that is what is causing his schism. This meshes well with his character in HOA, where he was very distraught and divided on who he was as a person. So now that he is a shard, I believe he is more unsure of himself than ever. I believe this is what translates into the properties of Harmonium, for instance. We know that Harmonium has its unstable properties because of the ruin and preservation within it fighting against each other. I don't think this is indicative of two shards in one vessel, but rather that Sazed believes in that war within himself. I think this is supported by the experiments done by the set, where they were only ever capable of annihilating the Harmonium, never separating it. Only Wax managed that, and it was only because he has the specific intent to do so (similar to ROW). My other main argument is intent of Discord itself. If Discord is the combination between to opposing shards like Ruin and Preservation, then this wouldn't be limited to just that combination. Mercy and Odium, for instance, could create Discord. We also have reason to believe that every shard comes with it's own opposing intent, so any combination of the two could create Discord. Meanwhile, Harmony could really only be created by Ruin and Preservation. Take Odium and Mercy. A supposed combination of the two could create a "harmony" between them, but I don't think you would name it Harmony. More likely it would be Restraint, to have godly anger but the mercy not to lash out. Harmony refers to the harmony of the world, to not destroy or maintain, but to have both together. To destroy the old to make way for better things. However I believe Sazed is worried that he can't actually be that harmony. I think he sees the conflict within himself, and extends that to conflict in the shard. He is worried about harmony, and tends to slip into simple preservation, not doing anything and hoping everything works out on its own, fearing anything else to be disharmonic. In effect, his definition of Harmony is wrong, that perhaps it means for any good thing to occur, some equal amount of bad must come with it. And because he doesn't want anything bad to happen, he fights against what he believes Harmony is, hoping that the intent won't push him to destroy when he doesn't want to. While in reality, he fights against Harmony itself, which creates the Discord between himself and the Intent of the Shard. Essentially I think Sazed needs therapy.
  13. Dont know if this is the correct place to post, if not I apologize, first time. So it has been stated that harmony is losing control (at least how I understood) and there is a alternate version of him (aka Discord), was wondering what people think of it and if Saied were somehow able to obtain another shard how it could impact him as a holder of two shards. Specifically if he gained the shard autonomy somehow, could the shard and it's essence or rules allow Harmony to have more control over ruin and preservation rather that be trapped and stretched between them trying to maintain balance?
  14. What did harmony do with all of the obligators and nobles? After The Catacendre did harmony just put them somewhere else on Scadrial and if so wouldn’t that be a threat to the basin?
  15. Problem: Sazed is losing control of his Shard because he's out of balance from trying to be more Preservation-y than Ruin-y. Fact: Ruin's signature trick was altering the written word. Solution: Make words appear. Lots of words. Lots and lots of words. Every time someone throws out a scrap of paper, Harmony can write "Saze wuz here" up and down both sides. Every time someone scribbles something rude on a restroom stall, Harmony can change it to a Pathian proverb. Alleyway graffiti can migrate from wall to wall, correcting its spelling and grammar in the process. Sazed can continue the Words of Founding-- The Further Thoughts of God on Everything, Volume LXIII-- in any discarded book. He can write the Great Scadrialian Novel. He can write the Terrible Scadrialian Novel, if that appeases his inner Ruin more. He can write fanfic for A Hero for All Ages. He can (again, if he needs to use up some extra Ruin) write disturbing, badly-spelled TenSoon-centric smutfic for A Hero for All Ages. I cannot see any flaws in this logic and I expect Harmony to start on his writing career immediately. You're welcome, Sazed.
  16. Ok, so I've been listening/reading the mist born books in preparation of the lost metal, and something occurred to me. According to TSH, the reason that Sazed was able to take up both Preservation and Ruin at the same time was because he was balanced between both. Tindwyl's death instilled a sense of acceptance of death within him, which allowed him to take up Ruin, while still wanting to maintain life, allowing him to take up Preservation. The balance he represents between both is what makes him Harmony. I remember reading a WoB that stated that if Kelsier had managed to take up both Preservation and Ruin, he wouldn't have been Harmony; he would have been Discord. Sazed represents the balance between the two Shards, while Kelsier would represent the conflict between them. Based on their respective personalities, I think this makes a great deal of sense. But what if Vin had somehow managed to take up both Shards? She was both a destroyer and a preserver, something THOA makes perfectly clear, which seems to me to be another type of balance that could allow someone to take up both shards. Does anyone know if there is a WoB on this? It seems like the kind of question someone would have come up with a while ago. I don't think Vin would have been Harmony or Discord, although Harmony seems much more likely than Discord. The way she talked about life and growth just before she killed Ruin makes me think Vin would have been something like that. Maybe Life. What do you guys think?
  17. We know from Wax’s experimenting that Trell’s spike emitted the entire spectrum of colors, with a large spike of emission in the red zone. Wax also mentions Harmonium doing a similar thing but doesn’t say what color the spike was. Any theories as to what color Harmony would be? Also does this color tie in to the color associated with the shard itself? Like is Trell’s glowing red because that color is associated with Autonomy or because she is using corrupted investiture? I remember stormlight and lifelight also having associated colors so it would be nice to think each shard has a color they identify with.
