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Introduction: What We Know About Southerner Medallions I'm sure some of you are already sick and tired of medallion-related speculations, so before I start giving my own take on this Scadrian mystery, let me first summarize what we already know. Let us clear our minds first and take a hard look at what was already revealed about these medallions, both in BoM and in various WoBs, because there are facts about these objects that many people forget or aren't even aware of. The Southerners create medallions using devices called Excisors. These excerpts from BoM show that any medallion theory cannot be complete without an Excisor theory, because it is through these devices that medallions are created. We should always keep Excisors in mind. In fact, while we already have a canon term for an Identity-less metalmind (what Marasi calls an unkeyed metalmind), I would like to propose this fan term: "excised metalmind" for a metalmind created with an Excisor, as opposed to the "unsealed metalmind" term I've been seeing that is frankly confusing. (Update: As @Oversleep pointed out, "unsealed metalmind" actually came from Brandon. So...oh well.) Creating medallions require Connector powers. This is a WoB from a recent signing in Germany. As you all know, Feruchemical duralumin stores Connection. Strangely enough, I have yet to see anyone post a medallion/Excisor theory involving Connection (everyone seems to believe VenDell in that it only involves Identity and Investiture), so I don't know what prompted that question. But suffice to say that thanks to this WoB, my medallion theory will involve Connection. The key to understanding medallions is that they are a way of fooling the magic system into thinking that you have the right sDNA. Take note, this is a totally different thing from what the Set's unkeyed metalminds do. The unkeyed goldmind that Wayne uses is a hack on the ownership requirement of Feruchemy. What Brandon is saying here is that medallions require a separate hack. Medallions can be used by non-Scadrians This is from the same Germany signing as above. This should put to rest any theory involving the need for Terris or Scadrian blood. Sorry, VenDell fans. The medallions interfere with each other. Unlike Hemalurgic spikes, one cannot obtain multiple powers by getting multiple medallions. Again, this is a problem that has gotten little attention from Sharder theorists. I intend to rectify that. The Southerners had to figure out two-powered medallions by themselves. This gives the following implications: - The Sovereign only taught them how to use Excisors to create single-powered medallions like the memory coin we've seen. - The method for creating a multi-powered medallion from multiple Metalborn is very difficult to scale. So, those are some things we know for sure about the medallions. Before I continue, here's one thing that I'm pretty certain of, even though we don't have direct confirmation of it: You cannot Feruchemically tap Investiture from the medallions unless they contain Nicrosil Feruchemy As @Moogle repeatedly points out in this thread, we don't ever see people being described as tapping the nicrosilminds in the medallions (with the exception of the Bands of Mourning), despite the numerous descriptions of them tapping or storing from the non-nicrosil part of the medallions. For example, in the Epilogue Wax only senses the Memory store of the copper part in the memory coin, not the Investiture store of the nicrosil part. Remember that aside from the Bands, each nicrosil ring in a medallion only contains one power. In the memory coin, the nicrosilmind contained Copper Feruchemy. In a Weight+Heat medallion the inner nicrosil ring contains Iron Feruchemy while the other nicrosil ring stores Brass Feruchemy. Without Nicrosil Feruchemy, one cannot Feruchemically tap Investiture from a nicrosilmind. Hence, while Nicrosil Feruchemy was obviously used to create Southern medallions, something else entirely must be responsible for their ability to grant powers. Now, allow me to go into deep speculation based on those facts. First I will discuss the different ways an object can be Connected to another object in the cosmere and how that relates to Feruchemy and Hemalurgy. Then I will discuss several theories about Hemalurgy that will form the backbone of my Excisor theory. Of course, I'll need to cover soul interference and the theory behind multi-powered medallions. Finally I will describe the steps of creating medallions, both single-powered ones and multi-powered ones. This will be a huge undertaking, so much that I've decided to divide everything into several posts. For those who don't have time, I will attempt a TL;DR: An unsealed metalmind can form a hybrid Being consisting of a person and itself, allowing the person to use the metalmind's Investiture without Feruchemically tapping it first. This property, shared with Hemalurgic spikes, exists because the unsealed metalmind contains a Hemalurgic charge, though this charge was taken without killing the donor. Finally, multi-powered medallions involve using the Connection of religious devotion to counteract soul interference between a medallion's nicrosilminds.

