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A continuation of the Spanreed assassination thread in the Stormlight board. I realized that we have people who can make drawings that literally explode. What happens if an Elantrian attempts to draw an Aon with a Spanreed? We can do variations on if the Elantrian has done whatever Moonlight did in Scadrial, if they are using the Spanreed in Elantris and the other reed is in Fjordell, or if the Elantrian is out of country and the conjoined spanreed is in Elantris. The two biggest questions are if the Elantrian can draw a valid Aon remotely and how close one or they other has to be to accessible Dor. If we can figure it out though, then an Elantrian could stash a few spanreeds in key locations and remotely activate Aons. Thoughts?

I was reading Elantris again this week, and something interesting came to mind as I was doing so; Elantrians can use their hands to draw the symbols of AonDor, but they can also use tools such as wands (sticks), dust, metal wires, or stone carvings. What if an Elantrian could make use of a computer to quickly type up AonDor symbols in a form modified for the computer's programming (modifying AonDor symbols is possible. WoB)? They could perhaps type up AonDor code into their computer and save it for later use, making a library of more complex effects possible on demand. Perhaps they could run a simulation on their computer that determined what the Aon did before it was activated, allowing them to fix any errors before they went off and tried to polymorph their friend. Any other ideas for what AonDor computers might allow for Elantrians?

I was thinking about a little quirk about the Aons I saw form the page on the Coppermind: So if you drew an Aon in the dirt with stick, then rubbed it away, then wrote another Aon exactly where the first one was, what will happen? Will both Aons work? Will they interfere with each other?

We saw in TLM that AonDor could be used even on another planet so long as there was an available source of Investiture to fuel it and so long as the Aons were modified to be compatible with the landscape. So my question is, what do you guys think would happen if AonDor were to be used in space? Would landscape requirements disappear while used in space, or would Aons just cease to function all together?

Something is on my mind, and, I am hoping ya'll can explain to me / point out the Resolution I am missing: The Coppermind entry on Elantris (here) notes that the city of Elantris was empty when the Aonic people's showed up, and, after a few decades of living there, some of them started going through the Shaod. However, it also notes that Elantris was clearly built by Elantrians, as only they could have made the Aons that made the city work. But, we find out in Elantris that, without the actual city of Elantris itself to channel AonDor.... people don't become Elantrians. They become Reod. So, we appear to run into a bit of a chicken/egg problem: the city is needed to create the people who had to pre-exist the city in order to build the city. (?) My first thought was "well, Elantris could have been built pre-Splintering of Dominion/Devotion, when the rules were different. Okay, except, AonDor is part of a magic system that is tied to the specific local geography, and that geographic specificity is supposedly a result of the Splintering. From the cited WOB: Assuming the Coppermind is reading that correctly (and, on its face, that seems like the most direct reading), then, are we not left with a chicken-egg problem in the city of Elantris?

Okay so I'm the latest book we see Elantrians seem to have most of their powers off Sel. Where does the power come from? I assumed in Lost metal there was still a bunch of unkeyed Dor available. Does the sorceress just have a bunch of invisible Dor in her tower? Or another unkeyed investiture source that can power AonDor? It looked like they didn't have most of their powers off-world back in Secret History, but a lot of time has passed since then.

When Raoden had a flashback to when he was young, he broke his leg and got an infection then went to Elantris to be healed. It as said he was dying at the time. He also seemed to see the Dor for what it was, looking past the Aon that healed him and see the storm of polarized Investiture that was trying to leak out through the Aon itself. Did Raoden, while young and near-death, briefly peer into the Cognitive Realm and see a glimpse of the Dor as it is? I say this because we have some proof that when you die or are nearly dead, you can see into the CR. There's a Death Rattle that may not actually be a Death Rattle that's about someone seeing a Cryptic in the Cognitive Realm as they were killed.

Could you tattoo Aons that work onto someone? Like if you could figure out which Aon is a trigger or an off/on switch for other Aons, you might be able to tattoo an Aon Daa plus a few Aon Rao together on yours or someone else's hands, and so long as the tattooing was done by an Elantrian and you were in range of Elantris, you could shoot lasers out of your hand whenever you want! And it wouldn't just have to be lasers it could be anything! Like healing, Soulcasting, Lightweaving, anything you can imagine! AonDor powers without being an Elantrian! What do you think?