  18. I was thinking, the explosion that killed Wayne was a combination of Harmony Investiture and Autonomy Investiture. I think that his body and maybe even his soul was saturated with the two Investitures. I think that gave him a Connection to both possibly granting him the ability to help Harmony and Autonomy make contact. I can see this being used in a possible Era 3 or beyond.
  19. In Kelsier's epilogue, he and Sazed discuss whether or not Sazed should lead the people of Scadrial to a technological revolution. Sazed states that it's better for the people to discover things on their own. Kelsier counters the conflict wouldn't have happened if the people of Scadrial had been more advanced. Sazed has admitted previously that he thinks he's made things to easy for the people of the Basin, and that's why they haven't advanced as much as he'd expected. But if he'd given them the technology, they wouldn't need to discover it. Who's beliefs are more valid? Personally, I think Sazed's opinion is more valid. This resonates with several other fictional sources I'm fond of, and I think it's true. In Stormlight Archives, Dalinar discusses with one of his ardents the value of growing stronger through adversity, both as an individual and as a people. And the two discussions resonate, I think. Beyond that, the concept of people valuing things they've earned over what they've been given is something that's often explored in literature and other media. And that appreciation affects how they treat whatever it is. Be it technology, peace, or even financial wealth. Right now, Sazed says he puts people where they need to be, but allows them to make their own decisions. That's not a bad approach, all things considered. Perhaps Sazed could help nudge people in the right direction a little, but just giving the secrets away seems unwise. Hand outs are dangerous, because people can start to rely on them very easily, and because once it happens a first time, it's much harder to argue against doing it a second time. Teach a man to fish, and all that.
  20. Re-read TLM, and something struck me that I don't think has been mentioned. Autonomy, out of all the Shards in the Cosmere, is the perfect foil for Harmony as of Era 2. Sazed's problems stem from the inability to act while also maintaining the diametrically opposed forces of Ruin and Preservation. Autonomy is nothing but that, it is Independence of Action though without any seeming purpose other than to spread what it sees as that independence. It's like if Ayn Rand were suddenly a virus. Out of all the Shards we have encountered, Autonomy more than anything is a perfect foil for this new shardholder. But also, there is a method to Auto's 'madness'. It's been said before that Odium sees Saze as a massive threat to his plans, what of Autonomy's? Sazed is 2/16ths away from becoming Adonalsium 2.0, closer than anyone we are aware of since the Shattering. What if Autonomy was trying to take out the new competition, while Odium and the others were busy dealing with their own issues, Autonomy had the most access to take care of this one. And what if, by doing so, Autonomy accidentally revealed a way for Sazed/Harmony to resolve their inaction? By revealing themselves and their influence, Sazed is now intimately aware of Bavadin and Autonomy and Kelsier is (according to him) tired of being inactive. What if, come the third or fourth era of mistborn, we see Harmony (or Discord, as previous posters have pointed out) getting one back on Autonomy and reabsorbing that Shard as well? By taking Autonomy, Harmony would be able to act and move, allowing better balance/counterbalance throughout Scadrial/The Cosmere by creating avatars of preservation and ruin. So that's my theory going forward. Harmony balancing out Autonomy's expansionist attitude, Autonomy allowing Harmony an outlet to act. Thoughts?
  21. RedBlue

    Discord

    We see that Harmony is being followed around by a sometimes-visible, sometimes-not shadowy ‘other self’ that mirrors him. The ‘other self’ is called Discord. - The Lost Metal, chapter 66 - The Lost Metal, Kelsier’s epilogue So, putting the pieces together, a clear picture emerges of what’s going on here: Harmony is struggling to reconcile the differences between Ruin and Preservation. Sazed wants to remain Harmony, and maintain a kind of equilibrium to protect Scadrial. But he’s losing ground, and he’s getting closer and closer to becoming a different version of his Shard: Discord. This would mean dealing with the conflict between Ruin and Preservation differently (not ‘controlling’ it in the same way). The Intent of Sazed’s Shard would change from Harmony to Discord. That’s what we know, or can reasonably infer, so far. Here’s my weird speculation: what if Discord is actually not a bad thing? The imagery we have for Discord is shadowy and ominous, but what if that’s misleading? Dark doesn’t mean evil. Discord hasn’t shown up yet, so the only reason we have to feel concerned is that Sazed is fighting against it - and much as Sazed is a great guy, his judgement is not the greatest right now. On the other hand, Harmony has given us plenty of reason to feel concerned. He lies and withholds information when he shouldn’t. The whole Lessie incident was very troubling. He very nearly failed to protect Scadrial from Autonomy, and doesn’t seem able to understand what went wrong or how to fix it. He worries (with good reason) that his way of handling the Catacendre was not good for the development of Scadrian society, but again, he doesn’t seem able to course-correct. Most of Harmony’s flaws stem from a difficulty in taking action. He’s being pulled in two directions, so instead of acting decisively, he dithers, delegates and exerts subtle influence. Instead of making necessary changes, he desperately clings to the status quo. This doesn’t look like something Sazed can improve or work on - it’s inherent to the Intent of the Shard. That’s just how Harmony is. Which is a problem, given the threats facing Scadrial. What if Discord is what Scadrial needs? What if, instead of maintaining the equilibrium, there were a better way to resolve the conflict between Ruin and Preservation? One that uses the conflict as a driving force, maybe, so that the Shard can still take action while avoiding the worst excesses of Ruin and Preservation. Discord could be much more suited to lead Scadrial into the cosmere’s space age than Harmony. And if Discord causes some discord on Scadrial? I think people, and society, can handle discord. Thoughts? Am I totally wrong about Harmony and Discord? Or have I cracked the code?
