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      Oathbringer Spoiler Policy   11/13/2017

      Oathbringer is out! Let's make our policy on spoilers clear! 1. You must preface topics with Oathbringer spoilers with the prefix [OB] in the front 2. You are only allowed to post spoilers and spoiler topics in the Oathbringer Spoiler Board, Cosmere Theories, and some select work-related forums. 3. For posts in the Oathbringer Spoiler Board you do not need to use spoiler tags inside a topic marked [OB]. For Cosmere Theories, you also do not need to put spoiler tags inside your topic if the topic has [OB] in the title. However, for Cosmere Theories, if you are adding Oathbringer stuff to an old theory without the [OB] tag, those must go in spoiler tags and you must make it obvious outside the spoiler tag that the spoiler is regarding Oathbringer content. 4. For select things that do require talking about OB spoilers, in Events, Coppermind, and Arcanum forums, those are allowed but keep OB spoilers in spoiler tags 5. Avoid and minimize spoilers in topic titles--even though those two boards will not appear in the Recent Topics ticker, topic titles still appear in Recent Activity and the forum home.  6. You aren't allowed to post Oathbringer spoilers in places other than listed, even with spoiler tags.  It will be nine months and then the Oathbringer board will be re-merged with the Stormlight board and you will not need to tag these spoilers. If you'd like to move something in the Stormlight Archive board to the Oathbringer board, to update it with new Oathbringer information, Report the post and we will happily move it to the Oathbringer spoiler board. Part-by-part Reactions Though the Oathbringer Spoiler Board will be very spoilery, very fast (maybe don't come there until you've read the book, as people do have copies that bookstores sold early), you'll have these five topics for reactions if you want to nerd out: Part 1 Reactions
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FeatherWriter

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FeatherWriter last won the day on May 19 2014

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  1. Weeeelll I'm like halfway through it but then I got distracted. So I probably would not Splintercast that one just because it'd be weird.
  2. Apparently I was summoned. Hello. This is your daily reminder that I would die for Renarin Kholin. And also as of Oathbringer, Taln. Taln is extremely good as well. Y'all can probably guess my favorite part because it started with me having a longstanding theory proved COMPLETELY RIGHT and then followed up with Renarin POV, which is basically all I've ever wanted in my life ever.
  3. I almost wonder if this is another red herring to try to throw people off the "there's something up with Renarin still" scent. Like perhaps that Truthwatcher just predicted this was coming without actually having future visions, but was phrased that way to be like "seeeeee all Truthwatchers are like this! Stop thinking something is wrong, Feather. Quit it, stop guessing things before the reveal" Nice try, Brandon. I'm wise to your tricks.
  4. We also have the fact that Jasnah thinks she can teach Shallan Soulcasting, even though they're of different orders. I believe that surges are mostly identical across Orders, though they might perhaps be used for different purposes. For instance, while Lightweavers seem inclined to use illusions to hide truth and tell lies, I wonder if there might be a way for Truthwatchers to use Illumination to reveal a situation, or call attention to something that might have otherwise been missed. To literally illuminate the truth. Or, if Renarin gets a handle on his Illumination, I think he might be able to use it to show people what his visions look like, which could be very powerful.
  5. I feel like Renarin might actually make a good champion against Odium, actually. I think with his surges and Stormlight, he'd be a formidable human foe, but more importantly, as Taravangian found out, there's something about Renarin that Odium doesn't seem to be able to predict. The Diagram is flawed in a way that Renarin Kholin has something to do with.