OP: Taln, is that you?

Term 1 has ended! Please do not post or PM. (You're on Break. Go home. ) New cycle will be posted in 12 hours.

We do already have the answers to some of those questions. There is a WoB that if the heralds linger for too long after a desolation ends, a new one will begin. It's strongly implied in the prologue that if they die, they're sent to damnation/braize automatically. So the remaining heralds that survive have to choose to return to damnation/braize (though it's still unclear how that process actually works; my guess is that they worldhop/go through shadesmar), which they didn't do last time. It's also clearly stated in the prologue that it's very rare for most/all of the heralds to survive a desolation. On the topic of OP's post; I do agree with others that you're being way too harsh on the heralds. If you'd ever spoken to a victim of torture (I have unfortunately spoken to and interviewed many in the course of my professional life), you'd know that extended periods of physical and emotional distress, often with very little human interaction, can severely damage - sometimes permanently - one's mental state. I've seen previously courageous, outspoken, and self-sacrificing individuals become deathly afraid of even leaving their own homes to go to the supermarket after enduring months of torture. I just don't think you understand how deeply that kind of experience can storm someone up (and I pray you never have to). Now imagine having to endure several millennia's worth of torture, over and over again, and the few moments of respite you ever get are to fight a brutal, total war that usually wipes out most of the planet's population and civilizations, after which you have to willingly volunteer yourself for several thousand more years of torture. I think even the strongest-willed human beings would break at some point, just as the heralds have.

This quote: got me thinking a bit about the predictable nature of the highstorms. From what I recall, there's some in-world debate as to whether the highstorms are a single storm that continuously circles the planet, or if they are actually multiple storms. Now it seems obvious that it can't actually be just one storm, otherwise they'd be super easy to predict, but they're not. But they are mostly predictable, possible perfectly predictable with enough information. I think there's also at least one reference where people in two separate locations experience a highstorm happening at the same time relative to sunset, implying that the storm travels the planet at the speed of its rotation. So...what if the highstorms are actually an Investiture wave that's circling the planet, at the same speed as its rotation? Now maybe the moons cause an interference pattern in that Investiture, so that when the amplitude gets above a certain threshold, a highstorm happens, possibly as a release valve. This would also assume that all three orbits synchronize along a 1000 day cycle, with notable alignments happening at day 500, and 1000. This would certainly explain why it would be possible to predict highstorms using math, but it would require some complex calculations. The influence of other planets in the system could explain why the Storm Wardens aren't always entirely accurate in their predictions, since there are variables that have a small influence on the system. The biggest thing working against my theory that I can come up with is that the highstorms supposedly pre-date Honor and Cultivation, yet someone has been keeping the moons in a stable orbit, otherwise they would have collided with something by now. Maybe Adonalsium was doing it before, or maybe the moons didn't exist, and the highstorms were more regular, but less intense.

When you realize that you're going to have something truly Awesome for breakfast... When you remember why you really want that Szeth action figure...

Sorry, this is a bit out of order as far as the names go. Hopefully it doesn't matter too much; I'm just throwing in an NPC. "Ashton, Lillian!" called the Headmistress next. A girl broke away from the line and made her way up to the front of the Hall. She had long black hair and striking green eyes, and walked with confidence, not the arrogant kind. As she glided up the aisle, her cloak billowed behind her as if in slow motion. Ben blinked. She was...cute. She sat down atop the stool and the old Headmistress placed the hat on her head. It thought for a moment (ridiculous, Ben thought, hats can't think) before shouting "GRYFFINDOR!" Lillian smiled and took her place at one of the tables. The list moved on to Victor something, but Ben was still deep in thought about the four Hogwarts houses. He didn't know anything about them apart from their names--Gryffindor, Slytherin, Hufflepuff, and Ravenclaw--yet for some reason, a voice in the back of his head suggested, Gryffindor, I hope it's Gryffindor... Lillian smiled.

