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Cycle 1: Say Goodbye to the Day Princess Celestia stood on her balcony, gazing at the sun as she gently lowered it behind the horizon. It was a pretty sunset, if Celestia did say so herself, full of vibrant shades of red and gold, but something felt off somehow. She couldn’t quite put her hoof on what it was, but perhaps discussing it with Luna could shed some light on it. Luna would be there soon to raise the moon and usher in the Night. Even as Celestia had the thought, her sister threw open the doors and rushed out onto the balcony in a gallop. “Celestia!,” Luna called, her voice urgent and frightened. “You must come at once!” “What’s wrong, little sister?” Celestia asked. “The Elements of Harmony! They’ve gone missing!” Luna cried. Celestia’s heart dropped at the words. She wasted no time, leading Luna as they galloped towards the chamber where the Elements were kept. Pony’s gasped in surprise and worry as they dodged out of the way of their galloping princesses. As she raced through the castle, Celestia’s mind raced, too, considering the implications. The magic of the Elements of Harmony had served and protected the land of Equestria for millennia. If they were missing now… what could that mean? Twilight Sparkle and her friends, the current wielders of the Elements, were away on an extended trip to the Crystal Kingdom, visiting Princess Cadance and Shining Armor. They were not due to return for weeks, though could they have somehow summoned the Elements to them over the great distance? Or could somepony have figured out a way to break in and steal them? A lone guardpony stood at the entrance to the Chamber of the Elements, and he started with surprise at their arrival. “Princess Celestia! Princess Luna!” the guardpony- Captain Shard- said, saluting smartly with the weapon strapped to his foreleg. His son had created the weapon- a sword it was called. “Be on the lookout, Captain!” Celestia ordered. “There is mischief a-hoof!” She paused in front of the doors only long enough to activate her magic. A shimmering golden aura surrounded her horn, and a matching aura surrounded the lock on the doors. With a click the lock opened, and the doors swung open. “Behind me, sister!” Celestia called to Luna as they rushed inside. The chamber was large and elongated, with intricate stained glass windows decorating the walls. At the far end of the chamber stood a pedestal, and atop the pedestal sat the pillowed case where the Elements were stored. And in the case rested... … the Elements of Harmony. Celestia blinked in confusion. The Gemstone necklaces that represented the Elements of Harmony- honesty, kindness, laughter, generosity, loyalty, and magic- each sat in their proper place in the case. “Sister,” she said. “I don’t understand-” The doors slammed shut behind her. Celestia whirled to see Luna there, a malicious glint in her eye and a twisted green aura enveloping her horn. Before Celestia could react, Luna shot a fiery green blast of energy at her, and the blast knocked Celestia back, dazing her. “I must thank you for leading me here, sister,” Luna said, putting a sarcastic emphasis on the last word. “You are not my sister!” Celestia cried, firing a golden blast of energy from her own horn. Luna deflected it easily, but it was just a distraction anyway. When the glowing blasts cleared, Celestia hit her foe with a second wave of magic. The image of Luna melted away, revealing Chrysalis- Queen of the Changeling hordes. Chrysalis scowled, looking down at herself, but then changed her grimace into a laugh. “No matter,” she gloated. “Nopony is here to see me but you, and once I deal you I will become you, and take your place as the object of everypony’s adoration.” “You are a fool, Chrysalis!” Celestia declared, readying another blast of energy. “We defeated you before, and we will do so again.” Crysalis snorted in derision. “Oh? And how do you plan to do that? Cadance and Shining Armor aren’t here this time, and Twilight Sparkle and her irksome friends aren’t here either to use the Elements of Harmony. And as I recall, the last time we fought it was you who was defeated, Celestia. You see, we were careful this time. A handful of my minions have infiltrated your precious kingdom and have been watching for months now, waiting for the perfect opportunity to strike.” From the other side of the doors they could hear the sounds of fighting, and of Captain Shard calling for backup. There was a crash and Captain Shard cried out. “Ah, see? There they are now.” Chrysalis continued. “Once we deal with you and the Elements of Harmony are safely locked away, there will be no force in Equestria that will be able to stop me.” Celestia let her magic loose, firing a off a beam of golden light. Queen Chrysalis fired her own beam as well, and the two beams exploded as they struck. Celestia staggered back, as did the Changeling Queen, but Chrysalis recovered first. Chrysalis fired another blast and Celestia was thrown back once again. She slammed into something, and glancing up she saw it was the pedestal holding the Elements of Harmony. Celestia turned her gaze back to Queen Chrysalis, and smiled grimly. “You have made one mistake, Chrysalis. Twilight and her friends aren’t the only ones that can use the Elements of Harmony. Anypony with the right characteristics can wield their power.” Princess Celestia activated her magic again, and a golden light surrounded the gemstones above her. She poured everything she had left into the gemstones, causing the Elements to rise into the air, and in a flash they shot to the side, blasting out one of the stained glass windows and streaking out into the open air. They zipped across the sky, heading towards the town of Ponyville, and in moments they had disappeared from view. “NOOO!!!” Queen Chrysalis screamed, “What have you done!?” “I have sent the Elements to ponies that can use them,” Celestia declared. “Use them to stop you!” Chrysalis snarled and blasted Celestia again with her magic, but this time she didn’t let up. Celestia felt the Changeling magic seeping into her, paralyzing her limbs and draining away her power. But it was too late to stop her plan. The ponies she had sent the Elements to would be able to stop the Changelings, if they worked together. Celestia prayed that it would be enough. As her vision started growing dark, Celestia looked through the broken window at the stars glimmering in the night sky. The stars seemed to shimmer and move, and a pale blue light flared alight in the midst of them. The last thing Celestia saw was the blue light striking Queen Chrysalis, throwing the Changeling to the side. Then Celestia slipped into unconsciousness. ***A short time later*** A sizable crowd had gathered in central square in Ponyville. Princess Luna looked over them as she prepared to address them. Ponies of all types, from all walks of life, all wondering what had happened. They had seen flashes of light and had heard explosions coming from the Royal Castle in Canterlot. They were worried. “Citizens of Ponyville!” Luna called, and the crowd quieted. “I bring dire news. Princess Celestia was attacked by Chrysalis, Queen of the Changelings, a short time ago, and the Elements of Harmony have gone missing. I arrived in time to stop the attack, but not before Celestia was terribly injured. She sleeps now, her body overcome by Changeling magic. As long as there are Changelings nearby, I am afraid that she will not be able to awaken. Queen Chrysalis fled when I attacked her, which means that there are other Changelings nearby. “It will take nearly all the power I possess to raise the Sun and the Moon, and to protect my sister from further harm, so I must call on you to find out the Changelings in our midst. Be careful, they can take on the guise of anypony, even your closest friends. Be on the lookout for those among you who do not act as they should, who may be working against us. When you have found somepony who you suspect of being a Changeling, bring them to me. “Good luck, my little ponies.” The game has begun! You have about 45 hours for this first cycle. Cycles will end at 9:00 MST (see the timer below) One last thing, a note about contribution. I’ve been saying this at the beginning of all the games I’ve been participating in lately, and as the GM I feel I should also do so here. All of you signed up for this game because something about it appealed to you. You thought it sounded fun. So I invite you to play the game, and have fun! Post when you can, contribute how and where you can. Some people like to do intricate analyses on spreadsheets, or post elaborate roleplays, and some people find they only have enough time to read the thread and post their gut feelings here and there. Wherever you sit, I hope that you will participate and contribute when and where and how often you can. If you do, I guarantee you and everyone else will have a more enjoyable experience because of it. So have fun, and let the game begin! Player List

LG33: Term 8, Month 1 - Chaos I creep through the night. Tonight it doesn’t matter who I kill. It just has to be someone. First, I try the window of a particular hotel room, one I know is always unlocked. There’s a young girl sleeping inside, and I smile. I’m not a particular fan of daggers. I pull out a brilliantly sharp, curved blade, and smile. I prefer swords. I lift my sword - dramatically, since why not? And bring it down - Clang! My sword hits another. Curses. The Bodyguard who had been sitting in the corner has plenty of time to block my swing. Teaches me to be dramatic about things. Fortunately, I'm much faster than the bodyguard. Clang! Clang! Crunch! I grin. I've always liked the sounds of a swordfight. The bodyguard falls to the floor, but the girl's awake and she was or is a student. I don't know what she could do. So I run. Next stop is another inn, one that hasn't been raised by an alarm like the first one probably has by now. I won't repeat it here, beyond brief details: another girl. Another clang. Another bodyguard. Running, again. Seriously? Right, then. Apparently inns are cursed tonight. Time for random death, then! I walk down the streets, irritated, and find the first beggar I can. Not caring that she looks old or whatever, I stick my sword down directly through her heart. She gasps, chokes. "You're not a merc," she mutters under her breath. "How did you..." I kneel beside her, wiping my iron sword on her clothes. "I'm an assassin, lady. An irritated assassin. I can do exactly what I please, thank you." (Orlok's bit will be done later when I'm coherent. ) Steph was attacked by an Assassin, but didn't die! Brightness was attacked by an Assassin, but didn't die! Aman was attacked by an Assassin, and did die! He was a Student. Orlok broke out of the Crockery! A Name was used. Term 8 has begun. You have 42 hours to send in actions. Writeups have been edited in! 2.2 (in which DA dies), 3.2 (in which Orlok goes insane and Varda shows off; and Sart, Steph, and Eol go on the Horns), 4.1 (in which Eol doesn’t die; Burnt, BR, and Aonar go on the Horns (Aonar’s writeup written by him and excellent), 5.1 (in which STINK dies), 5.2 (in which PK is expelled), and 7.1 (in which BR does not die). Enjoy! Player List 1. Queensteph - Vintish Noblewoman 2. Randuir (Telar Pike) - Yllish Commoner Student 3. Hemalurgic Headshot (Noremac Quwester) - Aturan Nobleman Skindancer Master Physicker 4. Aonar (Aodhan Breacadh) - Edema Ruh Skindancer in Naming 5. Wilson (Sloan Walker) - Cealdish Commoner Student 6. Straw (Medicus Novis) - Yllish Commoner 7. Paranoid King (William Opuscule) - Yllish Commoner 8. Ornstein (John Springer) - Aturan Nobleman Student in Physicking 9. Jondesu (Vell) - Yllish Commoner Insane 10. Drake Marshall (Greyson) - Cealdish Commoner Student in Physicking 11. Assassin in Burgundy (Jurdaan Longfell) - Yllish Commoner Student 12. Burnt Spaghetti (Dele Fajro) - Vintish Noblewoman 13. Orlok (Locke Alveron) - Cealdish Commoner 14. Magestar (Magestar) - Vintish Nobleman Insane 15. Alvron (Stryker Nox) - Cealdish Commoner Insane 16. Arinian (Darian) - Aturan Nobleman 17. Stick (Stick) - Aturan NobleStick Student in Archives and Physicking 18. Darkness Ascendant (Balthazar Myrrh) - Yllish Commoner Student 19. Cluny the Scourge (Cluny) - Aturan Nobleman 20. Silverblade (Ryth) - Cealdish Commoner Student 21. Amanuensis (Esuan) - Yllish Commoner Student 22. BrightnessRadiant (Amelia) - Aturan Noblewoman 23. Eolhondras (Eolah) - Yllish Commoner Student 24. STINK - Yllish Commoner Skindancer in Linguistics 25. Hael (Glavion) - Edema Ruh Insane 26. Sart (Titud) - Edema Ruh Insane 27. Joe (Chalks) - Yllish Commoner Insane

So there has been a lot of mystery surrounding what the Aimian said at the end of that interlude, most theories ive seen revolving around Unmade. I think i found a piece of evidence that confirms this. In the first Dalinar chapter in WoR he is in a vision set in the purelake. Him and a bunch of other soldiers, including a radiant, are hunting for a spren that has been "touched", or corrupted, by something named Sja-anat. The title of this chapter? Taker of Secrets. It makes a lot of sense to me that something that can take over cognitive entities would be able to extract information from someone after they died and before they passed to the beyond. Let me know what you think.