So... After stumbling on the coppermind depictions on the vairous Aons, and seeing their symmetry, I wonder if they have anything to do with the shapes of the various cities on Roshar and the shattering of the Plains. It was just a thought I had while killing time at work.

Given that AonDor (and all the Selish arts) have been described as a "programming language" for magic, you should in theory be able to create a Shardblade using AonDor (if we're going by the definition of Shardblade as a highly Invested weapon) and I think I've figured out a method. It's probably not the only method, but this is one I thought of. So, we've seen how Elantrians can create metal plates with an Aon inscribed on them to create the effect without having to draw it out themselves. They use that for lighting and transportation around the city. We also know that you can create AonDor "equations" which use different Aons as modifiers to create a more specific effect. What's stopping someone from combining those things and then putting it on a sword? My idea here is to forge a normal steel sword, probably a little oversized in terms of width to make space for the Aons, and then inscribe an Aon equation onto the flat of the blade. Then, when wielded by an Elantrian, they could push AonDor into the sword, and activate the Aons. The specific ones I would have inscribed on the blade are probably Deo, Dio, maybe Eda and Ela, Iir, Rao, and probably others purely as modifiers. The point of it all would be to enhance the sword with power, increasing it's cutting capacity and durability. The result would be similar to a Shardblade, if not as powerful. A mini-Shardblade if you will. Tell me what you guys think about this idea, if you think it would work or not, and maybe an easier way to make an AonDor Shardblade if you can think of one!

The title is actually a red herring, as I hope the tags imply. The discussion I want to start is regarding a question that I've wanted to ask Brandon for a while, but I don't think I'll ever get the opportunity - so let's discuss for ourselves, yes? What exactly determines who gets which magic system? We know that being born in a given territory gives you a Connection to the symbols of that territory, but what classifies as a territory? Is it geographical or geopolitical? Is an Elantrian an inhabitant of the kingdom of Arelon or an inhabitant of the surroundings of Elantris? If the borders between nations were to change - that is, if an empire were to annex a kingdom, or a kingdom were to be split into multiple nations, would the magic be affected in some way? If the Fjordell Empire annexed Arelon, would AonDor still work? And if it did, would it work in the same way? My gut instinct is yes to both of those questions, because we know that both the Fjordell and Rose empires seem to have multiple magic systems within them, but I'm not certain. The Dor exists in the Cognitive Realm, so it would make sense for it to reflect perceived distinctions between locations rather than spatial organization.

I don't think think we put enough focus on Elantrian investiture. Intriguing facts Sel is a system with many magic systems, which instead of getting power from the spiritual realm, they siphon the power directly from the Dor (the two splintered shard's power) Elantrian magic seems is the only investiture (we know of) where the magic's power is linked directly to the practitioner's proximity to Elantris (which is curiously located next to a perpendicularity) Sel magic seems unusually versatile even among Sel magics, allowing teleportation, illusions, transmutation, healing, energy summoning, strength/speed increase, emotion manipulation (likely via connection), among presumably many others Brandon said that Elantris was an “oddball among the cosmere magic systems” Keshu taught that “God would come to earth once all mankind was unified” unified, being a vague term Wryn's letter to Hrathen stated that “the time for [Jaddeth’s] ascension is near” likely referring Jaddeth coming up from underground The Fjordells seemed suspiciously interested in Destroying Elantris even when the inhabitant were, comparatively defenseless theories All the Elantrians are technically all ascended at once calling upon the directly Dor’s power using Aons as “codes” so theoretically anything a shard can do, an elantrian can do as well provided the know the correct Aons. That would mean an Elantrian the is the Shard so any Seons connected the an Elantrian are not longer to the person’s identity but instead to the shard itself. So when the Reod happened all the seons could only pull their connection to the physical realm from the blocked off Dor. Wryn was not talking about “ascension” in the literal sense but in the Shard sense. He needed all the elantrians killed so the power wouldn’t be connected to anyone alive anymore, that way the shard’s intent would let someone else bear the power totally. Maybe there are many other perpendicularities on Sel and if someone were to control, or “unify” all of them they would be able to put the shards back together and “Fully” ascend.

