Sand Master

True, the progression is not the same in every order. But even Lightweavers say the first Oath: Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination. It seems odd that a little girl (what, five, six years old?) would say that out of the blue. Especially since the only KR we've seen saying them as part of their Oaths did so after being told what the First Ideal was. The other Ideals, in Kaladin's case anyway, seemed to just come to him without being told what they were. But both Kaladin and Dalinar had someone else tell them what the First Ideal was before saying it themselves. So, assuming this is necessary, who told Shallan? And why? If it's not necessary, how do they know/find out what to say?

Not according to both Wikipedia and urbandictionary, which seem to be the only two main sources with a definition. Both of those say it just has to be the same gender.

It feels like we're straying into slash fiction territory. I don't think Shallan has the kind of personality to even think of something like that, let alone try it.

I thought the same thing. Especially since he mentions the God Beyond, which seems like it could easily refer to Adonalsium. I've often wondered how close he was to what actually happened.

Hey, thanks!

Alright, first part of Memebreaker. Here it is:

I... I don't get it. I know there's nothing less funny than explaining humor but... help? After looking it up: clever!

What @drsabek said. Alcatraz even wonders to himself why she dyes her hair, so it's not likely to be anything more magical than that.

I don't want to do anything against social protocol (from what I've been able to tell, once a thread is dead you're not supposed to post on it again?) but I also didn't want to make an entire new thread for something that already exists. So here's what I'm thinking: a lot of people have talked about doing Memebreaker here, and I have been wanting to reread Warbreaker anyway. If nobody has a problem with it, I'd be interested in posting for Memebreaker.

I actually thoroughly enjoyed Firstborn...

Fair enough. Still, it seems unlikely that he's the only person to do so in the entire series. Other people have probably done so without it being seen on screen.

Your reasoning for why it wouldn't be Elsecallers is because it wouldn't require much and Jasnah asked the spren questions? The dictionary defines subterfuge as "deceit used in order to achieve one's goal". I think that hiding from all the other Orders to make them think that their bond had been broken would count as deceit. As for Jasnah questioning the highspren, it never says that she's the first one to have done it. In fact, one of the epigraphs in Words of Radiance says that Elsecallers "were prodigiously benevolent, allowing others as auxiliary to their visits and interactions; though they did never relinquish their place as prime liaisons with the great ones of the spren". This would imply that Elsecallers used to speak to spren in Shadesmar all the time.

But in the examples you give where he's reflecting on Sigzil's skin tone, that has relevance and meaning to the story and characters that we know. If he randomly mentioned a same-sex couple walking down the street without actually doing anything with that couple, it would feel out of place. I think where the disagreement here really comes in is that you say, "it has to be mentioned, somewhere." I disagree. I'm sure people go to use the privy multiple times in the story. I'm sure that's accepted by society. It's not mentioned simply because it's not very important. Just because it exists and is accepted doesn't mean it must be mentioned.

Yes, but the context for skin color is given because it helps describe the physical appearance of the character in question. You're not going to be introduced to a character and out of the blue see, "XYZ was a tall Makabaki man who also happened to be homosexual." It's not a topic that's going to come up often in conversation, and so we don't see it unless it's important.

I suppose. That is what I meant, and I was mostly basing it off the fact that if there were someone who I would otherwise be romantically interested in that was double my own age, it would definitely pretty much be a deal breaker for me. But to each their own I guess.