Moneybags had a headache. Banging your head against a tree tends to do that to you. These...ponies! Argh! He'd talked to a total of 2 by now, and both had left him banging his head in frustration. He needed something to help him calm down. Perhaps running a shell game would help him feel better. --- 1 hour later and 400 bits poorer, Moneybags reflected that perhaps it was a bad idea to try the shell game with a unicorn. --- Since there seems to be some confusion about people thinking I think Randuir is guilty, here are my thoughts, laid out clearly: About Jon: I do not suspect Randuir. If Jon is an elim, I will suspect Randuir. Nobody else has given me any leads Jon has given me a (slight) lead, if he is an elim. Therefore, Jon is the best person for me to vote on right now Jon is probably innocent. So is everyone else. But Jon gives me info if he is not innocent And nobody else does yet About Randuir: Randuir's first post does not prove his innocence It does not prove his guilt. It is simply a post of helpful strategy That makes people think highly of him. (Elims want people to think highly of them) Randuir has experience being an elim. He knows that if elims leave holes in their strategies, they'll get caught Therefore, he didn't leave holes in his strategy. This does not prove that he is an Elim. It just shows that he's not a proven villager Other people seem to think he's innocent. So I'm trying to show the problems with that line of thinking. TLDR: Jon gives me info if he's guilty. This does not mean that he's likely to be guilty. Randuir's helpful post does not prove his innocence. It's just a helpful post.

Double posting because I just saw this: https://twitter.com/SupanovaExpo/status/863253190891847680/photo/1 Brandon Sanderson is coming to Perth. Perth. And in case you didn't realise, that's where I live. I could go meet Sanderson...

Great write-up, Hero! For now, I've got some thoughts on the rules, starting with pony-types: Unicorns should make sure to use their PM's. Remember that you can create group PM's containing multiple ponies as well. This also means that, even if you don't feel like talking to anyone in PM's, you could still set up a small group and let them do whatever talking they wish to do. Pegasi have the ability to vote in secret. This is quite powerful, especially in the late game where being able to surprise someone can be a big boon. However, it is very important to know who voted on whom in the earlier cycles for analysis, so I ask you to restrain from using your powers in the early game. Earth-ponies effectively have one less vote on them, so people should keep this in mind when voting (especially in the case of ties, you should check the pony-types of the intended targets). The other major factor are the elements of harmony. The protection granted by loyalty is a powerful tool, but unlike similar abilities in other games, it comes with a drawback: If you're targeted for the kidnap, the one you sought to protect is kidnapped as well. Therefore, I personally recommend that whoever holds this power exercises good judgement; Do not use it if you expect to get kidnapped on any given cycle (I'm sure that the relevant people with high early-game mortality rates know who they are). The element of Honesty is a fantastic power as well. If it isn't held by a unicorn, I recommend you scan one ASAP so you have someone that can make PM's that you can trust. that way you can create a trust-group of people who share a 'confirmed-good' PM for strategizing and analysis*. However, if someone approaches you, claiming to have scanned you and determined you are good, do exercise some caution, as I can see the elims trying to fake this. Finally, the element holder should remember to always speak the truth, or you lose your power for a cycle. The element of generosity is an interesting factor. it can (and should) be passed around, and should be kept on the elims, if at all possible. However, this means that in the early game any cycle with no lynch will very likely hit a villager anyway (this is guaranteed on this cycle), so we should probably no-lynch cycles. The element of Laughter is another interesting ability. I'd recommend caution when using this, but if you feel like the elims are trying to frame someone, or if you believe that some people have started tunneling on an innocent, it can be used to force discussion away from that person. Don't underestimate this ability, but exercise good judgement in using it, as you don't want to protect an elim at a critical moment. The element of Kindness is pretty useful, as it essentially reveals a confirmed-good pony at the end of the lynch that can still interact with the thread (remember, it doesn't matter if you can't vote, as long as you provide analysis that gets others voting). There isn't much in the way of strategy that I can provide for this element. The owner of the element of magic should avoid dying, if at all possible. You should definitely keep the fact that you hold this element secret to everyone that has not been absolutely confirmed good. Now, a note on role-less role-claiming: Just because you don't hold a power doesn't mean you should be telling the thread. Knowing that someone doesn't hold an element is very useful info for the elims. @Herowannabe, the goal of the elims is to kidnap all ponies holding an element of Harmony. What happens to an element if its owner is lynched? Also, what happens if all elements have been kidnapped, apart from the element of generosity, and the element of generosity is then passed on to a changeling? Now, I'm off to build an excel sheet for note-keeping. *Do note that, just because you've been scanned and have been confirmed good, you don't automatically get better judgement than anyone else. Keep listening to others in the thread, and don't be surprised if others are skeptical when you claim you've been confirmed good. In other words, don't try to become a Mayoral and exclusive group.

Have a well-deserved upvote Hero. That was an amazing RP to start this off with. Unfortunately, I don't have much else to say yet, other than to advise unicorns to actually use their PMs. If they don't, I predict (CR ROLE WARNING!!!) great danger and much hostility coming upon them...

Its pointed out several times, mainly from Dalinar and Adolin in WoR but also some others, that Kaladin behaves like a lighteyes, from how he talks, and looks at people, to how he walks, and those are just the surface things. These are the kind of things which people notice subconsciously when someone acts "outside their rank". And its noticeable through WoK that a big part of why Kaladin drew so much attention from people around him were those characteristics.

Have you guys seen the winning entries to the First Annual Comedy Wildlife Photography Awards? They are, naturally, hilarious, so much so that I've started making memes out of some of them... Spoilered for size.

Ishamael/Demandred Ishamael is allowed to use true power ,so is Demandred Demandred has Sakarnen vs Lord Ruler/Vasher/Kaladin/Szeth/Vin/Kelsier/Marsh Everyone from Scadrial has 30 minutes Atium No one knows Rashek's weakness Marsh at his strongest Kaladin has his shardblade Szeth has Jezrien's honorblade people from Roshar has unlimited stormlight Vasher has nightblood ALL ARE FAMILIAR WITH ENEMIES' POWERS,EVERYONE IS WILLING TO KILL

People on Roshar be like:

I have to agree with you here. The things rand has said so far doesn't point to him as either an elim or townie, so it wouldn't be wise for us to lynch him. However, I think it would be wise if the person who held the mark of Honesty checks him just in case.

Welcome to the game! There's always discussion about whether we need to lynch someone Day 1 and how to go about choosing that, but avoid a townsperson, and the answer is, you can't be sure. But you can't be sure Day 2 either, or Day 3, unless you start with a Day 1 lynch based on whatever gut feelings or suspicions you can come up with. It's okay to bandwagon onto someone else's suspicions sometimes too, but try to at least state the part of their reasoning you agree with, so we can use that in later cycles as we figure out who is innocent and who is not. So look around, and if you see someone acting in a way that you think would indicate they might be a Changling (i.e. an Eliminator), toss a vote on them, and tell us why. If you don't vote, it's ok, but it's preferable if everyone votes if possible. And if your hoof starts hurting, come have the doctor check it out. Your mane is looking a little saggy too, are you getting enough sugar in your diet?

If a pony holding an Eliminated- whether by kidnap or lynch- it counts towards the Changelings win condition. As long as the Element of Generosity is still in play the Eliminators haven't won, no matter who holds it. Rand has the right of it. The Pony with Kindness can survive a lynch, but will not survive a kidnapping. Note that if the Pony with Kindness is lynched and survives, they have not been eliminated. the Changelings will still need to kidnap them in order to meet their win condition.

Hoofs up if you listened to the MLP theme song while reading that excellent writeup! Razor Shard stood there in the square, ignoring the ponies milling about and panicking, of all the things to do. He was thinking about what the Princess had said. Changelings have been infiltrating our society, we don't know for how long. But having a weapon capable of threatening ponies would be invaluable for their army. Could they be the ones that took my father? He looked around at the crowd, twitching his eyes to look from person to person without moving his head. Any one of them could be an infiltrator. But there was no way to tell for now. He backed out of the square and slowly headed back to his humble shop, nodding and smiling to ponies he passed, but seething in outrage inwardly that any one of them could be planning to kidnap him or someone else in the town. He didn't really have friends, but that doesn't mean he would be willing to let an innocent pony suffer. Arriving at his destination, Razor Shard used his teeth to pick up a pair of pliers and place a glowing hot chunk of metal onto the anvil. It was dripping slightly, as he'd left it for a little too long to hear the Princess' announcement, but he ignored the small splatters of overheated metal as he began to pound on the ingot with a hammer inserted into a specialized harness on his right hoof. A swing that may have been too enthusiastic flattened a disk in the center of the ingot down about half an inch. Sighing, Razor Shard prepared to place the ingot back into the fire and try and buff the mistake out. Blacksmithing was no place for misplaced aggression. But he couldn't restrain a thin smile at the thought of another pony, the ones who kidnapped his father, underneath the heavy blow. If the changelings had been a part of it, or even if it was merely a possibility, there was still only one solution. He'd just have to hunt them all down and find out. Rules Clarification!: If a changeling kidnaps a pony, do they know if they've kidnapped an element of Harmony or not? Or do they just have to keep on kidnapping ponies until you say the game ends. Just curious.

I'm working on sending out all the PMs, but ran out of time and I have to go pick up some family members from the airport. I will get all the role PMs sent out before I go to bed tonight. Feel free to post, and to use your role abilities (particularly you Unicorns, feel free to create a PM for the cycle), but I encourage you not to say anything that may give away whether or not you've received your Role PM yet. EDIT: I was able to send out the rest of the PMs via mobile, so everybody should have received them by now. If you haven't, please PM me and let me know. Also, just a reminder about your Cosmetic Roles! Have fun with them, and I'll be watching for those ponies that do the best job at living up to them!

okay now this gives me another idea. When miles hundredlives achieves a goal, you could say he reached a MILEstone Why is miles very productive? Cuz his MILEage is very good. What is best exercise for miles? Miles running miles to work on mills, setting a new milestone every day, increasing his mileage with a sMILE on his face :') (PS: Even I can see this is dumb, but hell this is the only place I can post this )

Update: I have received the green light to post the audio. I'm working on the transcription and audio editing (to remove the long bits of silence at the beggining). Most of the audio is ok, although apparently the first few minutes didn't record audio available here Personal thoughts: Kinetic investiture: thats a new term that I haven't yet seen. I will need to look into it, but it sounds like potential vs. kinetic investiture meaning that due to position (in the cognitive/spiritual realms?) you can store investiture. It would also seem that kinetic investiture would be more like storm light, and potential investiture is more like breath. I previously was unsure if all souls were made of investiture. does this mean everything in the spirit realm is just investiture?

It's a reference to the extra epilogue in 10th anniversary Elantris edition, where Hoid (spoiler)

We have these over in the Dark Alley. Some of the cookies will absolutely take your breath away!

I hope this isn't too obscure

hahah, someone pointed that out. There's an explanation for that! People who read Latin letters read left to right, so when I drew the "good side" I arranged them in the most natural way that most people take in a picture. I made the "bad side" go the opposite way so it feels more unnatural, and you see their weapons first. I had originally intended for Shallan to be summoning an illusion, but it's not really a weapon like a Blade or spear, and then I went "hang on, she has a sword, doesn't she?". But then I realised you can't hold a sword while in a safesleeve, so I drew her summoning the sword rather than using it, since you can summon a sword with either hand. So it is Shallan, but me taking artistic license for the sake of coolness value. Let's have some more art here!!!! Character design sketches: Jasnah costume design Dalinar and Renarin in Shardplate (yeah I don't know what Dalinar's Plate looks like either so I made it up.) Szeth and Honorblade. (just messing around here. I draw Szeth as kind of cute and innocent looking, like the Discworld History Monks. They are bald and harmless beggars who can kick your chull!) Adolin costume design (pretty much blatant fanservice here.) Modern Earth AU design (yes I know but I am shameless) (dat official Bridge Four t-shirt ) Detail of the skateboard deck I like to draw characters in a hyperstylised cartoon version because I think it gets across main features of character detail and expression very effectively. And you can look at it without wondering to yourself "what race is she/he supposed to be?" which ruins the immersion for fantasy stories in other worlds. This is why I think SA is better in 2D than live action, but probably not a hardcore moe anime style . A painted style is better for backgrounds and showing texture and depth in an image, but it takes way, way, way longer and I sometimes I am lazy.