Hello hello fellow wordlhoppers, after some thought I want to return to my favourite cosmere idea: Compounding with something else but Allomancy. The most likely candidate: AonDor. (Mistborn spoilers) Part 1: What is Compounding? and how could it work with anything else but Allomancy. Allomancy uses Metals as Keys to tell Preservation's Investiture flowing through them from the Spiritual Realm what form/effect to take. Iron tells it to pull, Steel to push etc. Feruchemy uses Metals as Keys to tell the (scadrian) body's own Investiture what form/effect to save as. A Compounder genetically has both the abilities to tap and save the same metal. If they activate a key (burn a metal) that is already a different key (already tells Investiture a specific form to take) the Investiture that the allomancer uses for allomancy (Preservation's) instead takes the form that the feruchemic key tells them. Part 2.1: AonDor with Compounding broken down like that, you might get where I'm going. What other kind of magic uses Keys: Selish magic. Specifically, AonDor. In AonDor, the Aon acts as a Key to tell the Dor (Dominion and Devotion's combined Investiture) what form/effect to take. Aon Ehe tells it to be Fire, Aon Shao tells it to transform something, etc. These Aons can be modified to be Keys for extremely specific purposes. Part 2.2: AonDor Compounding: Aon Deo Aon Deo is the Aon for Metal. My theory: I believe Aon Deo could be specified enough that, if an AonDor user made a metalmind in the shape of that specific Aon or inscribed Aon Deo into a Metalmind, you could channel the Dor through the Metalmind, using the Dor to power your feruchemical release similarly to how Allomantic Compounding uses Perservation's Investiture. What are the Implications of this: 1. If a person had both the ability to use a Metalmind and use AonDor, they could get massive amounts of certain feruchemical attributes without saving them beforehand by using Aon Deo to power them with Dor. Part 2.3: Nicrosil Source: https://coppermind.net/wiki/Nicrosil What are the implications of this: 2. An AonDor Nicrosil Compounder could store a tiny bit of Investiture in his AonDeo Nicrosilmind, then activate it with AonDor and get basically infinite Investiture. 3. THEY WOULDN'T EVEN HAVE TO BE A FERUCHEMIST. Originally, I thought that if a Terrisperson managed to move to Arelon they might have a tiny chance to birth a Ferring who gets chosed by the Sheod. But read this again: Therefore, a Soulbearer could store their ability to use Feruchemy and another person tapping it would be turned into a temporary Feruchemist who has the ability to fill a metalmind (assuming the nicrosilmind was unsealed) If an Elantrian got their hands on an unkeyed Nicrosilmind, that temporary window would be enough to use AonDor to power it. Once the AonDeo Nicrosilmind is Compounding, it wouldn't be used up like in Allomantic Compounding. The Elantrian would have infinite Investiture. For Rosharans, this might seem arbitrary, but not for Elantrians. The Dor has local borders, it is difficult to use AonDor outside of Arelon, not even speaking of Sel. Using this Technique, Elantrians might be able to use AonDor outside of Sel. Part 3: possible difficulties with Connection Leaving Arelon might weaken the Connection to the land too much to use AonDor even with a source of Investiture. Possible Solution: Source; https://coppermind.net/wiki/Duralumin Elantrians could canonically tap Duralumin to use AonDor outside of Arelon, maybe even Sel. They don't even need to be a Ferring to do this. Anyone can canonically use a Nicrosilmind to temporarily become a Duralumin Ferring (see Bands of Mourning), I theorize that an Elantrian could use AonDor to Compound, turning the temporary abilities provided by a Nicrosil- and Duraluminmind into permanent abilities. This way, they could use AonDor without the Dor while also using the infinite Investiture provided by this trick to power their Duraluminmind to keep up their connection to Sel. > Be Elantrian > Aquire Nicrosilmind and Duraluminmind. > Tap Nicrosilmind while in Arelon. Become temporary Ferring. > Tap Duruminmind while in Arelon by activating your AonDor. Create infinite Investiture loop. > Permanently have infinite Investiture to power both your AonDor and the necessary Connection supplement to power it outside of Sel. I'd love to hear your thoughts on this theory and why you think it could or couldn't work!

