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      Oathbringer Spoiler Policy   11/13/2017

      Oathbringer is out! Let's make our policy on spoilers clear! 1. You must preface topics with Oathbringer spoilers with the prefix [OB] in the front 2. You are only allowed to post spoilers and spoiler topics in the Oathbringer Spoiler Board, Cosmere Theories, and some select work-related forums. 3. For posts in the Oathbringer Spoiler Board you do not need to use spoiler tags inside a topic marked [OB]. For Cosmere Theories, you also do not need to put spoiler tags inside your topic if the topic has [OB] in the title. However, for Cosmere Theories, if you are adding Oathbringer stuff to an old theory without the [OB] tag, those must go in spoiler tags and you must make it obvious outside the spoiler tag that the spoiler is regarding Oathbringer content. 4. For select things that do require talking about OB spoilers, in Events, Coppermind, and Arcanum forums, those are allowed but keep OB spoilers in spoiler tags 5. Avoid and minimize spoilers in topic titles--even though those two boards will not appear in the Recent Topics ticker, topic titles still appear in Recent Activity and the forum home.  6. You aren't allowed to post Oathbringer spoilers in places other than listed, even with spoiler tags.  It will be nine months and then the Oathbringer board will be re-merged with the Stormlight board and you will not need to tag these spoilers. If you'd like to move something in the Stormlight Archive board to the Oathbringer board, to update it with new Oathbringer information, Report the post and we will happily move it to the Oathbringer spoiler board. Part-by-part Reactions Though the Oathbringer Spoiler Board will be very spoilery, very fast (maybe don't come there until you've read the book, as people do have copies that bookstores sold early), you'll have these five topics for reactions if you want to nerd out: Part 1 Reactions
      Part 2 Reactions
      Part 3 Reactions
      Part 4 Reactions
      Full Book Reactions For parts 1-4, they will not include the interludes immediately following it. On Discord All Oathbringer spoilers on Discord will be exclusively in the #oathbringer_spoilers channel for the nine month spoiler period and nowhere else.


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214 Gyorn


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  • Birthday 09/03/1977

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  1. I agree with all of this (even in the theological setting). Great way of putting it! I agree. I think you bring up an interesting point as well: we expect people to face their failings in order to be redeemed. But we don't expect them to do it all at once, and we don't expect them not to fall again in the process (ergo Dalinar's 3rd oath). It is sadly poetic that Elhokar had to face Moash's wrath, for an act he never made reparations for. Can we look past that, as Elhokar is starting to find his way, or must we insist on the tragic justice of it all? My take: I think it is doubly sad because by seeking vengeance, Moash destroyed a man seeking redemption, and also betrayed his friend, and contributed to more pain in the world. That's often how vengeance works, it just adds more misery, even if it might look justified.
  2. I'd say yes and no. Let me wax a little philosophical (and also take "redemption" to its literal limit). Those sentiments were are actually quite accurate, in my opinion, because nobody deserves redemption. Nobody earns redemption. Sure, you, me, Elhokar, or anyone else could try to pay off the debts we've incurred in our lives, but we'll fail. Especially when it involves taking the life of another; it just can't be undone. Redemption must be bought by someone else, usually the only one who can pay for our past misdeeds (namely God). The question isn't whether someone earns their redemption, it is what they do with the opportunity given to them to change. We leave it to God to make things right, in the end; and only expect people to do the best they can with what they have at the moment. (We pay what we can, and forgive the 100 pence debts. God pays the 1000 talent debts we cannot pay.) That said, I understand you are using redemption in a more limited way, dealing with how a person's actions make us more prone to be forgiving, more trusting. It is hard to believe in forgiveness when someone isn't changed yet. I think this is a struggle for us, not only in Elhokar's case, but in our daily lives. We want the bad guys to lose, and lose big. We aren't rooting for Moash, or our neighbor across the street who offended us, to find forgiveness. We want justice. Thus, this not only says a lot about where Elhokar was (and as another poster says; the tragedy of his early demise, when it looked like he was changing), but also where WE are.
  3. "....he didn't deserve redemption..." This is something I struggle with. I think of Darth Vader, a mass murderer, one who betrayed those who trusted him, blew up planets, etc... and I'm supposed to just forget about all of those things because he finally did something right and stopped the Emporer? Not going to happen. The word "redeem" literally means to buy back. Redemption isn't complete until all wrongs have been righted. This is literally impossible for us humans to obtain. But we recognize when people are on the track to righting past wrongs. We often give the benefit of the doubt to those have started on that path. In Elhokar's case, he is guilty of murdering innocents, and waging a genocidal war. Can he right those wrongs? It would take an extreme amount of change in his life. In Dalinar's case, he is guilty of murdering innocents, and waging a genocidal war (at the behest of his king). Can he right those wrongs? It is still taking a lot of effort on his part, but the fact he keeps standing up and doing better tells me he is trying.
  4. From the album Sazed Protecting Scadrial