Ok, before I get to my Outrageous Theory I'm going to talk about some things that got me there.. I'm going to point towards some WoB that I've read, sorry in advance as I find it difficult to cycle through all the WoB to find the exact quotes: WoB that suggested that there's more to the creation of Nightblood than a bucket load of breaths and a command WoB that suggests the five scholars were World Hoppers WoB that suggests Nightblood was modeled after a Shardblade Outrageous theory in the form of a humble question: I may be way ahead of myself here, so I'm going to ask some questions that may point us in the right direction or void said theory: In relation to the Cosmere timeline - where is SA compared to Warbreaker? keeping in mind that Nightblood was created at least 3 centuries ago (That was when Vasher ended the war he started wasn't it?) In relation to the Cosmere timeline - when was The Recreance? Is a Shardblade like Aluminum and immune to awakening.? if so, can enough breaths (investiture) overcome this? Is there possibly a Connection issue? (crossing over Shardic Magic) if so, can enough breaths (investiture) overcome this? Thoughts..? !~ HIF ~!

No, it's the equivalent of having multiple people jumping on a concentrated point with a far more rigid structure that isn't losing energy to the natural shock absorbing qualities of the human body. It's not the same at all. Amusingly though, Kaladin actually does almost exactly what you say in the multiple opponent duel by Lashing himself horizontally many times, falling a very short distance and kicking them, and it actually cracks the breastplate, so that would undermine this counter point even if I agreed. What? Yes it does. Maybe this is where we're having issues. Steelpushing applies a continuous force. This means that a longer distance between the target and the starting point provides more time for the force to act upon the projectile, which increases the velocity until it hits a theoretical limit where the force of air friction is equal to the applied force and it stops accelerating, which is going to be significantly higher than terminal velocity for falling objects due to the greater force. This is the entire reason why Coinshots are deadly. We even have concrete proof of this concept in book one when Kelsier is fighting in a cramped room and, due to the very short distances, it fails to penetrate and just pushes the target back. While pushing herself above the wall in book one, Vin describes it as "blurring past" her. It's pretty fast even for people sized objects. If Vin were to push on a coin in a vacuum in space, they would both have equal kinetic energy in opposite directions (but different velocities). Actions and reactions and all that. It's only due to air resistance that heavier objects are imparted with more kinetic energy. This is why you need a heavier projectile, as you're going to be able to impart far greater energy into it before it hits the theoretical limit. So yes, you're probably right about coins, but that is not what we're discussing here. Yes, I think this is indeed where we're having issues. If it helps, don't think of it as force, but work. Due to the ability to project force at a distance, a Coinshot can do more more work on a projectile than is humanly possible, and thus impart more kinetic energy. If a five pound object is moving five hundred miles an hour when it hits you, it doesn't matter if it gained that energy instantly or over time, so long as it strikes you at the same velocity. So yes, Vin's legs apply greater force when jumping, but Steelpushing does more work, and that's more important here.

I doubt it. Modern fabrials seem to be self contained with a captive spren and some kind of on/off switch. They seem to internalize the mechanism within the device by having a bound spren, whereas ancient fabrials don't rely on a spren and create some bond between the device and the user that causes the surge manipulation and results in Savants. I know my bias towards bonds as Roshar's focus is influencing this idea pretty heavily, but it makes sense to me.

Giving 2000 breaths would take them to the 5th heightening, so in the case of illness it would heal them. For injury though it wouldn't. The fifth heightening makes you functionally immortal, so age and illness won't happen, but death by wounds is still possible. Something else happens with divine breath, because when it heals someone it is consumed, and the recipient is not elevated through the heightenings and gains no Breath of their own. If there is a command that functions in the same way, which seems like it should be possible by Endowments intent, it hasn't been found. Until it is, it appears to be a function unique to the Divine Breath. Like so much else.

The ponies seemed to be distraught. Yes, shape-shifting beings with evil intents have infiltrated their populace and have injured their ruler, but it is all just the work of entropy, the embodiment of his Master. Ironpies watched with a cold steely stare, saying nothing. He had nothing to say. He just wondered what it was like to be one of those rather foolish ponies. What went on in their minds? His had been offered to Ruin, so he knew none of those things. In all honesty, he thought this all ridiculous. If there were rogue kandra about, with enough emotional Allomancy he could sway them from their cause. Unfortunately, as he had stated earlier, there was no easy supply of metal to burn. He only had cookies. And he would use them... somehow.

I like it. I don't think it's alone though. Like I posted in another thread, I think that the death rattles flow both ways. I think Moelach's true purpose is gaining knowledge from those who pass and the death rattles are a byproduct of the process. If both of these things are true, and Odium has two Unmade used for gathering intelligence, it could change things quite a bit when they're already stacked in his favor.

Not quite. Your idea with a Cadmium Bubble completely inside a Bendalloy Bubble would cancel out the effect of both bubbles in an area the size of the cadmium bubble. You, and anything outside both bubbles would experience normal time, while the rest of the ship would be faster relative to standard time. However, now that I'm thinking about it, having the Bendalloy Bubble be the big one is still clever if you could tie it to the ship. Following the math on the wiki page, you would compress 2 minutes of the ship moving at full speed into 15 seconds of actual travel time. You'd still need the 2 minutes worth of fuel, but we're never bypassing fuel of some sort. Your idea would actually work if you used a big Bendalloy bubble around the whole ship, a Cadmium bubble to cancel out the crew quarters into real-time, and then another Cadmium bubble to actually slow that area so you don't need as much in the way of food supplies.

And now for a riddle:

Thank you. It's a good thing there's no grammer componant to my english exam.

While I agree with your point, they were buying soulcast metal. They didn't want metal that had been mined. It was probably just a typo on your part, since most of the post has it right except that one word. Just a standard nitpick. Your point about thunderclasts is interesting though. I wouldn't be surprised. It depends on how exactly Transformation works, I think. If the new stuff remembers that it wasn't originally stone, it may not be usable by them.

Without some reason to hate Kaladin, some very personal reason, I feel like most people would see someone who reminds them of home, even someone they disliked, and feel protective of them. They would become a symbol of life back home. The lack of recognition on Kaladin's part, and the circumstances that Gaz called him "Lordling" in... I just don't see this as anything beyond a horribly callus and jaded man, taking out his aggression on men he thinks are already dead anyway.

Person: I know you're trying to relearn piano, but can you stop badly playing so much Nintendo soundtrack? Me:

You guys are all forgetting the key piece of information. Kaladin is only strong because of Syl. Eragon is only what he is because of Saphria. I'm taking Syl. This is no bias, obviously. Syl is both intelligent and articulate.

Someone in another thread mentioned a Lift and Wit teaming up after Lift attempts to stab Wit with a Shardfork. I said I'd read a 10 book series solely about their exploits. Give me Worldhopper Wayne and MeLaan gallivanting about the Cosmere 'trading' for important peoples things and stealing accents? I'd read a 36 book series. Assuming they crossed paths with Wit and Lift at some point. (Slightly more serious, [because that was very, very serious] Wayne actually does make sense as a Worldhopper. He and MeLaan even have a relationship developing, and I think there was even a 'wish you were a kandra' type line. I can see Wayne 'dying' only to find his way back somehow to cruise the Cosmere, maybe even as a kandra.)

With explosions!

Hmm, that didn't seem to get anyone fired up, so let me add some theory crafting. Shallan can read minds. Those cremlings were actually a Dysian Aimian or whatever Arclo is, and just by being in their presence, she can piece together memories of where that Aimian has been. And that same Aimian happened to witness his events in those interludes. What do you think? How else could she have known about these events?

Unless you mean the Surge of Division... Which, since we haven't seen it in use, we don't know much about. We recently learned it has to do with intermolecular bonds, as opposed to splitting an atom. Some of us speculate that the WoK prelude has a hint, of the Dustbringers releasing a lot of energy.

Well, first I want to point out that ettmetal can, from what little we've seen, apparently be utilized to store and use allomancy like a mistborn. With the caveat that it can be regulated via as yet unrevealed mechanical or electro-mechanical devices. This opens up the possibility of allomancy being used in automated functions through logic, circuitry, and eventually, full blown computing. This would enable the creation of integrated circuits for detecting/reacting to specific types of investiture, hyper efficient alternating steel pushing and iron pulling drive motors, duralumin over clocked super processors, peweter enhanced cranes and industrial equipment, overlapping mechanically driven time bubble array nuclear reactors...the limits are as endless as they are absurd. Jewelry that makes you feel happy and motivated, towers that provided identityless compounded healing feruchemy to aid stations throughout a city, driverless cabs that speed up or slow down time so you can get where you need to go instantly, or have extra time to work along the way as needed. Ettmetal opens up the ability to essentially have an arbitrarily large team of mistings at the disposal of any task. And it probably has some use for feruchemy as well. Another thing to keep in mind is that while we've only seen hemalurgy used with living beings, it appears to be mechanical in nature. Bind points between human physical manifestations and their spirit webs can be accessed and manipulated using hemalurgy. Lower life forms can be similarly affected. What about a sentient android? What about a toaster? What about a stick? The possibilities dear readers, in my opinion, are endless. The only thing we truly know about hemalurgy is that it's potential has only just barely begun to be recognized and explored...

