Trickonometry

Maybe someone else has brought this up before and I missed the topic, in which case, please point me in the appropriate direction. (-: My friend and I were discussing the final chapter, and he brought up a very good point - could the baby Cryptic (super adorable, btw) that Hoid saves be Elhokar's spren he almost bonded with? As we (sadly) know, Elhokar was in the process of becoming a Knight Radiant when he was killed. We know he was very much inspired by Shallan's sketch of him as a noble king, and that was a part of what led to him (almost) saying the words. Could he have been on the path to becoming a Lightweaver? If people DON'T think this is the case, it raises two questions: how would Hoid have known to look for that Cryptic, and what do you think Elhokar would have been?

That actually is something I've wondered about. We know that the "steel push bubble" isn't something everyone does, but Wax can. And obviously he's very good at flying by because of his ability to change mass mid-air (that's what we've determined, correct?). So, what's Wayne's specialty? Besides being an expert impersonator and a top-notch-Marasi-bother?

Agreed. I'm not saying that a fan-made Ars Arcanum would be 100% accurate, but it would be the most complete set we could get given the information we have. It's really tempting when I'm currently sitting around in the jury duty waiting room with 8 hours of nothing ahead of me... Lol

Thank you! I figured that a fourth book wasn't new info to people based on the lack of a reactions to that fact on the forums. I'm glad the Nicrosol misting wasn't a total fabrication of my memory, and this is the first I'm hearing of a Terriswoman programmer, which is exciting. What else do we know about the next Era? Or is that about the extent of it?

Completely agree with your thoughts here, and it is ABSOLUTELY something I am left wondering. It's a big reason why I'd like to see an attempt at a grand unifying Ars Arcanum.

I don't know if any of this qualifies as spoilers, but I thought it'd be better to be safe than sorry. A few things I thought I knew: 1) Brandon originally planned for Scadrial to be the location of three trilogies, one a classic fantasy, the second a modern fantasy, and the third a space opera/future fantasy. The space opera/future fantasy would be the epic to finally tie together the whole cosmere. 2) Wax and Wayne started as a Brandon-was-bored-writing-a-book-so-he-decided-to-write-a-book book, and because of both popular reception and a love for the characters, he decided to write more. 3) Bands of Mourning ends with saying there will be another book, The Lost Metal, concluding Mistborn: Era Two. Point 3 already threw me off when I read it, and it leads me to my first question: 1) Did I miss the memo saying there was going to be 4 books in the second series? and 2) Are we looking at 4 or more possible Mistborn eras? and closely tied to that question 3) Are we still getting a modern day Mistborn novel? I remember hearing something about it being set in something akin to our version of the 80s and I think a Nicrosol misting was a main character? Maybe? My memories are fuzzy regarding this bit of info. Given how technology may be taking some leaps and bounds given the events toward the end of Bands, I am left wondering if Sanderson deemed it unnecessary to make another era before he gets to his space opera. Thanks to all who can help answer my questions/clear up my understanding!

Has this been attempted yet? I know we have the Coppermind wiki, but instead of having everything on separate pages, have we tried to create a more comprehensive Ars Arcanum that will list all the known powers in the different worlds, their interactions with other powers in their world, and finally theories as to how they might be connected to/they might react to one another? I very well be nerd enough to take on this challenge, but it seems like an awfully large undertaking if this has already been done before.

Let me begin with what I think is an appropriate opening to a conversation about the new books: HOLY CRAP AHHHHHHH THAT WAS AMAZING AND WHAT???? ANOTHER WHOLE NOVELLA THAT HAS TO SO WITH KELSIER AND THE COSMERE????? Best. Day. EVER. Whew. I feel better. Now for the point of this post. I want to talk about theories that have been either confirmed true or untrue by the new books. It is entirely possible that the following two confirmations I'm about to describe have been confirmed by Word of Brandon before the books, but I was made very excited by the very last part of the Ars Arcanum: “On Scadrial, someone with one Allomantic power and one Feruchemical power is called “Twinborn.” The effects here are more subtle than they are when mixing Surges on Roshar, but I am convinced that each unique combination also creates something distinctive. Not just two powers, you could say, but two powers … and an effect. This demands further study.” Excerpt From: Sanderson, Brandon. “The Bands of Mourning.” Tom Doherty Associates. iBooks. This material may be protected by copyright. 1) Twinborn DO gain unique powers, regardless of compounding. 2) The combining of surges on Roshar create distinctly different powers. Now, we've expected and theorized both for a while, but having it stated explicitly is... comforting. Also, it allows for further discussion of what different combinations are what they say about the core of their powers. I'm happy for this thread to discuss both Cosmeric confirmations as well as their implications!