Introduction message, eh? Hello everyone! I'm Benkinsky, and this year I binged everything Cosmere I hadn't red before 2020. And obsessive as I am, I have a lot of theories that those of you who browse r/Cosmere might have already seen. And its time to post them here. Remember me as the AonDor Compounding guy! Cheers! also, is there like an App of 17th shard? or do I use my browser to access it on my phone?

what are your thoughts for an Elantrian using aondor to enhance or create weapons/ armor? the main ones I've come up with are using aons create a weapon similar to a gun, my idea for this is to have an aon create a burst of compressed air to launch the bullet, which would have aons inscribed on it activated upon contact with a surface. these would cause effects such as expanding or catching fire. other Aons could be inscribed onto the barrel of the gun for stabilization against recoil, or used kinda like a silencer.

...Incredibly difficult, hmm... Let's see... Assuming that we can make an Ire-style Dor Conduit to Shadesmar, what sort of Aon Aon (and other Aons) might we need to draw to make use of AonDor on Roshar? I've spent the past couple hours experimenting with such a thing, making a (possible) Aon Aon based on the geography of Roshar, and remaking some Aons using it as the base. Here's the set of Aons I've converted, starting with Aon Aon. (Edit: Updated!) It would be interesting to see some sort of Rosharan Elantris (Elantrisirtnale??) built above the spot in the PR where the Dor Conduit ends in the CR. Would probably be needed to get any meaningful amount of power out of Aons so far from the Dor, even with the Conduit. Also, to explain the Rosharan Aon Aon, it follows the curvature of the continent, branching off from The Valley towards Aimia with the southern branch, and up to the Reshi Isles with the northern branch. The dot is the Purelake, and the small line is Aimia.