Note: This is version 2.0, written in January 2017. It's primary purpose is to incorporate knowledge from the post-Bands of Mourning era, but I've also taken the liberty of re-writing/structuring some stuff, cleaning up a bit of phrasing, fixing the formatting/links that were hurt by the most recent site transition, etc. The original version of this post is in this archival post. Introduction: Time bubbles are fascinating. An essentially passive effect that has profound impacts on the very nature of reality. They're ripe for exploration and exploitation. But they're also complicated. Brandon isn't much of a physics/math guy, and he knows that; the passage of time is a pretty fundamental aspect to most physics and messing with it can get messy. Because of this time bubbles have a lot of asterisks and exceptions built into them. So our intuitions about what happens when you speed up or slow down a patch of space-time aren't going to align with what happens in the cosmere, and Words of Brandon are more necessary than usual. Though we have an unusually large reliance on authorial fiat for our fundamentals, we can use those building blocks to go far with our analysis/logic. Time bubbles follow their own consistent rules: There's no need to throw up our hands in despair just because we can't trust our initial intuitions. Now I'm an old bantha, but one advantage is that I kind of know... everything... about time bubbles. I'd be highly interested if anyone could come up with anything I didn't know we knew, at the very least. So in the interests of public knowledge, here is a thread that lays out everything I know (that I can remember I know) about time bubbles, along with some clearly-demarcated expansions into the theoretical where I think it safe. (xTc) Table of Contents: (you can word-search for sections by xY values) x0. A note on terms x1: Frame of reference x1.1: Anchoring x1.2: Hitting moving bubbles x1.3: Misc. x2: Entering and exiting time bubbles x2.1: How occupancy is determined x2.2: Jostling x2.3: Edge-case physical interaction x2.3.1: Occupancy of clothing and held objects x3: Bubble interaction x3.1: Subjective burn rates x3.2: Competing bubble effects x4: Reality of time bubble effects x5: Conscious control of bubble attributes x6: Effects of duralumin/nicrosil x7: Effects on various magics, aluminum x8: Faster than light (FTL) possibilities x8.1: How I think FTL would work with time bubbles x8.2: Mechallomancy and time bubbles x8.3: Disclaimer x9: Realmatics xCn: Conclusion xAr: WoB Archive (x0) A note on terms: I'm not too ashamed to admit that I've been responsible for creating/using some... unorthodox terminology over the years. Sometimes it's intentional as I develop a term to describe/clarify a new concept, other times I'm just mistaken. Nowhere is this more present than in my discussion of time bubbles: for example, no one in the books calls them time bubbles. They're all referred to as "speed bubbles", even cadmium bubbles. So here's a list of potentially problematic terms, including any canon ones that might be unclear if I come across them. This is a living list, so feel free to post asking me to add/clarify anything. Time bubble Also known in actual canon as a "speed bubble". The area of space-time affected by an Allomancer (or mechallomantic cube) burning either bendalloy or cadmium. Compression factor A term for the "speed" of a time bubble. Either how much it speeds up time (bendalloy) or how much it slows it down (cadmium) in relation to the normal flow of time. So a bendalloy bubble where every second on the outside corresponds to 10 on the inside would be have a compression factor of 10x, where the reversed cadmium bubble might be 1/10. Bubble anchors/anchoring Refers to the frame of reference that a time bubble is "still" relative to. Can refer to either an abstract frame of reference or a specific object the movement of which constitutes that frame of reference. Jostling Refers to how objects are jostled/refracted/deflected as they cross the borders of time bubbles. FTL Stands for "Faster than light", a term for viable interstellar travel mechanisms that bypass the need to spend years or decades going at sublight speeds through the vast emptiness of space Mechallomancy A term used to refer to the "mechanical allomancy" (/feruchemy) used by the Southern Scadrians, and first seen in Bands of Mourning (x1) Frame of reference: Frame of reference is one of the spots where things start getting weird with time bubbles. Time bubbles change both the flow of time and the way that objects move within their sphere of influence. The exact way they change these two factors, though, is dependent upon frame of reference. Look to this WoB, our earliest on the matter: Bubbles anchored by bond: It follows upon any degree of thought on this WoB that bubbles "not moving" actually means "at rest relative to the frame of reference of the surface of Scadrial where Wayne first cast it." That bubble is moving around the planet's axis at some absurd speed, around Scadrial's sun at some more absurd speed, around the galactic core at a different absurd speed, and outward from the origin of the universe at an even more absurd speed. And yet a Wax that is "moving faster" inside a speed bubble isn't all the sudden catapulted into space at a thousand meters a second. His movement through space is only accelerated relative to the the bubble's definition of "at rest". How the anchor that defines "at rest" is decided a key question, then. (x1.1) Anchoring: We've got a few WoB's on the question of how bubble frames of reference are determined, at least so far as how the bubble itself moves through space. Bubble anchor determined by what it cuts You'll notice that this stands in nearly direct contradiction to the other (much older, admittedly) WoB where a train was an example of where the bubble wouldn't stay anchored. Thus the tone of surprise on my part for this new WoB. In regards to how to reconcile the two, I'll quote myself: This new quote goes into quite a lot more detail, is unambiguous as to the bubble being on the train, and is newer, and so trumps the old one if they are in fact in conflict. I can't find it at the moment, but someone has suggested that a way to reconcile the two WoBs is that for the first Brandon was thinking of the big picture where the bubble is shortly ripped off the train by the "jarring". Reading the newer WoB, a charitable interpretation has "it's probably going to ruin your time bubble" occurring over the course of instants, rather than minutes or seconds. Myself I lean more towards this just being an evolution of how Brandon models bubble frame of reference, at least to some extent. Perhaps he got to thinking more deeply about why a bubble on the train intersecting the ground wouldn't work and decided to weaken a previous "well the ground intersecting the bubble would just instantly pull it out" to a weaker "the ground intersecting the bubble will just gradually pull it out", or the like. - Then we get into some other mechanisms for anchoring bubbles. Savants can anchor their bubbles to themselves Complexities of what affects anchoring We also got some nice in-book evidence from Bands of Mourning. So anchor-determination is complicated. We've got a combination of local cognitive polling, savantism, cognitive gymnastics, mass, and likely speed. I wouldn't be shocked if there weren't more factors at play. At a guess, I'd say that these factors are all in competition for each other. Perhaps a very fast but small object will beat out a somewhat-massive but slow one. Or a savant might have an easier time de-anchoring a bubble from a moving train than from the surface of Scadrial. The core takeaway here is that bubble anchors can be manipulated, through both gross physical interactions and more realmatically-based shenanigans. - It's implied in the scene where the gang is testing out the primer cube by tossing it around that the cube spits out a bendalloy bubble while its in mid-air, then proceeds to land on the ground near Marasi with the bubble still centered on it. This would imply that the cube either has some special ability to anchor bubble frames of reference or (as I'm about to suggest) that while the bubble was airborne it simply "defaulted" to being anchored to the cube, but when it landed it assumed a normal ground-based frame of reference. This supported by Marasi walking up and picking up the cube off the ground without any mention of the bubble shifting. This is by no means a sure thing, though, and also raises questions (which I will not attempt to address) about what would happen to Marasis if she's standing still on the ground and gets "hit" by a moving bubble. - As a general note, there is some possibility that the bubble's movement and its frame of reference could be de-coupled from one another. So a bubble could be moving North at 5 m/s while having a frame of reference that thinks it's heading South at twice that speed. This would do some fun things to the motion of captured objects, I think, but by "fun" I here mean "more complicated than I want to think about". I do not believe that this possibility is likely, from a purely literary standpoint, given the complications that would ensue from it and the fact that such de-coupling has never been suggested by either books or WoB. Also Occam's Razor. Assuming that the bubble gets its internal frame of reference from its own movement through space, we can simplify things by assuming that whatever anchor the bubble is "linked" to is what defines both frames of reference. So a bubble anchored to a spaceship (to choose an entirely random example...) would be exactly at rest from the frame of reference of the bubble; this would mean that the ship wouldn't travel faster through space, since the ship isn't moving so far as the bubble is concerned. (x1.2) Hitting moving bubbles So we have all this evidence that bubble-anchoring is a thing and that it's possible (if at least somewhat non-trivial) to manipulate a bubble's anchor using both realmatic and brute-force physical means. What does this mean for when moving bubbles intersect "still" (for certain definitions) objects? Moving bubble's effect on captured object movement: Aside: So this was a fun conversation to have with Peter. I broke out MSPaint more than once. Peter's answer essentially destroys some of my more high-level thoughts on what happens when something's hit by a moving time bubble. This thread of mine is wrong on more than one level. The first level is that I was wrong even within my model: by what I said then even bendalloy bubbles should shuttle objects backwards by some degree. The second level is my assuming relativity of reference frames, where from what Peter says it looks like there needs to be some other mechanism at work to decide how the cork is "really" moving. To summarize farther, if you toss a cork over a moving train that has a time bubble on it, then that cork's frame of reference essentially gets incorporated into the bubble's/train's. The cork is all "I'm moving straight across this here train" and the bubble is all like "okay, you do that". The cadmium bubble case is easiest to grasp here: upon intersection, it's as if the cork is caught in amber, slowly pushing its way straight north across a bubble of space at the same time as that bubble tows the cork farther and farther east. - By my reading, one interesting consequence of this lies in the path the cork takes over the top of the train. In a world without time bubbles, the train would be moving under the cork as it flew over it. So, looking from a vantage point above the train, we would see the cork cross over the edge of the train at point A, then over the opposite edge at some point B that's further towards the end (read: western part) of the train, as the train's been moving under the cork as it flew. So if it was high noon the shadow of the cork would have described a diagonal from south-east to north-west on the top of the train. But once time bubbles get introduced, things are a bit dicier. My own more relativistic model from before this WoB would show the cork following that same diagonal from A to B, just faster/slower than normal. So a speed bubble would see the cork popping at at point B before B drew level with the cork-thrower. This fell out as a natural consequence of the model. The new model we get from Peter doesn't allow such a thing. Read literally, the cork enters at A, then eventually exits directly north of that point at some point A' (with A' described by the intersection of the north part of the train with a line perpendicular to the edge of the train and intersecting A). The fact that the cork never ends up west of the train seems to necessitate that the cork exits at some point at or east of A'. This means that the lateral movement of the cork relative to the top of the train is eliminated by hitting the bubble. This has theoretically interesting consequences for projectiles (throwing a grenade to hit Miles in the face, accounting for the motion of the train, will fail if there's even a 1x compression factor bubble over him), but realistically deflection will probably play a larger role in such uncontrolled circumstances. The more relevant case here more controlled circumstances: could this lateral movement elimination property of time bubbles be used deliberately? An incredibly inefficient example that comes to mind (I believe I'm stealing this from someone else, but can't recall who) would be using time bubbles as a delivery mechanism for high-energy projectiles: Shoot a railgun into a very very slow cadmium bubble, then move the bubble's anchor to be right next to the enemy ship and once the railgun round wins free it's pointed exactly where you want it to be. -- I'm also a tad confused by Peter's "In fact, I think it's safe to assume that the train is always moving to the east faster than the thrower is throwing the cork to the north. In that case, both types of bubbles will always end up pushing the cork at least somewhat to the east" line. It seems logical that any non-infinite compression factor for a bendalloy bubble would result in the cork ending up at least a bit farther east than it would have without the bubble. I'm not sure what the relative speed of the cork/train really has to do with that. So either Peter misspoke or there's some deeper logic to relative speed of motion in the bubble vs. cork scenario so far as what frame of reference "wins". I'm inclined towards the former, myself. --- There is also the additional edge-case of what happens if that train-bubble intersected someone with their feet firmly planted on the ground, or if the cork had a string attached to it leading back to the cork-thrower. Both are beyond the scope I can address at the moment. - Here we have a later attempt of mine to get some more information on this front: Conservation of momentum on entrance tied to redshift-solution: I got nothin' here, just thought it was worth putting in. (x1.3) Misc.: There is also the issue of how time passes within the bubble. Regardless of whether an object's movement is changed, it's still going to experience the same weirdness with the passage of time. This introduces... weirdness as traditional models of movement as <unit of distance>/<unit of time> are a bit skewed by everything's experience of time flowing faster/slower with only passing relation to how their movement is affected. I'll discuss that weirdness further down. Beyond that, there are some small concerns for what the relativity of the passage of time has to say about all of this. I haven't addressed this directly in the past, but I don't think we need concern ourselves with it overmuch, as the scales of relative speed where this would matter are all such that objects are going to be almost immediately yanked out of the bubbles anyway. Not much time to experience a slightly altered flow of time. If I had to guess, though, I would imagine that time bubbles are frame of reference agnostic so far as the passage of time goes. So a speeding-by spaceship that experience 1 second for every 10 of ours would experience 10 for every 100 of ours in a 10x speed bubble anchored in our frame of reference, as opposed to 91 or something odd like that. (x2) Entering and exiting time bubbles: Ah, bubble-border problems. How I loathe them. This is still one of the less well-explored areas of time bubbles. Bubble boarders are... odd. This has been one of the more weirdish topics about bubbles since we first started talking about them. Gradually, though, we've been accumulating WoBs. Bubble borders static So borders are static and do not "distend" or stretch out objects or anything weird like that. You put up a bubble and that border is going to stay put as a nice little sphere, no moving or changing in shape or the like. This has some interesting impacts on some other aspects of time bubbles, particularly occupancy. As a general note, many of the oddities regarding how time bubbles behave have to do with transitions between being inside/outside of the bubble. Doylist rationale behind bubble mechanics: (emphasis added) This "loss of kinetic energy" is a general trend we can observe from the earliest days of time bubbles Loss of kinetic energy: -- Side note: Light. It's weird. But it's not weird for any good in-universe reason that we know of, and there likely isn't one. At core it's all a result of handwavium being burned because if you actually red/blue-shifted light properly really really weird and unhappy things would happen. Like microwaving people. Nothing more to see here, really. There is a bit more realmatic stuff coming out more recently, however. Bubbles