Hello all, So I am relatively new to Brandon’s books: I read the Mistborn trilogy barely a year ago, and have since then read all the Cosmere works, except Arcanum Unbounded and White Sand (my copies of those arrive Friday!). But, impossibly, no one in my social circle has read Sanderson*, and thus no one with whom I can espouse theories on the Cosmere. I was hoping you would fill this gaping and chasmal hole in my life. Love the site and look forward to future discussions! *On the bright side, I have ready birthday and Christmas gifts for the next decade …

Victor leaned against the wall, waiting for his turn to enter the Great Hall. His last name started with letter B, so it shouldn’t take long. Meanwhile, he took his time to look around and appreciate the medieval architecture and decoration of the castle. Everything was lit by candle light, most likely magically enhanced, as it was too bright for simple candles. There were no visible signs of electricity, however after a quick glance on his phone, he noticed a weak WiFi signal available. Other students stood mostly in small groups, chatting quietly, visibly nervous. No wonder, they were about to be put in a center of attention of the whole school. Victor felt the stress too. He considered himself mature and brave enough to face so much attention, but it wasn’t easy to not feel uncomfortable with it. “Victor Bshenshyshykyewich” announced the Headmistress in the Great Hall. Victor smiled to himself. She must have been practicing, he thought. Encouraged by quiet laughs that rolled through the hall, he left the chamber. He entered the Great Hall right next to the teachers table. From where he was, he could see four long tables standing before the elevation he was currently on. He was relieved to notice that not every student was paying attention to the ceremony. At least a third of them were busy talking to each other. He tried to find Shannon or Serena in the crowds, but with no luck, there were too many people and he didn’t even know which table to look at. In front of him Headmistress McGonagall stood next to a simple stool, holding a ragged old hat in her hands. She smiled to him and gestured to sit down. When Victor took his place, she placed the old hat on his head. Hmm. Let's see here. Lots of potential, and ambition to go right along with it! But you are kind, and clever. This might take a little thinking. Hmm. You have a very interesting mind. Well, I must conclude that there is no other place for you to go than Slytherin. Before you go, I must state that while the actions of Voldemort and his associates were atrocious, they are not linked in any way to the values or intents of the Slytherin House. For more information, I suggest you seek out a senior student or prefect of Slytherin. “SLYTHERIN!” the hat shouted, and the Slytherin table burst into cheers and raucous shouts of congratulation. Headmistress took the Hat from Victor’s head and nodded to let him know the ceremony is over for him. Still shocked after hearing foreign voice inside his own head, Victor stood up and walked slowly towards the Slytherin table, trying to find Shannon among the cheering students. (Text in blue written by @Master Elodin a long time ago )

Imagine being held at gunpoint (bear with me) by a literate animal, and the only hope of rescue is (BEAR WITH ME) through a coded message.

Wow! The resolution is so low, it's like there's not even a picture in that spoiler tag!

Actual conversation from church yesterday: "Ethan! Your hair's gone!" "Yes. It is." "...looks good." "Thanks!"