  6. As DiamondMind said, I previously laid out my reasoning for thinking that in another post which can be read here: The basic gist is that the way in which Renarin's visions manifested themselves didn't seem to line up with what we knew of Surgebinding in that they seemed to be wholly involuntary for him and even possibly painful. Pair that with Vorinism's deep-set fear of seeing the future as being something "of Odium" or "of the Voidbringers" and I had major warning lights going off that Renarin's visions were not entirely what they seemed. Oathbringer really cinched this leading up to the reveal too. For one, no one talks about Renarin's visions or the fact that he was seeing the future, which should have been something extremely concerning to our mostly Vorin cast! And yet, it's radio silence until a throwaway line in Part 4 (I think) about "well his spren told him something was coming" that, if you've been paying attention to the details, does not at all line up with what we saw of Renarin's visions in WoR. Double triple bonus points if you're tuned-in enough to realize that there's significance in that no one sees Renarin's spren either. Glys stays hidden for the entire book, and we see that Stump's confirmation as a Truthwatcher serves as the point of comparison so that we can see what a normal Truthwatcher spren looks like before we get the reveal that Glys is not normal. Most people wouldn't pay attention, but for someone like me who is completely tuned in to Renarin's storyline, there were red flags all throughout leading up to this reveal. And oh was it so very sweet. So, this was... my thought originally as well. However there's some meta reason why I'm going back on it. At the end of the book I was certain. The Fused are Voidbinders but Renarin is not. He's should just have somewhat twisted powers due to Sja-anat, right? Well... there have been some more behind the scenes things that seem to imply otherwise. I believe there's an explicit Word of Peter that Renarin is actually a Voidbinder, which was the first wrench in my plans. @Argent had another more secretive Word of Brandon (that was previously embargoed, but may be able to be talked about now that Oathbringer is out? I'll let Argent make that call though.) that also pointed towards a link between Renarin and Voidbinding. So... I don't really know for certain. "What is Voidbinding and what qualifies someone as a Voidbinder" is something I'd love to get worked out without having to wait until Book 4, but for now I've gotta take all the scraps and make them fit together somehow? Ha, pleased to have been of service. If there's two things I'm good at in this fandom, it's Renarin knowledge and making people miserable with fanfics. I'm sure I'll come up with something suitably horrible in the wait for Book 4, too.
  7. Welcome @Thread89. Please try to avoid double posting. If you need to quote more than one person, you can use the "Multiquote" button (the plus at the bottom of each post). If you need to add to what you previously published, please use "Edit." That said, I'll admit I'm not overly fond of the Jasnah and Kaladin ship. I think their age difference is a bit wide for me, and I don't really think they have much in common. The conversation in Oathbringer seemed to be a confirmation that they are wildly different people who aren't going to get along very well and that it'll be a struggle for them to work together.
  8. That feels like it's backwards to me, Blight, since then Renarin would be the only Voidbinder we see and his situation is obviously weird. We've got that whole chart of Voidbinding powers but the weird corruption situation is the only thing that actually qualifies? It seems more likely that there's different orders of powers like we see with the Fused that match that chart, which means that the Fused would be the Voidbinders.
  9. And is also very used to wearing a uniform, while most of the rest of Bridge 4 live in the barracks and were bridgemen before this. Hygiene is still probably not something they all care about very much aside from probably Sigzil.
  10. Looking forward to it, Bleeder. As Argent said though, I don't think Lightspren are the Truthwatcher spren, despite the fact that they look like light. If it's a spren we've already seen, Mistspren seem to be a more likely candidate, but Brandon has said that he's not ready to canonize which spren the Truthwatchers have yet. Though I admit the expressions of Illumination tend to be a bit less well defined, I do think both the Adolin scene and the Thunderclast scene are Illumination. We've seen that illusions scare off some kinds of voidish entities from the way that Shallan fights them, and even though it's not a very nuanced used, I think that's what the light that Renarin uses is. Also I am fairly convinced that the Truthwatcher resonance has nothing to do with visions, but is actually an ability to see the truth of situations. Renarin early on seems to be aware of who really killed Sadeas. Stump says that she can always tell when the kids are lying to her and faking, and there's a quote from the in-world Words of Radiance that says: "their silence was not a sign of exceeding abundance of disdain, but rather an exceeding abundance of tact." Tact, because they know what's really happening but choose to politely not air everyone's dirty laundry for the sake of everyone getting along. I feel like I'm developing a little mini-theory that certain orders find certain Surges easier than others. Shallan picks up Illumination far faster than Transformation. Skybreakers learn Gravitation much faster than Division, to the point of being forbidden to use Division before their third oaths. Kaladin uses Adhesion naturally but isn't able to get Gravitation down until he sees the example from Szeth. Lift has Abrasion down pat, but has to be coached through using Progression by Wyndle, who also says that Regrowth would be too hard for her (though she later figures it out in a moment of desperation). And all three of the Truthwatchers we see use Regrowth easily, yet none of the three seem to dabble with Illumination very deeply on screen. Ym used his Progression intentionally but Stump healed unconsciously. I think the same is happening with Renarin, who finds Progression just easier than Illumination, but still has that surge and will be able to use it in time.
