KidWayne

Can someone help me understand what is going on with silver on Lumar and Threnody? Why is silver allomantically inert on Scadrial when it appears to extinguish investiture on other planets of the cosmere? Aluminum acts that way in Allomancy but on worlds where silver has an effect, aluminum is an insulator and a concealer. On these worlds, aluminum is inert with regard to investiture, but it doesn’t eradicate it (in the way that silver does). Another interesting fact I noted was that both Lumar and Threnody are not actively invested by a shard. Not sure that is relevant, but it could be. So, what is up with silver?

Energy is transmitted in waves. You can invert a wave and cancel it. To do this with matter, you need anti-matter. When matter and anti-matter meet, they annihilate one another and release energy. IRL energy and matter are fundamentally the same thing. In the Cosmere, (according to WoB) energy, matter, AND investiture are all the same thing. However, you couldn't invert a sound wave (or a light wave), direct it at a solid object, and expect it to annihilate matter. You would first need to convert the matter into energy before you could use the inversion trick (unless you can create anti-matter). https://wob.coppermind.net/events/360/#e10854

It seems to me that war + growth = destruction You would need Ambition to mix with war to get to empire/conquest.

I found this when looking up silver alloys. "Nickle-silver" is a misnomer that has zero elemental silver in it (it's tin + copper + zinc). However, I found this and thought it interesting... So basically, a silver + nickle alloy might be used in the very setting we see it in RoW - to solder/weld something together (in the book it was used to attach the diamond to the Raysium blade Navani & Raboniel were studying). Alternatively some Sterling Silver mixes could use nickle... Sterling silver is made up of 92.5% pure silver and 7.5% of another metal, usually copper. Sterling silver is mostly uninteresting, people like it because it is shiny and it's main uses reflect that (e.g. silverware & jewelry) I'm not sure if this tells us anything about the story, but I am always impressed with Brandon when he gets the science right!

Anyone think humans will leave Roshar in Book 5 and return in Book 6? I mean #5 is supposed to be set in Shinovar...

Yeah, but that's kind of like the IRL version of saying, "If Marines shoved their fists down the throat of a living kitten to wear like a glove, then they would gain magical powers that would allow them to block bullets." The point is that kitten murder is gruesome and sick, not the nonsense about blocking bullets with kittens... that isn't a thing; don't try that at home kids.

See I thought the foreshadowing and T's eagerness for the Emul offensive was foreshadowing for Odium's forces to attack Urithiru. Interesting that you saw it as a foreshadowing of Dalinar's death. I wonder which of us has the right read on this? Maybe both of us are right...

I really like this theory. It explains what makes Nightblood unique and a non-reproducible entity/experiment. However, this gets at something else that has been gnawing at me... The whole intent + command thing is straight out of Warbreaker & the magic system that allows breath to do various things. No other magic system we have seen is explicit about the intent + command system although it can be inferred or explained using structural qualities of the various systems... Roshar: spren provides intent, the command is supplied by the will of the surgebinder Scadrial: intent here is weird it seems related to the mechanics of the magic systems instead of the magic user; command comes from the magic user Taldain: intent is baked into sand mastery; command supplied by the will of the sand master Sel: lots of magic systems; intent seems to apply to magic system; we don't really know enough about most systems to explain the command portion, though the stamp seems to provide the command in forgery (the role intent plays in forgery is a mystery to me though) Nalthis: command is supplied by a spoken command, not merely by the unspoken will of the awakener; like on Scadrial, intent applies to magic system not the user or magical effect.

Is waiting on both Dawnshard AND the U.S. Presidential election results driving anyone else absolutely bat-poop insane?! I can't focus at work and I can barely sleep. It's like Christmas eve for an 8 year-old where Christmas eve lasts somewhere between 7 and 14 days. Longest two weeks of my life...

OK, so not to derail the entire conversation, but I find this line of thought very provocative in a thoughtful kind of way. I also can't help but make real world parallels. Since you seem to be more in-the-know (historically speaking) than your average college graduate, what hope does the real world have in addressing it's existential problems (e.g. climate change, wealth inequality, resource depletion) if vested interests are so politically powerful? Does history ever show the vested interests getting sidelined for the greater good without something as paradigm-shattering as a world war?