I should begin by informing you that this theory discusses info which is available in the 10th Anniversary Edition of Elantris, as well as the Arcanum Unbounded. If you've only read Elantris and not the new version then you might spoil yourself. AonDor existed before Elantris was built. We know this because how else would the builders have known the shape of the Aon in which it was supposed to be built? The Dor itself needs to have existed for AonDor, yet I have a theory that AonDor existed before the Splintering of Devotion & Dominion. And even weirder, I also have a theory that the city of Elantris might've been built while she was still alive Don't worry though, I also have a far more sane theory attempting to answer this question right below the crazy one that I've marked under a line of tildes (~) The biggest reason why I think that Devotion might've been there when Elantris was created is the Pool. It had apparent religious significance to the Elantrians. The Pool was depicted in the wall relief in the secret meeting room. It was situated quite close to the city itself, which was visible from the peaks where the pool was located. When entering it, people feel an extreme sense of comfort and calm. The Hoed regained a bit of consciousness in it. The Pool speaks to people when they enter it, offering peace and contentment, wishing to take away their sorrows and pains. Those who do not accept the relief do not dissolve. And it makes sense that way, the Elantrians getting old enough to want release going there to die but finding a new world. Devotion's Perpendicularity just gave the feel from both where it was physically located, to how it was described, it seemed as though it was placed there specifically for this purpose. There's another thing though, in Mistborn: Secret History, we meet... It is very possible that some form of AonDor existed before the Splintering, since the Selish magics seem to be focused on forms & coding. The proto Aons might not have been in the shape they are now (i.e. the shape of Arelon). The Selish magics' focus probably were symbols even before D&D's death, it's just the region-specificity (in form & function) that might have been introduced to them afterwards. The Surges were very much a part of the Rosharan system before the Shards' arrival, weren't they? The magic should change with an event as drastic as its Shards getting killed and shoved into the Cognitive Realm but why would it need to change the part where the magic is utilized via symbols? The change caused by shoving Devotion & Dominion into the Cognitive Realm is that the magics got region-locked due to the Cognitive Realm distinguishing between such. Even so, Selish magics being unavailable outside of Sel seems much more a direct result of that than region-focused magic, which was probably based on the Cognitive Realm itself being affected by people's perception of being different from other groups than anything purely fundamental about having a Shard hanging around in the Cognitive. I'm hypothesizing the possibility that the problem got exacerbated with their Splintering rather than being created due to it. There's also the fact that 'Aon' is derived from Aona, Devotion. And that Seons were born when Aona was Splintered. The Seons have Aons at their centre which are Splinters of Aona. Which means Aons existed during that time. The religions of Shu-Korath (Domi, united through love) and Shu-Dereth (Jaddeth, united through obedience by the rule of a theocratic government) seem divided between Devotion and Dominion and the magics seem to reflect these divisions too, observing AonDor vs Dakhor, though it might be correlation rather than causation, after all, they are splinter religions arising from an older religion, Shu-Keseg. We know that Sel's Shards, Devotion & Dominion were killed by Odium and that their power was stuffed into the Cognitive Realm to form the Dor. We also know that this is the reason why the Selish magics are locked. We see evidence of the conflict between Shards on all of these other Shardworlds except on Sel ⚠ Stormlight Archive minor spoilers (info on the cover blurbs) ⚠ Spoiler  ⚠ Shadows for Silence in the Forests of Hell spoilers ⚠  Sel also houses dead Shards but the only effect seems rather... mild, is it related to how Odium locked them in the Cognitive? Or is the region-locked magic its version all that remains as evidence of conflict between three Shards? Why is Sel still doing so well despite having two Splinterings? Neither Threnody nor Roshar are doing so well ⚠ Mistborn: Secret History spoilers ⚠  The lack of any direct effect from the Splintering I can accept, maybe Odium finished the deed in the Cognitive or immediately locked the remnants in the Cognitive after killing Aona (Devotion) and Skai (Dominion) but why isn't there any evidence of a planet scale war? There must have been some evidence of the conflict for Khriss to deduce what happened. Who would the conflict be staged between on Sel? On Roshar This is assuming Odium even needs to subvert people to create hatred between groups to somehow damage how another Shard is perceived, or that he tried to pit Devotion and Dominion against one another, these are just theories and are in no way confirmed. But if such a conflict did occur, was it waged between the continents on Sel? On each continent? Opelon doesn't have indications of such a conflict. Except maybe the city of Elantris and the land of Arelon, which was found uninhabited by its would-be settlers, the Aonic people, led by King Rhashm who would go on to rename himself King Raoshem. Did Devotion and Dominion just die to Odium? Ambition fought, Honor fought, Devotion and Dominion must've fought as well, Elantris and the land of Arelon could have been a staging ground for the conflict between the Shards, which might've been why it was empty when it was found, having been on the side that lost I should note that so far as we know, both the Splinterings occurred within a few thousand years of the Shattering. And Odium could've very well ignored the inhabitants of Sel and only concerned himself with the Shards he was there to kill. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The less crazy theory is ~Mistborn: Secret History spoilers~ I know, I know, the first one was a crazy idea, right? There have been counter-arguments to a lot of the points I've raised, including the possibility of a Cognitive Shadow of Aona being the voice that one hears when submerged in the Pool or that the feelings invoked are a direct effect of the Shard's Intent, both very much possible with what we've of other Shards like Ruin, Preservation, Cultivation, Odium... It could be that the location of the city was based on proximity to the pool instead of the other way around, it could also be sheer coincidence or something made the liquid Investiture of Devotion coalesce there ~Mistborn & Stormlight spoilers~ So how crazy did you find the first theory? And What did you think of the second theory? Do you have any other theories on the origin of Elantris?

All systems based on the Dor cannot predate the formation of the Dor. But Sel had two Shards in residence before that, presumably for quite some time. During that time Sel's CR must have been accessible. Where are the worldhoppers who left Sel during that time?

Selish magic can access at least Fortune, as seen by the Dakhor assassin in Teod. AonDor can do a lot of physical things and also has mental and corporal capabilities. But what about spiritual stuff? Can it tap into Fortune or manipulate Identity? Given that it is built on geographic constraints, Connection seems to be taboo. What do you think?