  11. Feather was a bad gamma reader and only caught this mistake after the gamma read was finished. Oops. My bad.
  12. A uniqueness in appearance is something that all Shardblades share. They're all very distinctive. Though the forged folds style could be significant, it could also just be the way that the Glysblade looks. It could be the bands of corruption mixed with regular spren power. I'm liking more and more the idea that Glys was a willing participant in his corruption. Makes me wonder what Sja-anat could have said in order to convince a Radiant spren to submit to the power of an Unmade like that. Or maybe she did it without asking, but helped convince Glys that it was a good thing later? I'm really curious to see what Glys says about her or how they'd interact.
  13. So let’s talk Renarin, shall we? Now, if you fine folks are anything like myself, you might have found yourself confused by some of the reveals that Oathbringer brought about regarding Renarin and his powers. This was a twist that I saw coming a long way off, and so I was more than ready when we found out that Renarin had been affected by a voidish corruption and that this was the reason for his strange and ominous visions. If you’d like to see how WoR foreshadowed this moment, you can check out my theory Renarin’s Visions and Truthwatching and see all the reasoning for this twist. However, what I want to do here today is get into the nitty gritty of what’s really going on. Is Renarin a Voidbinder or a Surgebinder or both? Is Glys a Voidspren? How do the visions work? How did this happen? All those good questions are the ones that I’d like to try to tackle here. Theory Disclaimer: Most of these things have not been confirmed in canon and Brandon has been cagey about answering or confirming. However, this explanation is the one which seems most plausible to me based on the evidence at hand. So let me do a bullet point run-down of what I think is happening: Glys is actually a valid Truthwatcher spren, not a voidspren. Renarin is a valid Truthwatcher Radiant and therefore a Surgebinder with access to the surges of Progression and Illumination. Renarin uses Stormlight to power his surges, just like other Radiants. Glys has been corrupted by the Unmade Sja-anat. As a result of this corruption, in addition to his normal Truthwatcher powers, Renarin is afflicted by involuntary visions of the future which neither he nor Glys can control. The points above are those that I feel are fairly concrete, and I’ll go into the reasoning behind those ideas later below. However, upon this assumed situation, I believe that the following ideas are viable possibilities. The following points are less certain than those above, but these are the ideas that seem the most plausible to me, given the circumstances: The powers that the Fused display are expressions of Voidbinding. Renarin’s future visions are possibly also an expression of Voidbinding, but his other powers are not. If Renarin’s Voidbinding and Fused Voidbinding work in the same way, it is possible that all Voidbinding powers come from the influence of the Unmade, in that Sja-anat can grant Voidish future visions while other Unmade grant different powers, like illusions, frictionlessness, or gravity, as we see other Fused use. And upon these assumptions, we find several questions arise regarding the nature of the situation: If both Renarin and the Fused are Voidbinders, is a spren involved in the granting of Voidbinding powers to the Fused in the same way they were granted to Renarin? If Voidish powers are each affiliated with an Unmade, why are there seemingly 10 powers on the Voidbinding chart if there are only 9 Unmade? Does Odium grant a Bondsmith equivalent himself? If Voidbinding powers are not granted by the Unmade, how are they gained? In what way are Renarin and the Fused similar in situation that grants them the same powers? What caused the hypergraphia that accompanied the visions of the Everstorm, and why does that no longer happen when Renarin gets visions? All of which are fascinating, but unfortunately, more likely to get a RAFO than an answer in a signing line. The first I have already asked and been RAFO’d and I believe the others are going to be answered similarly, if attempted. If I had to guess, these are reveals that will happen in Renarin’s flashback book. Considering that book is in the back five, we’ve probably got a while to wait. Alas. Regardless, no use fretting over the information we don’t have when it’s so much more fun to dissect the information we do have. And Oathbringer certainly gave us plenty to dissect. So, let’s take the situation that I’ve outlined above and break it down with some textual evidence to help explain where these ideas come from. Glys the Truthwatcher spren and Renarin the Radiant This is one of the easiest points to guess, considering the wealth of information we have on the topic. A lot of this is due to the Renarin point of view chapters in Part 5. (Thank you, Brandon, I owe you my soul for those.) Renarin’s surges seem to work perfectly normally. He heals people with Regrowth at several points in the novel, fairly naturally. I believe we see a