I'm curious to know whether anyone has any thoughts on why Ishar/Tezim is holding back? I know some have connected him to epigraphs that suggest a traitor, so do we think he is a fully committed ally of Odium or is he just a total loose cannon?

Yeah, I know... That's why I expressed my frustration with my inability to use Marasi's talent to speed up time around me and skip to the release of the whole book. Also, that would get me past all the U.S. election ads and other nonsense, which would be a nice bonus.

Is anyone else disappointed with the brevity of this chapter and the nothing-burger it serves up on new developments? Navani had a brief but inconsequential conversation with Szeth. Also, she makes an interesting observation about the perfect void-sphere. There was a touching scene between her and her grandson. I want to hear more from Jasnah. I want Nov. 17 to hurry up and get here... Ahhhhh!!!

I can't say why, but this jumped off the page at me. How does access to Shadesmar enable Dalinar to properly fight Odium?

I'm seeking spoilers here, but does anyone have any idea about whether Kal ever gets over his funk before the end of this book? I'm not asking whether he swears ideal #4, I just want to know if he ever overcomes his mental state (circa chapter 10).

I love this idea, but isn't Shallan a bit young for all that? Are you suggesting that she is actually some old crone who has simply lightweaved herself as a young girl with no memory of how to use her abilities? Wouldn't her experimentation in WoR have found that out? What about the need for stormlight and the occasions where she has run out of it? If this isn't right, how has such a young woman already lived enough of her life to have made it to a 5th ideal full KR?

Warning! General Cosmere Spoilers abound in this post. Interesting... This makes me curious what allomancy's relation is to investiture in general and how that might relate to the effect that allomantic metals have with investiture coming from sources other than Preservation. Brandon has said in the past that - when burned - the matrix (crystalline structure) of the metals acts as a kind of filter or a key for the investiture to be expressed. This operates similar to the way nahel bond with a spren acts as a kind of key to unlock the use of a pair of the various surges. The thing that has always tripped me up about allomancy is where is the investiture? On Taldain the sand is invested by the sun and (I think) water is used to enable sand mastery. On Nalthis, breath carries investiture and words are used to unlock the powers. On Sel, the Seons carry investiture and the Aons are used to express/unlock supernatural abilities. Roshar and Sel are pretty similar; on Roshar stormlight is invested, and a nahel bond with a spren works to express/unlock the surges. So if the metal itself is not invested on Scadrial (but is instead the means by which allomancy is expressed), then I can only assume that Scadrians have some kind of innate investiture (which is - in my head cannon - similar to Nalthian Breath, except that it isn't transferable). This is supported by the concept of Lerasium which can bestow the necessary investiture to someone who does not already possess it. The Coppermind's article on Allomancy is all about how the metals function as "a conduit" to "connect" the allomancer to Preservation. However, if there was no internal investiture then the poorly understood concept of Connection is all we have to explain why everyone (or at least every Scadrian) can't swallow metal and use allomancy as if they were Mistborn. However, the term "Mistborn" contains a clue... In Scadrial's Cognitive realm, the living are represented as mist and metal glows. Whereas on Roshar the living are represented as glass beads. This suggests that the mists on Scadrial contain investiture which is just plain odd, but may facilitate the process of investing allomancers in a similar (albeit a slower and less direct method) way that Surgebinders on Roshar breathe in investiture/stormlight. So, all that is to say that Mental Allomantic metals should have an effect on spren - the occasionally invested manifestations of ideas and inhabitants of Roshar's cognitive realm. Fabrials require a gem invested with stormlight, a spren, and some kind of metal to regulate the effects caused by capturing a spren in an invested gem. Here the spren is functioning as a substitute for a magic user while the metals are filtering the magic by affecting the magic user (much like the voidlight fabrial affected Kaladin, Lift, and Godeke). The metals act as an extra filter that affects the spren. The metal is not being consumed because it is not functioning to access and release investiture; it is only being used to filter magic (i.e. the effect caused by the expression/release of investiture). So I agree with you. Allomancy on Roshar would not result in the manipulation of spren; allomancy connects one to Preservation's investiture (or draws on a Scadrian's innate investiture) and when metal is burned it flows through the atomic structure of the allomantic metals to produce an effect. EDIT: I just found Karger's post and I think it is an accurate way of explaining what I'm trying to say. The only question I have is this: Why is the metal consumed when used in conjuction with Preservation but not with other sources like stormlight? My take away is that various metals have an effect on every kind of investuiture. They are a unique focus which are most directly expressed through the Scadrian metallic arts. Silver - while not allomantic - has an effect on Threnody. I'm not sure how allomantic metals would affect the less physical and more abstract magic systems. I suppose you could make Aons out of metal, but I'm not sure how metal would come into play on Nalthis (maybe as they grow technologically, the metals used in equipment to record audio might have an effect? Not sure if this would work because of the intent requirement though). We just don't know enough about Taldainian magic to say much about it (would water with trace allomantic metals have subtle effects on sand mastery?).