=== This theory has been moved from the Stormlight Board and updated for Oathbringer. Spoilers start at this post. Read at your own risk === So, this is a theory that I've kinda been kicking around in the back of my head for a while, and I've written some posts using this assumption. However, I've never atually gone and typed up a formal theory post. I... kinda made one on tumblr, but that doesn't count, so I've gotta get it up over here. For those of you alergic to tumblr posts, fret not. I'm going to put all that information over here. Now, as of the Shadows of Self signing, I've got some Word of Brandon on the subject as well! So it's high time we got this thing out here. I'll put the theory itself first, in-book justification, and then Brandon's responses to my questions. Theory: Renarin Kholin's visions throughout Words of Radiance are not a normal manifestation of Truthwatcher powers. They are likely not regular Surgebinding at all and may not even be related to his status as a Truthwatcher. Now, perhaps this seems counter-intuitive. Renarin says in WoR Ch. 89 that he's a Truthwatcher, which means he "sees." He's been seeing throughout the whole book, counting down to the arrival of the Everstorm. Why wouldn't those two be the same thing? Well, there's a few very good reasons why there seems to be more going on with Renarin than originally meets the eye: Arguments: #1 - Renarin's visions do not match other Radiants' expressions of his Surges. Admittedly, we have seen very little use of shared Surges by different orders, but from what we have seen, Surge expression seems to be very similar between sharing orders. Jasnah and Shallan's Soulcasting seems to work the same way, to the point that Jasnah believes she can teach Shallan how Soulcasting works, even though they have different Orders. We see both Ym (who is a Truthwatcher!) and Lift use their shared surge of Regrowth, and in both cases, it seems to work in an almost identical way. We would expect therefore, that Renarin's Surges, Regrowth and Illumination, would manifest in the same way as other users of these Surges. As stated above, we had two separate practitioners of Regrowth in WoR, one of whom was actually a Truthwatcher. On the other side, we've seen extensive use of Illumination thanks to Shallan, who goes through all kinds of self-training and uses of her Illumination powers. With these examples, we should be able to make a very educated guess as to what Renarin's Surgebinding capabilities are, even though we don't actually see him using these powers himself. The problem? Neither of those two surges seem to do anything close to what Renarin's visions do. The visions don't line up with either Illumination as we know it or Regrowth. You might be able to argue that Truthwatchers use Illumination differently than Lightweavers (which I'll support wholeheartedly, but that's a different topic) but this level of difference is difficult to justify. The more logical explanation is that something entirely different is going on. #2 - Renarin's visions appear to be involuntary, compulsive, and entirely outside of his control. [ CONFIRMED: See below ] Renarin is seeing the future, which is highly taboo in Vorin culture. This isn’t something I believe he would choose to do. Considering the way that he hides this from his family throughout the book and the high level of distress he shows in the finale with Shallan, this does not appear to be something he is choosing to experience on his own. In the same way that seeing the future is taboo, so is writing for men. If Renarin does not want to reveal that he’s seeing the future, we wouldn’t expect him to voluntarily write things down. Seeing him succumb to the vision at the end, he cries out and screams as he writes, and the way that he continues to write the same thing over and over make this seem like an involuntary reaction, going as far to be something he would fight if he could, but cannot. He loses control and is forced to write the glyphs. Additionally, Renarin cannot control entering or leaving the visions. While we do see Kaladin and Shallan using their surges unintentionally, we never see them using Stormlight against their will. With Shallan and Kaladin, it is a subconcious thing, rather than something done with them actively fighting it. Shallan is never trapped within an illusion, struggling to get out of it. Kaladin does not ever find himself unable to stop using Stormlight, or toppling into the sky as gravity suddenly yanks him the wrong way without him asking it to. As soon as those two become aware of their surgebinding, they can control it, even if they started unintentionally. Renarin’s visions show no such control. He seems to be able to feel them coming on, but can't do anything to stop them. Once within a vision, he can't get out until the vision itself decides to end. Renarin cannot do anything to stop or resist the visions. They are entirely against his will. #3 - Dalinar's visions are another example of involuntary, uncontrolled, compulsive visions which are not Surgebinding. Now, don't say it. Yes I know that Dalinar is a Surgebinder by the end of Words of Radiance. However, I am fairly certain that he was not a Surgebinder before the very end, when he actually bonds with the Stormfather. And he has been experiencing visions since before Way of Kings started. I take this to mean that they're not Surgebinding. Maybe I'm wrong about that, but that's the assumption I'm working under for now. Dalinar's and Renarin's visions are incredibly similar actually. Both are involuntary and unable to be resisted. Both involve visions. Both have an element of compulsive actions, as Dalinar moves and speaks in other languages and Renarin has an almost hypergraphic need to write during his visions, despite that Renarin probably hasn't ever written before this. They also appear to both be tied to highstorms, since they happen at the same time. Perhaps most telling is the fact that Dalinar seems to think that Renarin's future-sight is his own up until the reveal, and that he simply can't remember it happening. That said, there are differences. Dalinar sees the past, Renarin sees the