changing speed of light considered, but not what happens: Light explanation a ways off So yes, there is a going to be a Realmatic workaround to make everything mechanically jive with the whole "let's not microwave people" thing, but we won't see it until we're all gray in the head. (x2.1) How occupancy is determined: So this brings us to talking about how we decide what's in or out of time bubbles. If you have half an object inside of it, is it going fast or slow or half and half? Excellent question. Glad I asked it . Bubble occupancy So objects are either in or out in their entirety. Moreover, this gives us that bubble occupancy is determined Cognitively, the whole "how an object views itself" shtick. If we're to follow the usual formula, the other "part" Brandon was talking about is just how other people view the object. This is interesting Realmatically, and also lets us get away with buildings not being torn down as their support beams shear off or stuff like that. Beyond that, it tells us that whether an object is included if its half-and-half really is "what sounds right", to some extent. It's a question of whether you/the object/observers would judge that an object is properly "in" some arbitrary space when parts of it are outside of that space's boundary. Beyond this Cognitive fun for determining "in-ness", living things are special: Living touch enough Included as soon as you touch: - These two sets of WoBs seem to run counter to each other. On the one hand, we're told that if a train is excluded from the influence of a bubble then the people inside of it are too. But the bubble isn't "distended" by the train—a fact we know because of the "static" WoB at the beginning of this section. So the people in the train are still technically in the bubble, still touching it. This should trigger the "if you're living and you touch a bubble you're included" clause. Given that the train is not holding the bubble out, it seems that just that being "in" an object which is not affected by a bubble is enough to keep an otherwise-wholly-encompassed person out of the effects of the bubble. Looking to the fact that "any living thing touching the bubble is affected by the bubble", then, it seems that in an important sense people within a train aren't "touching" the bubble. My conclusion from this, then, is that passengers in that case are not touching the bubble because they are counted as "part" of the train in the same way that the train's engines and individual cars are "part" of some larger train object. Like how there is both a bead for a door and a bead for a wall containing that door in Shadesmar. Actually, this needs its own thread to explore. Have a thread, with attendant conclusions: (x2.2) Jostling: We know that objects and people are "jostled" when they enter or exit time bubbles. It took us a bit (until Bands of Mourning, in fact) to nail down that both entrance and exit cause jostling for both types of bubbles, but through the first three Era 2 (AoL-era) books we got examples or in-text exposition that clarifies that "jostling" happens for both bendalloy and cadmium bubbles whether the object is entering or leaving it. Some book quotes on the phenomenon for reference, though references are scattered through the Era 2 books: There's also the possibility that jostling messes with sound, given this quote: In this case, there are several possibilities for why sound is disrupted, not least being that the incoming sounds just get their frequency messed with. Jostling is still a distinct possibility, though. - We know some things about how jostling works on a more general level. Jostling theoretically predictable, realistically chaotic: The deflection objects suffer when passing through time bubbles is also proportional to the bubble's compression factor: so a 1.5x time bubble would deflect objects less than a 15x one. Deflection proportional to compression factor of bubble Richochet effect Brandon's response to the punching question (which response I, of course, neglected to give my full attention to because of course) gives some hint as to what factors influence the jostling. His talk of "losing momentum" and use of the word "ricochet" both suggest that the effect is a function of the speed and/or mass of the object. One aspect of jostling we don't know is if the angle and/or force of this jostling is a function of the size or the speed of the exiting object. We also don't know if the angle that an object hits the edge of the bubble at matters. -- When all's said and done, we know frustratingly little about how jostling behaves upon that moment of exiting the bubble, or its deeper implications. We do have Brandon saying: Leaving bubbles causes unique/rare effect: He then laughed and said "That won't make any sense for 10 books" This leads me to believe that this might be related to the FTL travel. So something worth talking about is happening here. Something "unique or rare", in fact. (x2.3) Edge-case physical interaction: In terms of thought experiments, odd things happen when you have moving objects that are accelerated/decelerated by time bubbles when they run into objects that are too big to be included in them. What happens if you have someone on a train who's trying to "go" 10x faster because he's in a bendalloy bubble that the train doesn't acknowledge? Example 1: So Wayne is on a train, leaning against a wall in the direction that the train is traveling, going 60 mph. He casts a bendalloy bubble which takes the ground as its frame of reference. The bubble doesn't stay with him for long, but what happens while he's there is the concern. The bubble is tied to the planet, so it sees Wayne going 60 mph and tries to boost him to 600 mph relative to the rest of the world. Now the train is too big to be part of the bubble, so that wall Wayne is leaning against is still going normal speed, only 60 mph so far "rest" relative to the planet is considered. So bullet-Wayne is now trying to go 540 mph into a solid, unmoving wall for at least a few tenths of a second. Does he go kersplat? If he were in the bubble for longer (say it was bigger), would his corpse be actively pushing the train forward, what with it's non-slowing, continuous energy input? -- Now this example might not work because perhaps even a small bendalloy bubble within the train is still enough to trigger the train's "NO Wayne, don't go into the bubble!" response. So let's modify it: Example 2: So Wax is steel jumping along outside a train, going the same speed as it in an essentially straight line. Let's say he runs into a (stationary, relative to the planet) speed bubble. If he's above the train, then he'll zip along for a moment and fall out, having moved ahead relative to the train. Same if he's next to the train or far enough behind it. But what if Wax is, say, one foot behind the train at this point in time? If Wax were alongside the train, he'd find himself a bit ahead of its caboose when he exited the bubble. But in this case he's behind it, and now approaching the train at 60 mph. Is he going to faceplant into the train? It seems he should, really. And there's no justification to say he's "on" the train, since he's flying along outside of it has been for quite awhile. Yet it seems odd, as in the earlier example, for someone affected by a bubble to directly collide with an object not affected by it, where this occurs collision solely because Wax is being affected by the bubble and the train isn't. -- This problem exists in many forms, especially if you start going all frame of reference on it. I do not have rock-steady and fully satisfying solution, but I think my "belonging" thread generated by the Occupancy section up above (x2.1) might give some insight into a possible answer. The concept is that Wax doesn't get splattered as soon as he hits the back of the train because as soon as he comes into contact with it he counts as being "on" it, or at the very least as a part of it. If the train is big/weighty/rooted enough that it isn't affected by the time bubble, then it's also weighty enough to pull Wax onto it immediately and cancel out the effects of the bubble. (x2.3.1) Occupancy of clothing and held objects: This is likely the exact same way that clothing and/or held items behave for time bubbles. While I have my whole thread on the matter, I have yet to address what happens to clothing when people touch time bubbles. I think it intuitive and natural that their clothing is included in the speedup/slowdown as well. It wouldn't do to have a "pulled out of his socks" situation it a man poked a time bubble with his finger while running by. So perhaps the mans clothing is included in the direct, "this is part of the human's Cognitive aspect" sense. It's a bit more of an open question whether held-items (like weapons) would have the same privilege. However this "part of me"-ness is acquired, there's a good intuitive case to be made that it's near-instantaneous, at least so far as bubble occupancy is concerned. If Wax sticks an arm out to grab a gun a moment before the rest of him flies through the bendalloy bubble, we wouldn't necessarily expect that gun to rip itself out of his hand. We wouldn't expect individual nuts and bolts on a train to try and fly off as the they ran through a cadmium bubble just because they were put onto the train during maintenance yesterday. We wouldn't even necessarily expect spare parts lying on the floor of the train, still waiting to be installed, to have such a "fly off into the air" reaction. Another point to make is that I would think a man wearing gloves who touched the edge of a bubble with only the gloves might get included, as the gloves are a part of him. That one's a tad in the air, though, as to whether the "part of me" extends so deeply. We wouldn't expect someone whose shirt got cut by a Shardblade to feel pained by it, after all. (x3) Bubble interaction: Time bubbles can overlap each other. This results in... odd things. First of all, they overlap "like a Venn diagram": Overlap Venn diagram Cancelling only in area of overlap: Moreover, their timey-wimey effects are multiplicative: Overlap multiplicative There was also an interesting question relatively recently about whether nested bubbles directly interfered with each other's borders. It was RAFO'd, sadly. Nested bubble size interaction: Then we have the world's largest RAFO culled from reddit: RAFO on nested bubbles: So that's all fine and dandy. They overlap multiplicatively like Venn diagrams. This results in a little oddness with subjective burn rates (as expanded on just below), but it all makes a decent amount of sense on its own. The problem arises when bubbles don't share the same (approximately, at least) frame of reference. (x3.1) Subjective burn rates: In the normal course of events, Marasi is going to burn x grams per second of cadmium relative to her timeframe. So even if you put shuffle her in and out of various time bubbles, she'll always have the experience of burning cadmium at the same rate. Subjective burn rates There's still the question of whether bubblers somehow manage to get extra energy when they're enveloped by slow bubbles. Myself I would guess "yes" (call it feeding off the energy of the slow bubble or something), if only because Peter was so insistent on nothing "weird" happening in the other case. (x3.2) Competing bubble effects: Note: This subsection in particular is nearly all rampant speculation, so take it with a grain of salt. Overlap with regards to time is a no-brainer. Maybe relativity makes things a tad odd here and there, but as a whole you just multiply things together (~X/1 for bendalloy bubbles and ~1/Y for Cadmium) until you get the rate that time flows. Movement, though, is a scary story. Very scary. I have a big fat thread on the matter. It turns out that it's wrong in several of the details due to the PAFO-clarification WoP about the cork up above. The general idea is still sound, I think: I think it likely that how an object's movement through space is altered by time bubbles is a function of taking the movement vectors and compression factors of overlapping bubbles into account and multiplying them together to get a single vector of movement for the encompassed object. i.e., two speed bubbles with the same compression factor moving at right angles to each other will see an object moving off at 45 degrees as they try to drag the object along with them. Objects assume this altered vector of movement for as long as they're encompassed, and then resume their normal inertia upon exiting the bubbles. If they exit one bubble and are still within another, then simply stop accounting for that first bubble's effects on our object's movement. Keep doing this until you're not in any bubbles at all and congratulations, you're back in real time/space. This raises some questions in regards to how "real" the movement-altering effects of time bubbles are. Given all the talk we have from Peter and Brandon about time bubbles actually adding/removing kinetic energy from objects (like this one), we can fairly safely conclude that time bubbles actually quite actively invest and rob objects of kinetic energy going in various directions. This gives some credence, I think, to the idea that all we have to do is some vector math to figure out how overlapping bubbles parse it out. (x4) Reality of time bubble effects: It seems there is a subset of the community who have some degree of doubt over the "reality" of time bubbles, at least to some extent. Do time bubbles actually accelerate the passage of time, or do they just simulate it in part? If they just simulate it, to what degree do they do so? Myself I've always historically operated under the working assumption that the effects of time bubbles were fully "real" unless proven otherwise, but it's worth making sure of. Our first evidence of time bubble reality is Peter's age-old kinetic energy WoP, reproduced here for convenience: Loss of kinetic energy: This establishes the altered motion of objects within bubbles as "real" motion, not just some inertia-less scuttling about of objects. More recently, we've gotten a few more pieces of information. We know that the effects of aging and the passage of time can be accelerated by bendalloy bubbles: Accelerated aging (paraphrase): Watches need to be reset: The inverse also applies for cadmium bubbles. Cadmium hermit can time-capsule self: The most direct answer we have on the matter is sadly a paraphrase: Cadmium affects time, not perceptions (paraphrase): Together I believe these add up to a pretty firm weight on the "time bubbles really affect movement and time" side of the scale, but it's still and open question to an extent. (x5) Conscious control of bubble attributes: Exactly how much control "bubblers" have over their bubbles is a bit of an open question. We have a (somewhat vague, sorry about that, he was understandably tired/distracted and I was also tired) WoB addressing the matter directly: Degree of control, but only before casting My reading here is that Brandon's "not very much" at the beginning was directed at the "after the bubble is up" portion of the question, leaving us the still-not-very-promising "some discretion" at the end to apply to during the casting. Fear not, though! At the very least, this quote shows us that there is some degree of control over both compression factors and size at the moment of casting; added to this is the new fact that that "not very much" is a distinctly larger amount than "none" with regards to altering bubbles when they're up, though it's still in the air if it's entirely a matter of degree or if there's also differences in kind. Myself, I read the quote as saying that it's both, mainly with bubblers only being able to alter compression factors a bit via burn rate once the thing is up. - Later attempts to get more information bore little fruit. Bubble size/strength more controllable than shown, size not inverse to strength: - As a general overview, we know from the Era 2 books that bubbles don't (normally) move with their casters, and we also know that the bubbler leaving the bubble "pops" it. Moreover, both the Mistborn Adventure Game (a dubious source, but worth looking at) and the implications within the books suggest that the size of the bubble cannot be changed once it's been cast. So Wayne can't grow and shrink his bubbles however he pleases. The MAG would also have us believe that the "compression factor" of time bubbles—the factor by which they slow or speed time/movement—is set once the bubble is created. This is somewhat up in the air, though. This quote tells us that flaring the metal can give a greater compression factor. The question, then, is whether Wayne's bubble would have collapsed if he stopped flaring (going down to just a normal burn) or whether it's compression factor would simply have dropped. Myself I'm inclined to think that it's the latter. If not, though, then that tells us that bubblers can mess with their bubble's attributes, at least to some degree, even after casting them. I doubt this because of how "bubbler independent" these bubbles generally come across as, but it is a genuine possibility. Beyond being able to flare for increased compression factors, we have this quote about bubble size: Strength determines size This implies rather strongly that flaring could also be used to increase the bare size of bubbles as well as increasing compression factors. While originally I'd thought that there might be a tradeoff/inverse relationship between the size and compression factors of bubbles, the bubble size/strength WoB above looks to put the kibosh to that scheme. The possibility of