Your "Standards X is correct" has another possibility attached to it... Standards X is correct. Standards X is universally correct, but to err is human. Whether as a result of a lack of willpower, being overcome with lust (for whatever - sex, power, money, ease, or pleasure), or an excess of pride; we have all compromised our own personal morals - including but not limited to Standards X - from time to time. It's not always indicative of a belief that the standards don't apply to oneself or others, just personal weakness.

Theylenah was a trick play. Your question is like asking why - after a sack on a flea-flicker play - the Patriots have any hope of defeating the Browns. The whole hope of winning at Theylenah rested on converting Dalinar into Odium's Champion, turning Sadeas' soldiers into Odium's footsoldiers, a surprise attack by thunderclasts, and depriving the remaining forces of their Navy. With Dalinar, on his side, Odium would surely have won (as the remaining Radiants would have run out of stormlight and been reduced to ordinary sharbearers without plate).

Isn't that his exact problem? Kelsier doesn't have a body. He needed Spook to help him out with Hemalurgy + some blending of the metallic arts to achieve immortality. This is why we see him as "the Sovereign" with a spiked eye, I suspect. This has to be the Scadrian equivalent to whatever the Fused are doing on Roshar. Also, don't forget that - prior to his brief Ascension - Kel is referred to by Nazh as a shadow.

This is an amusing, but somewhat confusing, joke. The humor is in the fact that both young Dalinar & Tonk Fah like to hurt people.

OK, so if Brandon is 42 as of December 2017, and Stormlight 4 is published in 2020, then that makes our beloved Creator of the Cosmere 45 years old (give or take 3 months) at the publication of Stormlight 4. Brandon has 6 Stormlight books to go, and they are taking about 3 years to produce (without allowing for a break in between the first 5 Stormlight books and the last 5). That makes Brandon 63 years old (even without a break). I'm starting to worry that much of the Cosmere won't be completed. After all, we have all of these left... Stormlight #4 & #5 Stormlight #6 - #10 Mistborn era 3 Mistborn era 4 (?) Warbreaker 2 Elantris 2 Silence Divine Threnody novel Aether of Night Sixth of the Dusk 2 Dragonsteel Now we learn that Brandon is writing two other non-cosmere trilogies (i.e. Skyward & Apocalypse Guard) plus Dark One and Alcatraz 2. I'm sure these will be great, but I just want to finish the story of the Cosmere before Brandon (or myself) dies. I liked the Reckoners series well enough, but I would have much preferred to have received The Lost Metal (Wax & Wayne #4) sooner. Will any others join with me in hopes that Sanderson will drop (at least) Apocalypse Guard in favor of something from the list above?

Since hydrogen fluoride (HF) is a byproduct of the primary industrial process used to create aluminum (i.e. Hall–Héroult process) it makes me wonder if Brandon knows (or was influenced by the effect that hydrofluoric acid has on human tissue. Brandon's descriptions of lifeless in WB and of what happens to limbs that are cut by a shardblade sound a lot like how tissue that comes into contact with hydrofluoric acid is affected.

So, for posterity's sake... JEZRIEN ↓ VEDEL ↓ ISHAR ↓ ASH ↓