  22. Harmony is currently having trouble acting, because he is limited by the conflicting intentions of Ruin and Preservation. Consider Ruin and Preservation as two parties in a negotiation with each other. Since they are equally strong, they are at an impasse. Imagine a third, much weaker party joins the negotiation. Say, a pinch of Devotion's Investiture. As was mentioned in Mistborn Era 1, in a negotiation involving three parties, the weakest party is actually the most powerful, because each of the stronger parties needs the weakest party on its side to defeat the other strong party. So if Sazed had a splinter of Devotion, then whenever Ruin and Preservation were deadlocked, Devotion's splinter would break the tie. Obviously, Sazed would want to choose Investiture carefully for this purpose, since his Intent would probably become a watered-down version of the third Shard. Devotion would probably be fine. Odium would not. The original Vessels would probably be opposed to such a plan, because it is moving toward a re-unified Adonalsium. They should see, however, that it only slightly enhances Sazed's Investiture power, and might greatly increase his freedom, since the Intent of whatever Investiture he eats a pinch of might be so diluted by the neutral Intent of Harmony that Sazed's will might be able to steer the new Intent quite a lot. As far as I know, the Vessels have no problem with freedom, though they may object on the grounds that it gives Sazed too much power in practice. What do you think?
  23. I'm not sure if this belongs here in SA or in the Mistborn thread but the stuff I'll quote to support this is from RoW so I'm going to go with here. I'm also not sure if someone has already made this theory before. There are 200,000 posts here so it seems likely but I still think this is a good idea and worth discussing. (I have been listening to the audiobooks so I don't have specific page numbers. I'll give what chapter I took it from and the context so you can find it though.) RoW chapter 39 - 23:39:00. This happens after the invasion of the Tower when fused and regals are searching the Tower for downed radiants. Kaladin is in his father's hospital area and hears news of these enemy troops coming toward him. He picks up a scalpel and prepares for battle, then thinks this: "the scalpel of a surgeon was a very different thing from a soldier's knife. a surgeon's knife could be a subtle thing, meant to cause as little harm as possible. a delicate contradiction, like Kaladin himself." "it had been designed to heal, but could kill just as efficiently, like Kaladin himself" also, in Harmony's letter (at the beginning of RoW Chapter 29), he says, "I have begun searching for a pathway out of this conundrum by seeking the ideal person to act on my behalf. Someone who embodies both Preservation and Ruin. A....sword, you might say, who can both protect and kill." I believe these quotes are referencing the same person. Kaladin Kaladin is a complicated person. He has years of formal training as a surgeon and years of formal training as a killer. He knows how to do both very effectively and seems to find a balance between the two by the end of RoW (after swearing his 4th ideal). But this complicated past is exactly what makes him perfect for this job. He is very familiar with ruining and preserving. I believe that in the second 5-book series in Stormlight Archive, Kal will meet Sazed/Harmony and they will strike a deal similar to what Odium wanted with Dalinar, though, not quite so destructive. Harmony doesn't need a general to lead his armies or a bondsmith to free him from his prison. Harmony just needs an avatar to act through. Someone who will truly, deeply understand him, his goals, and what keeps him from accomplishing them. That's the theory. Let me know what you guys think of this! I've been thinking about this for a week or two and really feel like it fits. If Kal can find a way over to Scadrial, this would be super cool!
  24. I haven’t finished the rest of the book so no spoilers if this becomes immediately relevant and I doubt it will. but with kaladin being made cosmere aware thanks to vasher he is being position as a worldhopper assuming he doesn’t die in book 5. I think we are very obviously supposed to think this is gonna be kaladin whcih make some speticsl but then it made me think, what if kaladin gets powers from every shard. kaladin has powers from honor The theory about him bonding yxili exists harmony if he discovers his existence may be interested idk I just kinda want to know if anyone else has other theories on this
  25. Can somebody remind me how Sazed was able to pick up Ruin again? I don't remember his personality or actions having much connection to Ruin, and usually your personality has to be related to a Shard's Intent before you can pick it up, so how could he take both Preservation and Ruin? He certainly seemed to embody Preservation as a Keeper.
×
×
  • Create New...