    I made this to represent Sazed protecting Scadrial from Trell.
  5. Remember that kandra use hemalurgy (to stay alive!).
  6. Regarding the words of the Diagram that Odium couldn't see. My wife mentioned that perhaps they were written on metal (or some other metal, specific to Oidum), which would make it harder for a shard to see.
  7. Well, might as well give it a try!
  8. The other two spren were the ones who became the thunderclasts.
  9. Another two questions: Why was Taln's healing only temporary? Why did Ash try to get him away from Dalinar, if Dalinar was the reason he came out of his stupor?
  10. I think that one is a definite no. As for the Ghostbloods, Shallan keeps acting like she is not working for them, but she keeps doing what they want! Perhaps the true test will be whether or not she helps Sja.
  11. Thank you for your thoughts on my questions! [I think the Calderis is probably right about Yelig-nar being that third black spren more powerful than the two thunderclasts. I also like that thought about Venli being #10 that some people posited. I also like the theories about the dagger.] Now, what questions did you feel the book left unanswered? I'm interested to see what others are thinking about!
  12. Now that I'm done reading Oathbringer, I have a ton of questions, many of which will probably only be answered in later books. This thread is for people to share the questions they have that have not yet been answered. Here are some of mine: - Why did Moash have to be the one to use the dagger, and not the fused? [Did it connect him to the Oathpact somehow?] - Who was Vivenna chasing? Mraize? What exactly was stolen? [I'm guessing Nightblood.] - If the cryptic that Hoid saved was Elhokar's, then why didn't it go back to the cognitive realm at his death? Is it his son's? - How did they save Elhokar's son from the queen's guard, in an occupied city, full of evil spren, unmade, etc...., etc...? WOW! - Who was the 10th person who was missing when the 3 realms were unified by Dalinar? - When will Dalinar put it together that Szeth was hired by Taravangian? Will Szeth tell Dalinar about the awful experiments done by Mr. T? - What was the third powerful black spren with Odium at the end? [Maybe I just missed it in the avalance at the end. I don't think it was the Thrill spren.] And of course, the biggest whopper of them all: - How in the world will Brandon outdo himself for a 4th time in a row??!! [That ending was amazing!!!]
  13. So, I've been wondering what exactly "unite them" means. Gavilar apparently took it to mean unite the humans into a single controlled kingdon. Much of the time, it appears Dalinar took it to mean unite humans in a coalition. At the end of Oathbringer, it is hinted that it could also refer to his act of uniting the three realms. I wonder, though, if it couldn't presage an even bigger act of unity-- uniting the shards of Adonalsium together again.
  14. I just got my pickup number. I get book 1080. Quite a disappointment since I tried to get on their system for 2 hours. :-(
  15. Yeah, I tried to go say hi today, and the tents were gone! Yikes! They must have been growing beards, and broken the BYU honor code. ;-)