I would suggest Rhapsody in Blue! Gershwin's classic just feels -good- while reading an urban western. Other suggestions?

It's out on iBooks! Woo-hoo!

I am a west coaster who is dearly hoping to get his digital copy released at 9pm. :-D

...But this is brought up right at the end of Firefight. It's been bugging the crap out of me that they kept calling David's similes "metaphors." When our newly fearless epic calls him out on it, it was, strangely, one of the more cathartic moments of the book. Just felt like sharing this. Go about your day. :-)

Maybe this has been established already, but I am curious about the relationship between Soulcasting and Forging. Forging, IIRC, is essentially re-writing the past of an object to become what it COULD have been, and the greater the deviation from what it currently is, the greater the detail needed in the Forging. After reading WoR, we find out that Soulcasting, at least for Shallan, is a process of convincing an object of the need for it to become something else. Forgery, then, seems to be the Physical Realm equivalent of Soulcasting in the Cognitive Realm. I realize that the shards present in Aon are greatly different from those on Roshar, but there are certainly links. Maybe this is obvious/already been discussed, but I am curious about other people's thoughts.

Hello all! I've gotten onto these boards relatively recently with the big build up to the WoR debut, and now I'm totally hooked. It's been fun hearing all the Cosmere discussion and theorizing as it's happening on the WoR board, and now I want to start branching out! Maybe this is a silly post, but what I'm looking for is some sort of "Previously on Lost" for the Mistborn boards. I'm certainly no stranger to the trilogy or AoL (I've read both 3 times), and I've read every book Sanderson has written, so it's not story stuff I need updates on. What I'm looking for is an update on the most popular theories, what the most popular conversations are, what little tidbits that non-17th Sharders would have probably missed, etc. This is partly just to save time trying to do back reading, but it's so I also don't start a thread that has been done to death/is already well established (I won't post a Twinborn powers thread, for instance). Thanks everyone, I hope that this wasn't too awkward/too vague of a request! (-:

Thanks guys for helping clear this up for me! I guess these are details I missed on my first time through, so, I guess I'll just HAVE to do a tWoK and WoR re-read... (-:

I don't know if this has been mentioned by anyone yet, but BS said that the second Mistborn trilogy will take place in the equivalent of real-world 1980s as far as technology goes.

Random side note: does anybody else get a vaguely Bruce Wayne/Alfred relationship from Lift and Wyndle? Except instead of a Batcave there is the Awesomeness Kitchen, and instead of wry-yet-loving remarks about being careful, Wyndle says, "And Miss Lift, do remember to eat your vegetables."

I remember Wyndle complaining about why the Nightwatcher had chosen HER of all people and also a cute, "I'll make an Edgedancer of you yet!" comment, but I didn't remember the awareness of spren part. As for the tenuousness of the bond, I'm still a bit confused about that, because at the height of tWoK the bond between Syl and Kaladin seemed stronger than any bond between Shallan and Puzzle (I don't think there are any Shallan/Puzzle ship theories going around...), so I still don't see why Syl has been less aware than other spren have been.

How do you mean? Aren't all people partially in the Cognitive realm to an extent?

With the various spren of KR/budding KRs we've seen a pretty wide range of awareness and intelligence. We have Pattern who seems to have some awareness of what he used to be and is even able to explain the process of transitioning to being a human's spren. However, I was left with the impression that he doesn't remember everything, or he is unwilling to share all he knows. Ivory, Jasnah's spren we only know that he doesn't like to share info very much. It seems like Relinar's spren was talkative, but Relinar's didn't want to listen, and we really don't know about how much the Stormfather will share with Dalinar or how much Ym's spren shared with him. That leaves us with Wyndle and Syl For whatever reason, our Girl of Awesomeness ended up with a spren that seems to have an extensive memory for what life was like in Shadesmar, talking about how Honorspren and Cryptics would come to see his gardens, or would (attempt to) correct Lift about how her powers worked. Now, it could be that other KR spen could have divulged more but they haven't/we haven't seen the dialogues yet, but I get the impression that Wyndle is very wise to the ways of spren. Syl, on the other hand, can recall only small details, and that only in spurts, ie not liking the Cryptics, but not knowing why (very VERY little dialogue occurs after she comes back, so it could be that she has "remembered" more). At first brush I wrote this off as Kaladin simply not having fully committed to the Ideals and living as a KR, but this is where Wyndle throws a wrench into things: Lift is CLEARLY does not think of herself as an Edgedancer (I can hear her saying, "Are you trying to call me a starving Voidbringer???" in as threatening of a voice that she can muster). She certainly ACTS in ways that are in alignment with Edgedancer ideals, what with her care for Gawx, but if that's all that was needed, Syl should have accordingly became as aware as Wyndle when Kaladin was living out the ideals, and that never appeared to be the case. So, I'm looking to start some theory brainstorming as to either what makes Wyndle special or what makes Syl less aware! Thoughts?