misinterpretation/misunderstanding still leaves open the possibility of a super-small cadmium bubble being able to slow time to near stand-still or the like, but it's unlikely barring future, more expansive WoB. (x6) Effects of duralumin/nicrosil: Brandon has historically been suspiciously coy about what would happen when you use duralumin/nicrosil in combination with the external temporal metals. RAFO's are the order of the day. But we can extrapolate a bit from our above discussion of the extent to which bubblers can consciously determine the attributes of their bubbles. One thing to pay particular attention to in this context is how duralumin/nicrosil flares normally work: They compress all the power of the metal down into a split second. Not a singular point in time (because that's impossible and it would result in a hyper-steelpushing Vin exploding), but some very small interval during which the power rips out of the Allomancer all at once. Tied to this is the fact that burn rates are subjective to the bubbler, as discussed above. To get back to duralumin/nicrosil bursts, though, this information about subjective burning suggests quite strongly that a bursted-bubbler should only experience the normal "instant" of super-flaring. This means, for one, that we can't expect a nicrobursted Slider to get 10 hours on the inside to 100 on the outside or the like, since he'd have to be burning the metal for 10 hours subjective in that case. Besides running afoul of (reasonable, I think) interpretation of the subjectivity WoP, anything else would just be rather odd. Otherwise, we could end up with a time bubble that is no longer being sustained by the burning of metals, it seems, and the duration of which is oddly both too much in- and too much out-of the control of the Slider: he cannot stop burning bendalloy to cancel the bubble, yet he can still walk to the edge and "pop" it well before the bendalloy he's already burned has run its course. -Recall that, in the normal course of things, bubblers can just stop burning their metal at any time to drop the bubble. Not so in super-ultra-weird bursted bubbles that take a long time to run out subjective. - Assuming short subjective experiences, then, we have a few options to explore. In both cases, there are only two places all the extra energy from the duralumin/nicrosil flare can go to: increasing the compression factor or increasing the size of the bubble. Both are valid options, I would argue, because of what we've already seen about more powerful Allomancers making bigger bubbles, as well as flaring being able to increase compression factors. To avoid the "10 hour 'instant'" problem, any increase in compression factors must be... dramatic. For bendalloy, it'd have to be such that the Allomancer only experiences an exceptionally short interval. This means that you need to burn up all of the bendalloy in that short time and speed yourself up accordingly. This results in a situation where Wayne experiences 0.5s while the outside world experiences 0.00000000005s or the like. For cadmium, it'd be similar, though you can get a tad more utility out of it. Because the only time we have an upper limit on is the subjective experience of the bubbler, Marasi could experience 0.5s to 5000s on the outside, or the like. Alternatively, I think that we could maintain our usual compression factors (or at least something close to them) while pouring most of the extra energy into increasing bubble size. So you'd still get the usual 1:20 or whatever it is, but over a much larger area. Alternatively alternatively, the WoB about size not being inversely proportional to power could be generously interpreted to mean that you can expand both the size and the power of a bubble for the same flat rate, without any additional cost to do one as long as you're already doing the other. -- Theoretically bursting a bubble could be either an option between these two sets of results for the bubbler or Brandon could have it such that one of the results (either compression factor increase or size increase) is "locked in" and happens automatically when you burst. I am highly doubtful that it's the second case. We've seen Vin be able to have quite a bit of choice/nuance in her flare usage before, such as when she targets specific objects for steelpushes. If it is the second option, then I would wager (quite heavily) that we're locked into increasing sizes rather than compression factors. I don't know about you, but I find the idea of magically passing half a second while the rest of the world passes a millionth of a second to be... unimpressive. There's nearly zero utility for Sliders in the case where duralumin/bendalloy locks you into increasing compression factors. Besides my just saying "ugh that's not cool so it can't be true", I don't think Brandon would be so storming coy about the matter if the effect was this lame. So, in conclusion, I find it likely that using duralumin/nicrosil in conjunction with the external temporal metals results either in the bubblers being able to allocate the energy freely between increases compression factors and increased size or in the bubble being automatically expanded in size. (x7) Effects on various magics, aluminum: Time bubbles interfere with "almost all forms of investiture," it seems. Time bubbles interfere with investiture This makes sense from a Doylist perspective because things get weird and complicated very very quickly if you start talking about over-time steelpushes and the like. Realmatically... I suppose we can swing it easily enough, given that it's known how investiture tends to interfere with other investiture, and time bubbles are essentially a big fat mess of investiture altering the entirety of reality within their sphere (pseudo-intentional pun). It's possible that there's more to it than just investiture conflict, though... Some magics can bypass the interference of bubbles: Emotional allomancy works through bubbles because it's "over the top": This WoB is a bit unclear, but my interpretation here is that emotional allomancy operates on a Spiritual level, and in so-doing bypasses the timey-wimey effects of time bubbles. This is interesting because it implies that the way that time bubbles normally interfere with investiture is more a side-effect of their manipulation of time/space rather than a direct impact of the presence of the bubble. - We also we have this pseudo-RAFO on atium. Time bubbles likely affect atium in interesting ways Not much to see here, except the fact that it would be cool to see means that something likely happens besides just "oh the bubble interferes and you can't see anything outside of it." - Then there's aluminum. How exactly aluminum interacts with time bubbles is unknown, but it's generally a good bet that aluminum is going to do something screwy to just about any magic system, especially in Allomancy. We do have a bit on the matter. First, a RAFO: Aluminum RAFO Then a very confusing recording with an asker-approved paraphrasing: Aluminum creates dead space: (heavily paraphrased from a recording with approval by the question-asker, for clarity) If we're to take this WoB at face value, it looks like you could wrap yourself in aluminum foil and stroll through time bubbles without being affected by them. Which would be weird for essentially everyone involved, and suggests that aluminum bullets would also be unaffected. (x8) Faster than light (FTL) possibilities: Ah, FTL. The thing I tend to rant about the most. Brandon has stated multiple times that the third Mistborn trilogy will be a space opera where Scadrians have figured out how to get FTL using Allomancy/Feruchemy. Moreover, on later occasions (such as a WoB I'll be quoting shortly) he's narrowed it down to "Allomantic FTL". So we know that Allomancy is at the very least directly involved in enabling FTL, and it's quite likely that you can get FTL using only Allomancy and no Feruchemy. It remains to be seen whether the "mechallomancy" that they use on Southern Scadrial is at all involved, perhaps enabling bigger/more nuanced versions of known magical effects. --- Time bubbles are the natural place to look for FTL, then, because they change the nature of space-time, as many of the more plausible theoretical and sci-fi FTL-enablers do. The laws of physics in the cosmere are ours barring Spiritual shenanigans, so we still have to worry about relativity and can't rely on the infinite mechanical energy from Feruchemical iron or the like to get the job done. We have some quotes on the matter: Lost energy Several years later, Brandon PAFO'd the following question, leading to this eventual answer: Subjective burn rates How delightfully ambiguous of you, Peter. :\ Now Brandon had to initially PAFO the question, suggesting that this answer wasn't on the top of his mind and thus that it's not related to FTL. But there's also the possibility that yours truly simply managed to phrase it in a confusing manner. Brandon's initial PAFO was fairly fast, best characterized as "my give up" as the question was put to him verbally. Subjective burn rate PAFO: So it remains a possibility that these two answers are in fact linked as, as a first-blush look at their very similar diction suggests, and that this kind of subjective burn rate question is linked to FTL. Or not. Ambiguity. (x8.1) How I think FTL would work with time bubbles: I have multiple threads on this matter. The most recent (and only even possibly accurate one) can be found here. But I will summarize its points. Basically, you want to take advantage of how time and movement come uncoupled with time bubbles. You take a spaceship, accelerate it to some relatively fast but still reasonable speed (some very small fraction of the speed of light), and then do some shenanigans with time bubbles. What you want to do is encompass the entire ship in a bendalloy bubble which is anchored at a point moving, from your point of view, in a direction directly opposite that which you want to go. So if I'm moving from A to B, I want to start moving towards B and anchor my bubble on A. That'll get you accelerated movement. The ship will move at speed-relative-to-bubble-anchor * compression factor. Even if that gets you over the speed of light, the ship doesn't care because subjectively it's all good and not violating any physical laws or the like. You'll also need to encompass the ship in a cadmium bubble that, quite crucially, is stationary relative to the ship. This so that you can offset the extra time the ship/crew would normally experience in the bendalloy bubble. So now instead of the crew seeing the rest of the universe crawl by, they see it move by super fast. This works because the cadmium bubble shouldn't affect the movement of the ship through space at all (since it's anchored to the ship). Of course bendalloy bubbles are normally very small, so another thing I want to do is use nicrosil to increase their size for a second or so, just enough time for our ships to "teleport" (which is what this'll look like, essentially, from the outside) the length of the bubble. This being the effect of Allomantic nicrosil, as well as some ability to anchor bubbles at will and at different places depending on the user are both needed for this to work. - If Allomantic nicrosil fails us, we likely need to fall back to mechallomancy. So far as anchoring goes, I'm quite confident that out of all the options we have from up in the Anchoring portion of this post at least one of them will work out well enough. One example of anchoring that might work is the "cutting" WoB up above. Brandon was quite specific that the bubbles get their frame of reference from what they're cutting through: what the edge of the bubble is intersecting. So all we have to do is have the cadmium bubble intersect the ship and the bendalloy bubble intersect only the interstellar medium and we're golden. Some more thoughts on how the interstellar medium would perceive itself here, though most of our concerns on this score are actually overridden by a recent WoB stating definitively that (just about) all matter in the cosmere is at least a bit sentient, meaning that even little interstellar dust specks that no one's ever seen have some kind of Cognitive aspect: one that I would bet sees itself as "still" just like everything else in the universe acts like. - Here's Brandon's comment on the matter, insofar as I was able to ask him about it: FTL needs Nicrosil and/or time bubbles This is reassuring in that at least some part of my framework seems to be on track, but the "haven't figured it out yet" is troubling. In regards this "haven't figured it out yet" problem, we have a few other WoB's to look at. Missing big piece for FTL Quite awhile after this WoB, Aeromancer was kind enough to ask these questions: Unseen Allomancy required for FTL: Historically my hope here was that the missing Allomantic ability (that "very big important piece", it seems) was nothing more or less than something that enabled bubblers to anchor their bubbles in different locations. But given recent developments that suggest that it's fairly easy to mess with anchors, that might not be it. Another trick might just be using mechallomancy to manage bubble size/timing and the like, though the extent to which that represents "Allomantic abilities" is doubtful. (x8.2) Mechallomancy and time bubbles: As we saw in Bands of Mourning, mechallomancy plays very well with time bubbles. Marasi was finally able to live out her dream of trapping people in place in her slow-bubble as she laughed with glee, Wayne was able to toss his speed bubble around, etc. The question, then, is how this might interact with FTL. After all, what's a good sci-fi yarn without a redlined engine with exotic fuel, the sabotage of which leaves our intrepid crew stranded on a strange world? The immediate thought is the potential for different answers to the anchoring problem (might you be able to manufacture primer cubes that "think" they have one or another frame of reference?) or the potential to turbo-charge a cube for big/fast bubbles. Satsuoni, though, raised the interesting idea of just periodically tossing a bendalloy-primed cube out ahead of your ship as a way of getting a not-anchored bubble to travel through. Pick it up after you pass by, rinse, repeat. We have some more recent WoBs also suggesting at mechallomancy as a component of FTL. It's still unclear whether it's strictly necessary or just useful for practical applications (i.e., if you could zip along a life-boat sized ship with a team of perfectly trained Allomancers, but to do anything bigger/better you need some machine-precision/scale). Merger of magic and technology for FTL: Contemporary trilogy tech hints at FTL: (x8.3) Disclaimer: I would also like to note that I am not the only thinker in this field. Others have proposed theories talking primarily of using bubbles to achieve Alcubierre-style effects, and there are a few more out-there theories. Myself, I suppose an Alcubierre drive could certainly do the trick, it's just that my level of physics-brain, as well as my understanding of time bubbles, doesn't seem to imply that that's something you can get with time bubbles as we know them. ---- Fair warning that this section is by far the most "Kurkistan is a narcissistic monster" part of this thread—a thread which is already devoted to essentially saying "now listen up. I know everything so sit down and listen", so raising the level of egocentrism is an impressive feat. If you disagree with my conclusions here, then I wouldn't say that you're just going against the fundamentals of how time bubbles work. For the rest of the thread, though, I must say that I've yet to see any other cogent and plausible analysis of all the details. If only because I immediately jump at anyone who tries to develop one and spike-out their knowledge. (x9) Realmatics: Talk of Realmatics is for another thread, I think. I still have yet to really dig my teeth into this aspect of time bubbles (which is somewhat ironic coming from me), so most anything I put here would be new theorizing, not tested by time and thought/criticism as just about everything else in this thread has been. So, in short, we know that whether or not you're "in" a bubble is governed by the Cognitive on some level. We know that there's likely something Spiritual going on with how bubbles get "anchored," not least because "connectiony" things are nearly always Spiritual. There's also fairly good evidence that the movement-altering effects of time bubbles are "real" in the sense that sped-up objects actually have extra kinetic energy, rather than just sliding about due to magical shenanigans without any change in their intrinsic inertia, given Peter's comments on the matter. Whether this means that the change is Physical is not 100% clear, though. Most else, I think, is speculation that someone (probably me, given historical precedent) will get to at another time. (xCn) Conclusion: So thank you for your time. That's about all I can think of off the top of my head. I'll incorporate anything I missed if I think of it or someone brings it to my attention. In particular, please feel free to point out any parts of the original draft that I modified/excised inappropriately, if they catch your eye. If you came here because I threw a link at you in some random thread: Did I answer your question? (xAr): WoB Archive: For archiving purposes, here are all time bubble- and (possibly) FTL-related WoB's and WoP's I know of/can remember. Not all of these are referenced in the main body of the post. Change List: Re-wrote into version 2.0 after SoS and BoM - 1/09/2017 Added WoB on time bubbles affecting time - 2/11/2017