future. Dalinar is completely unaware of the real world while in the midst of his visions. Renarin seems to know and be aware of what's happening to him, even though he can no longer control his body. Dalinar seems to act out what he's experiencing, Renarin writes. Still, I would argue that Renarin's visions have more in common with Dalinar's visions than with Shallan's Illumination. If Dalinar and Renarin shared a Surge, I'd be comfortable saying that they were a shared Surge. But Truthwatchers and Bondsmiths are actually on directly opposite ends of the Radiant Orders. If this is supposed to be Surgebinding, why are they manifesting similar powers in opposite Orders? Why did Dalinar's start before his Nahel bond? My answer: they're not Surgebinding. Neither one of them. Relevant Canon Texts and Commentary: All are from WoR, because I can’t find any significant evidence of Renarin's powers in WoK. Does Renarin use his powers somehow to hide his coming into the room and writing the glyphs? Does he put Dalinar to sleep somehow? It’s possible. The sudden break between the paragraphs is strange here... Sloppy lines, unpracticed at drawing glyphs. Renarin is not used to writing. He also might have been fighting against the complusion to write as he did it. This is right after the fight with Szeth. Renarin was towed back by Moash at the beginning, and then Kaladin, Dalinar, and Adolin fought. After Kaladin ran Szeth off outside the palace, he was unconscious for an indeterminate amount of time, and then the glyphs were found when he got back. It’s interesting that Renarin would choose to provide the translation, when Navani is there and could read it herself. I would have thought he would not want to implicate himself in the glyphs by reading them. Or perhaps his compulsion pushed him to provide the translation here? I’m mostly putting this in here because it’s another iteration of the glyphs and I wanted them all. The real interesting stuff comes from the discussion afterward between Dalinar and Adolin. Seeing as Renarin is the one doing the carving and not Dalinar, Adolin’s theory is undoubtedly what happened. One wonders if Renarin maintains enough control during the visions to be able to hide himself. Does he have enough autonomy to be able to frame Dalinar for the carvings and keep himself from being implicated? And here we see the reason that Renarin doesn’t come forward with the fact that it’s him. Adolin is used to the idea of his father losing control of himself during Highstorms, but this is taking it a step too far, it seems. Considering that Renarin is already quite an outsider in Vorin culture, he doesn’t want to make it worse. Dalinar is very self-assured even though his own visions are making him lose credit among the other lighteyes. Renarin is not. Over the sounds of me hissing protectively while clutched around my darling and glaring at Shallan, here we have the first time that Renarin is shown doing something strange and/or powery. No one else can sense the Everstorm yet. Pattern mentioned that the storm was coming to Shallan but Renarin seems to be able to sense it on his own. Even being warned about it, Shallan doesn’t see anything. Feather continues to be generally upset in Shallan’s direction. It’s interesting again that he says something here. If he’s trying to hide the fact he can see the future, wouldn’t he keep quiet? Is this right here voluntary or compelled? Feather continues to be GENERALLY STRESSED ABOUT RENARIN’S WELLBEING. By this point we’re definitely getting into involuntary territory. He’s feverish and crying out and screaming. I’m guessing we’re watching Renarin on the cusp of succumbing to the vision, yelling out in defiance right on the edge of it taking him over. Then he’s lost and the writing happens. That said, even as he’s lost control, he continues to talk, whispering as he writes. (UNRELATED SCREAMS OF RAGE) Okay this quote doesn’t really show much of his powers. We’ll say it’s here for the sake of completeness and not because Feather felt like raging at the heavens. Honestly, by this point, I’m really surprised that Shallan continues to think that Renarin is mad or crazy. Considering he’s been giving the exact same warnings as Pattern you’d think she’d catch on that this is a real thing. In some cases, Renarin’s warnings came before Pattern's. So here we see what is really the only argument for Renarin's visions being Truthwatching. I'm not convinced. I think that Renarin probably is a Truthwatcher, since there's other evidence that his Nahel bond is legitimate - screaming Shardblades, healed eyes, Glys, etc. -- but I don't take this as immediately confirming that what's happening with his visions is an expression of Surgebinding. I think the visions are either unrelated, or if related (less likely in my opinion), somehow influenced by an outside force as well. It’s also worth noting here that Glys uses masculine pronouns. Aside from Dalinar and the Stormfather, all other Nahel bonds have been between opposite gender pairs: Shallan/Pattern, Kaladin/Syl, Jasnah/Ivory, Lift/Wyndle, Ym/unnamed spren. Word of Brandon: These questions were asked by me, the first at the Words of Radiance Midnight Release (I'd already finished it at that point) and the latter two at the Shadows of Self Midnight Release. Unfortunately, I don't have direct quotes, though I think the SoS questions were recorded, but haven't been transcribed yet. The WoR Release question is unfortunately very far from verbatim as I just asked and didn't write down the answer until a few hours later. Silly Feather. The SoS two, while also not direct quotes, were written down right after being given. Feather: Is there something important in the fact that Glys and Renarin both have masculine pronouns, while other Nahel bonds have been opposite gender? Brandon: There is something to it, though maybe not what you're thinking of. (Answer is very paraphrased, sorry. I'm not entirely sure what he thought I was thinking of...) Feather: Are Renarin's visions compulsive/involuntary? Brandon: There is an element of that to them, yes. Feather: Are Renarin's visions Surgebinding? Brandon: *evil laughter* RAFO!