slight, unconscious use of Illumination in the scene with Adolin and Gallant, when Renarin makes a perfected vision of Adolin appear. Renarin also mentions trying to train with Shallan in using Illumination, but he has difficulty with it. Now, it could be assumed that Renarin’s failure to grasp Illumination is a sign that his surges are wrong, and yet I think this is simply another example of a Radiant finding one surge more easy to pick up than another. Shallan is naturally better at Illumination than Transformation. Lift is better at Abrasion than Progression. It seems common enough that Radiants have an affinity for one of their surges over the other. For Renarin, I believe this is that Progression is easier than Illumination. In addition to his surges, Renarin’s other expressions of Radiant abilities seem normal. Glys is able to form as a Shardblade, which no one deems as looking out of the ordinary. It also functions to open Oathgates. His healing factor works as the other Radiants’, albeit augmented by his power of Progression to make healing extremely rapid. Most tellingly, his powers use Stormlight, just as all the others do. Ivory says that there is a rightness to the bond between Renarin and Glys and that spren of Odium should not be able to bond with humans under normal circumstances. Through all of these things, one can assume that Renarin and Glys have a valid Nahel bond and are bonded as Radiant and spren, just as the others are. Sja-anat’s Corruption However, in addition to the normal suite of a Truthwatcher’s powers and the Nahel bond, there is another factor in the mix: Sja-anat. When Sja-anat speaks with Shallan she speaks of her son when telling Shallan that she is not an enemy, as though he would vouch for her. This is undoubtedly Glys. It’s interesting to note that this seems to indicate that Glys is working with Sja-anat, possibly willingly. Perhaps she approached a Radiant spren hoping that by giving changing one of them, she would have an ally who would help the Radiants trust her. Or perhaps it’s something else. Hard to say at this point. Regardless, it is because of this that Renarin can see the future, and why he is consumed with visions. Though it is possible that other Truthwatchers have a manner of foresight, I don’t believe it would manifest as Renarin’s does. Ivory states that future sight is a power of Odium, as the Vorins believe. I believe Sja-anat has been hoping to swap sides and is using Glys as a way to do it, as well as helping Shallan instead of killing them when they went through the Oathgate. Voidbinding So in the end, what is Voidbinding? Hard to say with certainty, since despite how often we see Voidbinders, there doesn’t seem to be a lot of answers about it. Working under the assumption that the Fused’s powers are Voidbinding we can see a few things, at least: Voidbinding seems to line up with surges in many cases, as we see Fused manipulating gravity and friction, just like Kaladin and Lift. It’s hard to tell if this means that Renarin’s corrupted sight is also a form of Voidbinding as well, since it doesn’t seem to line up with a Surge the way the others are. The Listener Song of Secrets speaks of Nightform, a form of power which can see the future, which seems as though it might be more similar to what Renarin can do than anything else we’ve seen. The question is, Renarin is getting his void-powers from a corrupted spren, but I don’t believe that the Fused have a corrupted spren giving them powers, which initially made me think that Renarin’s visions were not Voidbinding like the Fused. Now, I’m not so sure. For the moment, I think I will lean toward the idea that Renarin’s visions and the powers of the Fused are both Voidbinding somehow, even if we don’t have details to confirm anything either way. There’s just not enough answers for the moment. Time will tell. If anyone can get answers out of Brandon regarding this topic, I’d be greatly appreciative but I doubt he’s going to answer things. Conclusion There’s a lot that we just don’t know yet, but I’m excited to see where this goes in the future. For now, this is my best guess at what’s really going on until we get some more information on all of it. One thing that hasn’t changed is that I adore Renarin with all of my heart and somehow Brandon continues to write his plotline and character arc in ways which are intensely fascinating to me. Oathbringer has been a triumph and I can’t wait to see what’s in store!
  14. I have a post that I'm working on right now that should help outline my thoughts on what I believe is going on with Renarin and Glys. Soon!
  15. @DiamondMind @Dlyol So, while there's a lot of speculation in this theory that wasn't necessarily right, the heart of the theory and its foundational aspect was that Renarin's visions were not a normal expression of Surgebinding and were probably voidish in nature. Which, yep. Nailed it. It's still possible that other Truthwatchers might have had a method of foresight or that their Illumination might work differently from Lightweavers or stuff like that but at this theory's heart, it was correct. Renarin's visions are not natural Surgebinding, and Oathbringer confirms it!