Me and my team just finished out Stormlight fan-made movie! Let me know what you think! Also there's a link in the description on a 'making-of' documentary on how I made this movie happen if you're interested http:// @BrandSanderson Also a behind-the-scenes documentary of how we made the movie if you're interested! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIdr664qpMQ

Thanks! I've always wanted to be solid. It's heaps better than liquid, and gas blows. I should clarify that what I meant was that I preferred the original ending to WoR where Kaladin kills Szeth with a hit to the spine to the new edited ending where Szeth is hit in a less vital point and "dies" when he hits the ground. The original ending felt more in character, and the new one felt more OOC, especially as you pointed out, Szeth was a legitimate danger and an actual murderer compared to the unintentional murderer by negligence that Elhokar is. There are many moments through the whole book where Kaladin says he wants to kill Szeth. All of these were building up and foreshadowing Szeth getting killed by Kaladin. I won't say that Shallan doesn't have moments of plot convenience, and how everyone who didn't like her ends up respecting her by the end because she's clever, funny, unexpectedly honest, good at getting what she wants through personal charm or magic, or a combination of the above. But Kaladin's sudden ability to learn how to change the direction of gravity was accelerated beyond disbelief to me. When I first read it, I didn't know about all the whole Cosmere-verse stuff with the three realms, and I didn't recognise that Kaladin saw into the Cognitive Realm until much later. But it was never explained in-story, and Kaladin didn't think about it again, so I felt unsatisfied by it. It is likely that Kaladin will go to the Cognitive Realm again in the future books and my response will retroactively shift as a result, but as of now, his accelerated learning is a moment in the book when my reaction is like "Really? Is that it???". Your mileage may vary, of course. I don't get the hate for Kaladin's headband. Brandon Sanderson didn't like it, which is why Michael Whelan changed it for the cover of WoR, but I think it's pretty cool. It reminds me of Rambo and also martial arts movies full of angsty young men trying to prove themselves to the world, so it fits Kaladin. Is it too goofy looking or something? Urithiru also had glass windows. Everything is built on giant scale and flat glass windows are pretty difficult to make without industrial processes - in the old days they were made with lots of little panes set into a lead frame instead of big sheets of plate glass that modern skyscrapers have, so it must have been Soulcast. If the Cosmere didn't have magic to explain things, I would have said ANCIENT ALIENS. Kaladin's (and most characters') appeal differs from person to person. I would have liked him more if I read his story when I was younger, but preferences change over time with life experience. When I read about Kaladin being hotheaded and shooting himself in the foot because he acted without thinking, a part of me cringes. It overshadows awesome moments he might have later on. I think I just focus on the insignificant details too much. Yeah, it's a photo that I put some blurring filters on because I didn't want to draw all the gym equipment. It gets tedious after three or four treadmills. I blurred and used some pixel noise in the background, and painted the foreground and dumbbells to blend it with the cartoon character art. The grunge filter is some layered textures. I used a parchment and a concrete texture set at low opacity, but you can find a lot of different ones that give a similar effect on google. Sites that sell flooring tiles often have good high res photos of their products that you can layer on in Photoshop. Like this one, for example. A pet peeve is something (usually small and insignificant) that annoys you personally. I think you mean "head canon" there. Lirin and Renarin have glasses, which means Alethkar has optometrists or some basic oculists who are qualified to test eyesight and fit glasses to customers, if only in the big cities to rich people who can afford the service. Which Adolin can. So it is likely that Adolin doesn't have bad eyesight, or least not bad enough that he requires glasses to be able to function normally in his daily activities. He might have mild hyperopia/farsightedness where things that are far away look normal, but close up is blurred. But we will never know, because slice-of-life moments where Adolin goes to the optometrist, or Kaladin and Rock go grocery shopping at the commissary for the evening's dinner stew are charming and humanising but add nothing to the plot. A lot of WoB's that happen at conventions and signings only become fandom knowledge if someone records it or posts the answer here or on the Coppermind wiki or another site. Not everyone is a Sharder, involved with the fan community, or bothers to copy down spoken answers into text to post online. Finding WoB's is difficult because it only works if you know what you are looking for. Many of them can be found in a Google search, if you know the keywords in the question, so if you've read it before, you can find it again. It is the new or obscure information that is almost impossible to find. I don't judge or dismisspeople who don't know information that isn't published in a book, but for the better known information that answers many repeatedly asked questions (Dalinar's Shardblade switch, was X character really Hoid, why doesn't Kaladin fix his forehead scar, does the Stick have magical powers) it would be good to have a place where this information can be read and sorted through. Does it all come down to a difference in personality and attitudes? I have no issues talking to people, or new people I have never met before. It's kind of fun, but I know that 95% of these people aren't people I could maintain a long-term friendship with, and of the few that I can, long-term doesn't mean forever. People change, and trying to maintain a relationship with someone you have less in common with than when you first met them is not that enjoyable when all you have to talk about is stuff you did a long time ago, when you liked one another more. Sometimes you just have to let things go and downgrade a friendship to an acquaintanceship and make new friends. Perhaps I am more blasé about relationships, but while it is disappointing when it happens, I don't consider it a rejection on the level of having my feelings stomped on and shredded. I am more easy-going in nature, and you are more... intense. If people have rejected you for some unknown reason, it might be because you can get emotionally invested in things and way more passionate than other people, so a casual conversation that started out as friendly turns into an unexpected heated discussion. Not everyone wants their conversation to derail into a debate, and if you have very strong opinions, it may come off as aggressive or as if you are ignoring opposing opinions that might be equally valid. The solution to that is to chill and not to take things personally, but then again it is the same sort of advice like "Just go outside and talk to people" that natural introverts get that doesn't help them much at all. So another solution is to be more judicious with what you say and remember your audience. A friendship involves one or more other people! I don't know if that helped. But if you can detach yourself from the negative emotions of rejection and try to figure out why people might like or dislike you, you could understand why things happened. Even extroverted characters can be introspective and self-aware. And now I think I am beginning to understand why people don't' see as much into Adolin's character as you. True, hardcore extroverts are rare, because most people, including me, have a mix of both traits, and anyone who strays too close to either end is in the narrow bit of the bell curve, statistically. Adolin's personality is taken at face value - he has friends, he likes hanging out with them, it's sad when they don't want to hang out with him. And it isn't developed further unless it is to set him up as BFF's with Kaladin and Shallan. I myself cannot even imagine being so extroverted that my whole identity is defined by what other people think of me. Sure, I understand what crowd hype is, and to feel pleased when you have made a good impression on a large group of people who think of you as lively and interesting. But I cannot comprehend a person who so deeply needs interaction with others that their life becomes meaningless without it, and I would not be the only person. It is such an extreme that it would be like someone who is agoraphobic to the point where going outside gives them anxiety, and making eye contact with a late night supermarket cashier sends them into a paranoid panic. And if I am being honest here, it is something that few people relate to, like they don't relate to extreme extroversion. That is why such characters are the side character of a cast ensemble in a TV show, like Joey from Friends or Barney from How I Met Your Mother. It is a personality trait that could be explored, but in a supporting character, it doesn't take the overall narrative forward. I totally understand the "book hangover" feeling when you finish a big series with a well-developed character cast and world and when you start a new one, you cannot help but compare and feel like it isn't as good as the last one, until you get fully immersed in the story (which may or may not happen). If I only read the same few books, I would not have discovered other books as good or better than the old ones. And I think it's better to return to an old favourite after a break where I read other books. I get a fresh enjoyment upon my return, and it stops me from being tired of the same character or character archetype. You criticise underdog farmboys with magical swords for being repetitive plot device characters, but you prefer to read only extroverted protagonists. It is not so different. I disliked the dragons and thought they were all selfish, manipulative lizards. Which is cool, since many other fantasy stories portray them as majestic creatures you can't argue with, like beautiful vegetarian elves. The dragons were useful in fighting off the invaders who did the Forging in the first trilogy, and it turned out that the Skill came from Elderling descendents, which is useful. But I would rather live in a world with no magic if it meant there were no selfish dragons who do more harm than good. So many stories are about magic returning to a mundane world (Westeros, for example), and it is rare that characters decide that magic is more trouble than it's worth and get rid of it. Renarin would not have thought that Shallan is funny or witty. In the Boots chapter in WoR, Shallan makes a joke about "vesture" and "virtue". Renarin would have been silent for a minute to analyse (the habit of his that makes girls think he is awkward and unsettling) and then commented on how the two words are pronounced similarly but mean different things, and killed the moment. I don't know if you read WoR in French or English, but it was not really funny to me because they're not that close when you say it aloud compared to how it looks on the page. Renarin would not have responded to Shallan's teasing and baiting, and he has the patience and composure that Kaladin lacks. I still think he and Shallan could have made a better long-term couple than Shallan and Kaladin, but it would take more work to set it up and sell it. Obviously it won't go there since there's Adolin, but if Adolin carks it before SA5 , Shallan could be the Navani since Vorinism has a love of symmetry. I loved the HP universe as a kid, but now I can see all the little holes in the world building. This is where the trend of a more scientific approach to worldbuilding in fantasy has stepped into the niche for all those readers who want something more solid for their backstory - authors like Brandon who have so much extra detail that he spends hours at signings answering questions about it. When I think about Harry Potter, it's kind of ridiculous that their economy runs off gold coins, and there is a rule of magic that says you can't create food from thin air, but you can take a tiny sliver of carrot and enlarge it until you have a carrot the size of a house. But somehow the Weasleys are so poor that Ron only has a sad corned beef sandwich on the train, while Harry buys everything on the snack trolley. I like to rant on Kaladin because I like to rant. I can take the rant to any and every character if I wanted, like Renarin or Navani or Shallan, and characters from other books and series and other authors. I love ranting and I like rant reviews on Goodreads, because they're the most entertaining ones to read compared to the boring "This book was great, 5/5". As long as it is done in a tongue-in-cheek and self-aware humourously sarcastic manner, it doesn't devolve into tiresome complaining where you have to point out, "If you hated it so much, why did you keep reading?". It's a fine line to walk, and I like to keep practicing at it. I dislike Kaladin's narrative more than Kaladin the character. Sure, his depression can be painful to read, but what I really am not fond of is all the bad things that happen to him to make him bounce from plot point to plot point like the pinball on the flippers of fate. This is mostly a personal preference thing. I did not like Lemony Snicket's "A Series of Unfortunate Events" for the same reason, because each book left me wondering what sort of bad things the author would force onto the poor orphans in this episode, and made me incredibly frustrated because their lawyer and guardian was made intentionally stupid so bad people could keep trying to steal their inheritance. Sure it keeps the plot moving forward and characters going in a new direction, but it is only because the author keeps introducing freak accidents and sudden deaths of the one foster parent they actually liked. And if it is only good things that the author gives instead, then you get Mary Sue characters common in wish fulfillment-heavy Asian light novel and web serial novels. Gosh, I now realise I am probably very picky. At least I have read widely enough to realise what I like or dislike about novels and can now pick the ones I know I will enjoy instead of attempting to slog through. The longer the narrative buildup is, the more people expect in the eventual payoff. And if the payoff is falls short, it colours the whole book and readers are disappointed, even if the rest of the story is well-written with compelling characters. Brandon is pretty good at managing buildup and momentum to payoff, which makes reading his 1000 page doorstoppers easy to fly through, but sadly not every author is as good at this. I have been disappointed a number of times in other series, but no matter how much I rant, I still think Brandon is one that guarantees satisfaction. Except with the Reckoners trilogy, but let's just ignore that. I thought you would have disliked Lirael since she is an obvious introvert who even tried to Honor Chasm herself. She gets better, obviously, and is not so annoying once her dog tells her to stop whining and get over it, but it's pretty clear she's not a happy neurotypical standard protagonist. That is why I enjoy Garth Nix books. You get presented with what seems like a straightforward growing up story, then your expectations don't pan out, but the ending is still satisfying and bittersweet. Sabriel never really rescued her father, after all. Also the character from "Bloody Jack" wasn't a caricature as much as she was a victim of fate and circumstance. The story would end after Book 2 if she got away with her crimes and settled down into obscurity. But it became a cat and mouse situation where the author kept milking the series and making the protagonist go on the run like Valjean to Javert. It wasn't just her extroversion and big mouth that was getting her into trouble, but rather eavesdroppers at the wrong place and wrong time that reported her, and other contrived situations like an accidental distinctive tattoo reveal. You know, (in)convenient bad luck. Johnny Rico's actor has a rectangle head and he looks like Ken doll. There, I said it. Art time Elhokar and the Symbolheads This is based off the Elhokar character design I did a few pages ago. The crown is the same one on the House Kholin glyphpair. Elhokar wears a different glyphpair (I'm assuming it's his personal glyphpair) of a crown and a sword, which is what I put on the shoulder patch. I wonder what they use signet rings for when it's the women who read and write all the messages. In the old days of Earth history, people used wax and signet stamps so they knew if other people were tampering with their mail when the letters arrived with the seals broken, but in Roshar, they have spanreeds linked to one other fabrial pen, and personal code passwords to authenticate users. Detail If you watch scary movies, they always have a jump scare when someone has a bathroom cabinet over the sink with a mirror that opens and closes. This drawing was inspired by that. Process Elhokar's Garden I'm taking artistic liberties with the timeline, but this is the time in between the 4:1 duel and Kaladin getting released from prison, where Elhokar sulks about how cool Kaladin is and how it made him look bad. I imagine that Elhokar likes to go to his fancy feast islands to drink alone and whinge about his first dahn privilege and how much his life sucks. And then Dalinar comes to talk to him and Elhokar gets mad because "You're not my dad, you can't tell me what to do!". Full image The Feast Rough concept sketch based on book description. I drew the dining platforms as Asian style pagodas. But I think they're too small because it should be able to fit a dining table and a quartet of musicians. Still, I am happy with the overall aesthetic, which is supposed to be ostentatious and a obvious waste of a rich man's money. Kind of like the old Victorian folly which is supposed to look cool rather than have some practical purpose. Szeth the Assassin This was me just messing around and experimenting with the aesthetic of Alethi interior design. Soulcast buildings are made of solid pieces of stone and decorations have to be carved out of them, and because of highstorms, windows are weak points in the structure. I've mostly drawn interiors to have big arches and columns because it is symmetrical and looks regal for the inside of a palace. Detail Costume design by Ben McSweeney. I follow canon descriptions and illustrations where they exist, and Szeth had a chapter header picture in his interude PoV chapters. The only time I disregard official description is when it is nothing like how I imagined it (Dalinar on the cover of WoK. Actually I don't think Michael Whelan's covers are offical canon after all) or it would not be practical or time efficient or sanity retaining to do so, such as the Kholin glyphpair on the front and back of Kholin army uniforms. In a painted piece, it looks really weird to copy-paste the vector file. Drawing it manually looks much, much better, but it is not something you want to draw over and over unless you don't mind going Taln crazy. Obligatory silly stuff Kaladin Stormblessed and the Power of Rock So Kaladin on the flute was sad and pathetic. You know what, let's throw away all attempts at realism and just crank the awesome up to 11 because why not. Why bother to make sense if you could be awesome instead? That's Kaladin. KALADIN THE ROCKSTAR. Oh, and he wears leather pants.