Can we just take a moment to appreciate the irony in the Stormlight Archive so far? The Parshendi entered a sort of exile millennia ago to avoid their gods, then assassinate a king to stay away from them. But the war they started by assassinating the king eventually drives them into such desperate circumstances that they return to their gods anyway. Dalinar is trying to unite the Radiants and prevent the Everstorm. But his actions in doing so drive the Parshendi into even greater desperation, eventually causing them to summon the Everstorm. Kaladin only wants to protect others. But revealing his powers to the Parshendi at the Tower is just another driving force that pushes the Parshendi towards the forms of power. And, especially, his rescuing Dalinar and preventing Eshonai from suing for peace before it was too late, was a huge factor in the arrival of the everstorm I know that's a simplified view of what's going on, and there are a lot of factors at play here. The Everstorm was probably inevitable regardless, but still. That is some beautiful irony. And so depressing.

Interesting. All nine fields raised someone. Unfortunately, one was not me... D: Seeing as I have it prepared, I shall post this now... @Arinian (and @Jondesu and @randuir, though it's unclear exactly what your thoughts had been) O: Let's stop and consider the financial status for each of the different classes, shall we? The first thing is that everyone can reasonably expect to accrue 3 talents worth of tuition reductions. This is done by posting, sending a PM, filing a complaint, and impressing a master (putting EP into a field) at least once per cycle. Now, let's start from the top. Vintish Noblepeople get an obscene 30 talent stipend. Even staying at the Horse and Four, in addition to not doing anything, on top of their 33% tuition increase, they still gain 5 talents per term. Oh and they have a 20 talent buffer in case they need it. Aturan Noblepeople 'only' get 20 talents per term. But if they get the aforementioned 3 talent reduction, they are also able to stay in the Horse and Four and still gain 1 talent per cycle to add to their 13 talent stockpile. Yillish Commoners get a stipend of 11 talents. With 3 talents of reductions, they can stay at the Ankers without losing anything, or could stay at the Mews to get an easy profit. If they were keen, 5 RP posts per cycle would allow them to break even while staying at the Golden Pony. They also have a buffer of 7 talents. Cealdish Commoners get a stipend of 9.8 talents. They can stay at the Mews for a 2 talent gain, or the Ankers and break even by making 1 RP post per cycle, and posting a few times about game stuff. 6 RP posts per cycle would get them to the Golden Pony. They also have 6.5 talents of wiggle room with fees. Edema Ruh get 4.5 talents per term. 4.5. So staying at the Mews (half price) and getting that 3 talents of reductions brings the term fees to 7.5 talents. That means, to just breakeven, I, as an Edema Ruh, must make a minimum of 6 RP posts that are at least 200 words per term (3 per cycle). I made 3 total. I also did not file a complaint on the first cycle. So I was going to be losing money this term. But it was only going to be 1.5 talents, and so with my starting 3 talents, dropping to 1.5 talents was ok. Taking a complaint isn't that bad either. 1.4 isn't all that different. But getting put on the horns? Being put on the horns gets me kicked out of the uni, or onto the streets (which can well be a death sentence, given the Bloodthirsty God Dice that preside over this game). Now, you might say "But what about Talent Pipes? Get your Talent Pipes and your money problems are solved!" I will not be trying to get my Talent Pipes. Even though I submitted a song and Edema get a secret bonus to their performing stat, my stat is still so bad that it basically says I have no skill or ability at all. So yeah. Don't think, even for one moment that I, or any other Edema for that matter, is capable of absorbing being brought onto the Horns just because they've RP'd lots. /rant