Kind of a big "Duh," but one that hasn't been mentioned, is that I knew Kaladin wouldn't be able to kill Elhokar and that he would come to his defense instead. A small, manly year rolled out when he said "Elhokar is Dalinar's Tien." Also, Jasnah surviving was too much of a given for me to actually worry about her. She's way too interesting of a character for her to leave so quickly, and no one else has her abilities covered. And Shallan having killed her mom and dad I called before the book came out.

Probably one of my favorite characters in the books is Szeth because of how well Brandon has written him. Szeth has a profound dedication to (what I would call) a core belief in Knowledge, defined for these purposes as "the right and proven way." It seems this desire to do things the clearly CORRECT way is catalyzed by a sense of Justice, which I will define as "the fair and equitable share of knowledge" - in other words, the rules are the rules, everyone should know them, and everyone should follow them without compromise. This translates into an overwhelming compulsion to DO THE RIGHT THING and to NEVER SHARE FALSE INFORMATION. This dedication to Knowledge and Justice also tells us why, when Szeth being told by his former Shin masters that he was Truthless when he said the KR were returning, Szeth absolutely lost it - he was sharing false information, which violates his sense of Justice, and it was wrong knowledge. In this, Szeth's greatest fear is shown to be Ignorance. In fact, the places where we see Szeth most unhinged in parts of WoR are when he is least sure of the correctness of his Knowledge. I am actually careful to say Knowledge, not Truth, because as we've seen from Shallan's conversations with Pattern, Truth is subjective. It is about matters with black-and-white, right-or-wrong answers that Szeth is most concerned with. So! That's a lot of text without a theory of Szeth's salvation - but it is necessary for the next part. As we've seen with Darkness/Nalan/Nin in Lift's chapter, an even more extreme example of a need for Justice, he will only kill when it is LEGAL to do so and will stop when he finds himself in the wrong for doing so. We know Szeth does this as well, and is in fact horrified to think that he was Ignorant of his non-Truthless-ness and having killed so many people needlessly. What I believe we will see, if Szeth is to see salvation, would be an extreme show of compassion from an authority that can show him the "good guy" version of what's right. Szeth will never be without a need for Justice and Knowledge, he simply needs new rules to go by. I'm of course worried about Nin showing him what's "right" with his Skybreaker training, but my guess is that this internal conflict will be the center of Stones Unhallowed. Just my two cents, I'm curious to see yours!

This is awesome! Though, I also have a small correction; you have the Skybreaker's second attribute as "Confidant" not "Confident." I'm pretty sure if I told Szeth a guilty secret he would kill me, so... a poor confidant. lol

With Peter's addendum, we don't necessarily need both S's included in the key, unless you wanted to add a note to the key saying that extra lines can be decoration. Please don't take this as any sort of criticism, I am still in awe of your glyph translating awesomeness! :-D

Others well pointed out the Shallan conflict with Truth, but I don't actually think that either Brave/Obedient OR Love/Healing is necessarily out of line for Adolin's murder of Sadeas. On the Obedient and Love portion, the murder is definitely related to the damage Sadeas has done to Dalinar, who Adolin both loves and obeys. Even more, Adolin was told to kill Sadeas - granted, it was supposed to be in a duel, but you can't argue that the overall goal was achieved. Also, Adolin was likely aware of the illegality of what he did, so he the decision was made with knowledge that he may suffer greatly for his decision - there are certainly those that would call that bravery. Now, I can't claim the action healed Sadeas, but I think that it could be seen as an attempt to heal the divided Alethkar. Now, obviously, I could be wrong about all of this. I simply see a compelling argument to be made for Adolin to become a Dustbringer/Releaser, if indeed he becomes a KR.