This thread has not been abandoned yet! And I am kind of annoyed by this new site layout. It logged me out in the middle writing a long post because I was taking too long, so I had to start again. Anyways, this update will be mostly character designs because that's what I like doing, and if there's no point in doing stuff you don't like in your own free time. Words of Radiance Cast Since I don't think you can click to open images to full size, CLICK HERE to open up to its full screen stretching size. Some notes about this: I drew Sadeas to have a punchable face, and Amaram to be less punchable because he's supposed to be a smarmy smug wannabe-Radiant who looks like a normal dude from the outside. I imagined him to be late 30's or almost or about 40, because Jasnah was 34 as of WoK and he was her almost-husband. Taravangian is supposed to be like a wise sage kungfu master grandpa, who looks harmless. Taln wears yellow because topazes are the gemstone of the Stonewards, but later I looked it up and found out that topazes can come in other colours than orangey-yellow, but it was too late for that. Wit has a medieval pageboy haircut because his job is to something like a King's minstrel and his blue eyes are somewhere in between light and dark. Tyn I wanted to include her, but she died 1/3 of the way through WoR, so she's hardly a major character. I actually liked her. The coat, as I have mentioned before, is similar to a cowboy's duster and Mongolian traditional dress. It's also inspired by the leather buff coats worn by musketeers in the 1600's, which are weatherproof and warm while being useful for hand-to-hand fighting. These things are pretty good at being knife proof. You can look them up! Veil Veil is something like what Tyn's little sister would be, since Shallan keeps her own voice when she Lightweaves. But Veil is tougher and slightly older. And she wears all of Tyn's clothes. Someone mentioned it before, and I thought it would be amusing. Shallan gets Adolin, but Veil gets Kaladin. I think Kaladin would really like Veil, but we all know that's never going to happen. But hey, Brandon said that there would never get a traditional love triangle, so maybe this will happen in Oathbringer. Kaladin and Veil Shallan and Veil And something different... Eshonai's Victory Eshonai's only canon picture is the chapter header icon in her PoVs. She looked like a tank!!! And because I was inspired by the Predator movie series, I draw her as huge and physically imposing relative to the other characters. But she still has a human-like face that isn't fully monster, even in Stormform. I tried to make it expressive, but clear that she's not human, hence the creepy glowing eyes. This is my impression of a chrysalis and gemheart. In my imagination, they were giant glowing, roughly faceted chunks of crystal that had mysterious flickering lights coming from the inside. And the "violet ichor" of chasmfiend blood was like a goopy slime that dripped out when you pulled the gem out of the chrysalis. Who knows, maybe it's really the texture of purple ketchup. Costume designs now! For Adolin, Shallan, and Kaladin. ALTERNATE COSTUMES Adolin - Summer uniform, with half cape. Shallan - Fancy feast dress. Her motif is flowers because "blossoms and cake", so this was inspired by lotuses. Kaladin - Amaram's squadleader. What does a takama/warrior manskirt look like? Whatever I tried looked silly, so I threw in a slit for mobility and called it a day. HALF DRESSED Adolin - Unlike Kaladin, his socks don't have holes. Shallan - What do lighteyed women wear under their havahs? Kaladin - Bridgeman uniform. The vest was inspired by boating life vests. MODERN AU - CASUAL Adolin - Fashionable, but not edgy or statement clothing. Pretty much like a magazine page or store mannequin clothing. Shallan - Shops at the thrift store, because that's what artsy people do. She dresses modestly, but comfortable. Kaladin - Doesn't care about his appearance. URITHIRU KNIGHTS logo closeup Because it would look pretty cool on a t-shirt. MODERN AU - HOBBIES Adolin - Kendo practice. It's almost like duelling... Shallan - Safari naturalist, from the thrift store. It's called vintage, you know. Kaladin - Leather race suit. When you're on your bike at the track going 300km/hr, it's almost like flying when you don't have magic. I always thought Kaladin was a bit of an adrenaline addict. And if the modern AU had an animated series Sitcom Edition, it would be something like this: Date Interrupted Shallan and Adolin go to the local malt shop or greasy spoon diner, and Kaladin is there. Rock's Diner has pictures of the Horneater Peaks, Rock with his friends Lopen and Teft, and the Bridge Four freedom forehead tattoo design. And if the the duelling preparation room had lockers, Shallan would draw something for Adolin to stick to the inside of his locker. Other girls would write glyph prayers for their suitors before a duel, but since Shallan is not like the other girls, she would do something more creative. Because Vedens are not as stuffy as those silly Alethis! First Base Yeah, I know it's naughty. Avert your eyes!!!! And now, obligatory silly stuff! MULTIVERSE CROSSOVER! Would these two like each other if they met? Who cares, it would be awesome!!!!! If this really was a buddy cop movie, there would be walking away from explosions, one-liners, Horatio Caine sunglasses moments, saving the girl, and creative interpretations of the legal code.

Although this is a great alternate scene, I'm going to be that guy and tell you that what you've quoted is not Vader's line... To contribute to the topic at hand though, Changing the "fabrial" to "Surgebinding" makes the scene more confusing if Nalan still used a Regrowth fabrial.

Are you not meaning the drunk-monkey?