I believe that Wilson still only has a single vote on her. I'm going to offer my most sincere apologies for voting on you once again, Wilson, but I really need tuition decreases. Right. Thoughts on the game in analysis form to come, probably at the start of cycle tomorrow morning. I haven't been analysing this game much at all yet, so the following comments are subject to revision. Looking over the LG18 spreadsheet, I would reiterate to everyone, the importance of lodging. Mercenaries kill, saving the skindancers two turns for every player who becomes a victim, which happened to 7 of 24 players last game. Even without Wilson's die, and their eagerness for bloodshed (despite her own more enlightened predilections), the streets are dangerous. It's probably too late in the day to remind everyone this cycle, but it's not a bad idea going forward. Coupled with insanity, and the check it poses on village strength (the crockery being tantamount to death), I'd have thought that we're unlikely to see more than 5 eliminators this game, despite the weakness of sabotages vs traditional kills. The eliminators will have a material advantage in coordination in the early game, and in a game with the opportunities for synergy such as this, such early coordination will pay dividends. We can, of course, set the eliminators back in their planning. Expulsions for the village are unfortunate, and reduce a single player's power. Expelling a skin dancer may upset the balance of their team. As such, I would support actually dangerous lynches going forward from the next cycle. I realise this is rather hypocritical, but I am unable to vote from a position of knowledge today - a situation I fully intend to have corrected by tomorrow. Locke was growing rather tired with the teaching at the University. Whoever created such a system had entirely no ambition. The lessons in artithmetic? Rhetoric and debate on abstract philosophy? Vint had an opportunity to teach valuable subjects - economics, civic improvement, the virtues of a strong, centralised government organised around a single worthy figurehead. He resolved to himself to add this to his list of Things To Do In Power, which was growing increasingly long. For most among them was a purge of all current arcanists, for obvious reasons. Leaving the source of his own power discoverable? What sort of fool allowed the ongoing development of powers that might challenge their own rule? At the very least, these recurring instances of madness gave him faith that the glorious revolution entirely non-violent and harmonious overthow of the system would progress without issue. Locke had had a productive conversation with a student interested in psychology last week, and they kept returning, which could only indicate his ideas were beginning to take hold.