Ok before you call me insane, let me explain my thought process here. Firstly, the inspiration: I recently read a theory that Nightblood, by being Awakened with "destroy" in its command, is attempting to mimic Ruin's investiture (or is otherwise Connecting to Ruin in some form). The black mist Nightblood emits actually lends itself to this theory. it resembles the black Mist of Ruin/the Deepness, after all. The gaseous form of Ruin's investiture (if i'm not mist-aken ). Secondly, the Extrapolation: using other Shardic Intent-related keywords in an Awakening of metal with thousands of breaths would cause a similar effect if nightblood is in fact Connected to/mimicking Ruin's investiture. So with that established, let me get into the meat of this mad idea of mine. A ring, necklace, or other metal accessory, awakened at the Ninth Heightening, commanded along the lines of "devote yourself to connecting me to the Dor" (or some other Command that implies this) with the appropriate mental image of a Connection from Elantris/Arelon/the Dor to the ring/the wearer. (though Nightblood is already very effective at connecting to his wielder, as we've seen with Szeth in SA, so it might just need to be connecting the Dor and the Ring) Another thing that makes me think this COULD work is that the Dor WANTS to have an outlet. using Breaths to basically amp up the connection such that it works far from Elantris/Arelon would (imo) not be resisted by the Dor once it was established (especially considering you could Awaken the ring in Elantris to make it easier to Connect). This theory basically hinges on a lot of small, theoretical quirks of Awakening and AonDor to work, but if it did, an Elantrian could use AonDor anywhere in the Cosmere! I'm totally ok with someone debunking this with facts or theories of their own, I just need to know what y'all think.

Hello Shard! It's by far time I've been on the shard without creating a proper theory! This ones been brewing in my head for a while and its time I share it with the world, and besides, the Elantris forum looks a little empty... So my proposed theory is that the magic system of AonDor is separate from Identity and Connection unlike any other Cosmere magic system we've seen. We know that the Dor, or the Investiture of Devotion and Dominion, exists inside the Cognitive Realm. We also know that Connection and Identity plays a big part in what makes the Spiritual Realm, where most Investiture is stored. Aons have a wide range of powers and this could be due to the lack of set rules put in place by the Shards of Adolusium, they also can effect practically anyone! I believe that these factors leads to Identity having less of an impact on Sel's magic systems. Of course, Identity and Connection still effect the magic, otherwise anyone could draw Aons, Elantrian or not! To prove this theory more information could be used, either we all wait for the sequel to Elantris or we ask Brandon some questions, hopefully not being RAFO'd! This is my first theory and I would like to know what you think. Questions For Brandon! Could an Elantrian make a stamp with an Aon on it then use it instead of drawing their Aons? Could Multiple Elantrians work together on drawing one massive Aon, would this have any effects on the magic? @Ladrian

From my understanding, every Cosmere magic system has a way to access the cognitive realm and worldhop. My question is then, do Elantrians do this with a variant of Aon Tia? Or is that bound by using distances as we see in the book - since you can't walk to the cognitive realm, could you travel there by Aon?

So, AonDor functions, on an essential level, by creating a gateway (Aon) through which the Dor (trapped in the cognitive realm) may pass into the physical realm. The Dor, is a result of the splintered remains of devotion and dominion being crammed into the cognitive realm. So, if one were to ascend and somehow reforge the splintered remains of the two shards, what impact would this have on AonDor and the other magic systems on Sel? Would it still be capable of functioning in at all the same way? If there is no Dor to be channelled, then what's the point in AonDor? Would the ascended vessel be able to provide a fuel source for AonDor? Or would the magics of Sel simply revert to their more primal form before the splintering of the shards? If this is the case, what would happen to Elantris and the Elantrians? Or the Dakhor monks? Etc. Well, thanks in advance for your input.

Does anyone know what Aon modifiers look like? Such as the ones Raoden used to set the distance when he used Aondor to cross the ocean? Also, how do you connect Aons to get different effects. And is there a bigger list of Aons than the one in the 10th anniversary edition of Elantris? I am working on a connected Aon art project.

So what can AonDor really do? It seems to be incredibly versatile, but we only really saw a few aons properly used in the books. I'm pretty sure I recall reading off handed remarks of seeing elantrians flying around in Elantris, is this just the people of Kae thinking up things or is there an aon which grants flight? I feel that sadly, the case is simply that we haven't seen enough of AonDor or Elantris. I welcome any input.