I like a lot of where you're going, but I don't like how you got there. I've suggested before that I don't think they're truly 'tapping' F.Nicrosil, either, but rather that the Investiture can still contact their souls and allow them to use the magic encased in the metalmind without needing to be drawn out of the it. I view this similar to Hemalurgy, but not quite identical; more that I don't think a 'Hemalurgical Charge' is anything special, unlike a Feruchemical Charge, but a Hemalurgical Charge is just a piece of a spiritweb. (Where a Feruchemical charge will be some property converted to Investiture, unless it was already Investiture to begin with.) All that goes to say, I like that part of the theory. But that doesn't really address the Connection aspect of it. I think your explanation of Internal vs External Connections is incorrect. I actually like the distinction you've made, but I don't think what you've identified as Internal Connection is Connection at all, and thus wouldn't be involved in F.Duralumin. I think, to understand how External Connection truly works (Or, as I like to call it, Connection), we need to look at the one source that actually explains it in any detail: Secret History. When Kelsier looks into the Spiritual Realm: I think it's interesting that Brandon rarely refers to singular objects in the Spiritual Realm as 'Connections'; rather, he refers to the spiritual substance of Connection, which forms lines of Connection. And it's not just a simple cross-reference table, either, that one person is either Connected to something or not. There are hundreds of lines of Connection between Kelsier and Ruin alone. I think, just maybe, that a line of Connection is an event, the way that the Spiritual Realm manifests anything that will influence a person. Anyways, from this description, there are three kinds of Connection: Person to person. Kelsier leverages this when he speaks to Vin, and later to Spook. I believe this Connection is also used by Forgers and Soulcasters, who both need to understand and leverage the history of an object with respect to individuals (Forgers more than Soulcasters, but Shallan's transformation of the boat in WoR definitely illustrates the concept.) Man to world. This is the kind of Connection that the translation medallions utilize. Kelsier to god. This is probably going to be the Connection that would be involved. I'm not sure of the extent of this sort of Connection needed to manifest magical abilities, or even what this type of Connection means in general unless it's more of the behind-the-scenes influence that gods have. This kind of Connection is definitely needed to Ascend, so maybe it is also an important component of Initiation. I don't think this is primarily of a religious nature; Kelsier didn't worship Ruin, he was influenced by him. I think religious ties are covered in Person to Person Connection, so even though this is between a person and a Shard, I think what you're looking for to explain drawing on someone else's powers would fall under the first kind of Connection. I'm struggling with a specific mechanism for how any Connection would be used in granting magic, unless it's a component of Initiation, along with a crack in the soul and the provision of a piece of a Shard's Investiture. But, since there is no duralumin on the medallions themselves, that would mean that the Connection is only used in their creation, not in their implementation. That all being said... I don't have an alternate mechanism for Connection being involved. At this time, I don't see any relationship between lines of Connection and obtaining magical powers, which is what medallions are all about. (Like you, I have no idea how the original question-asker thought to approach from this angle.) It almost seems simpler if this was a misheard question; if Brandon was answering for Feruchemical Aluminum or Hemalurgical Duralumin, both of which could easily be used. But that would be bad hermeneutics to assert, so at the moment I'll just publically air my musings and leave it at that. There are a lot of tangents that I won't address for the sake of staying on topic, especially since some of those I've addressed elsewhere. (Edwarn's weak/benefit is 'only' unkeyed metalminds, Feruchemy is not storing part of the spiritweb like Hemalurgy does, Excisors are clearly a new term for Spikes.) I like the acupuncture analogies, and would like to see that properly spun off into a theory that I can Espouse. But, best I can gather, the core of your theory is that an artificial Line of Connection can allow Person A to use Feruchemy on Person B's Spiritweb. While I like much of the Realmatic fundamentals you've presented and disagree with a lot of your specific interpretations, on the whole, I find it to be too much of a leap from what we have seen from Connection. So, I guess I do need to expand on what the Set is doing, then, since that is where you're drawing direct manipulation of another's spiritweb. Wayne found the unkeyed goldmind. Someone filled that up; if someone like Templeton's wife was a willing participant (I don't recall that exact scene, but I think I had a vastly different interpretation), they would have suffered the weakness. But Wayne was the one who drew out of it, and received the benefit. The Set already has a secret method that can accomplish exactly what Edwarn described, so I disagree with looking for a more complicated explanation of his words. Sure, you can wonder why anyone would do that, take a F.Aluminum or F.Gold spike and spend all your time storing for someone else. I think there could be a number of personal reasons someone might be willing to do that, and it doesn't necessitate developing this new Connection mechanism. EDIT: @8bitBob, I don't think the second half of Edwarn's sentence is referring to Hemalurgy. It is a bit of a tangent ("even if..."), but still connected. He's saying something like 'We're limited to being triple Ferrings, even if it is Feruchemy+. But the Bands could make me a Full Feruchemist.' The Set has figured out a Feruchemy+ that lets you get energy out that you didn't put in; even if some of us disagree on exactly what that mechanism is.

Some RP now. Greyson walked out of his introductory physicking class. Not my favorite field, but... Well, I guess somebody has to do it. He had a window of time between physicking and sympathy. It occurred to him that in all his time at the University, he'd never had a proper chance to visit Imre. Probably not enough time for that today, but... Maybe sometime. Instead he decided to see if he would be allowed to see Ryth in the crockery. Greyson figured Ryth had just cracked under the stress... But the masters didn't seem to think so. There was talk of skindancers again. Greyson wasn't the suspicious type, but... Well he still kept that iron poker in his room. If anywhere could secretly house skindancers, it would be the University. Anyway, he wanted to see Ryth for himelf. He stopped at the entrance to the crockery. A giller from the medica seemed to be keeping watch over the insane. "Excuse me, but would it be possible to visit Ryth? The one that went insane a few days ago." A tired expression crossed the physicker's face. "You're maybe the eighth student who's come by. I can't let you visit Ryth." "Really? Why?" "Masters' orders. Sorry." "Did any of them say why, by any chance?" "You heard the rumors... Masters've been talking about skindancers and all. Seem to be taking it pretty serious. Maybe they want to investigate." They really think these skindancers are credible? "Very well. Thank you." Greyson left the crockery in search of his next class. He wouldn't be surprised if another student cracked soon. Accusations had been flying every which way recently, and tensions were high. The accusations part might not have started except for his own big mouth... Still, he had to make learning a priority. There wasn't much he could do to fight faerietale monsters... Unless he studied them.

Indigestion? *Shrug*

Today is my pre-AP biology STAAR test, and I'm feeling pretty confident I'll do well. Aside from that, we're reading "To kill a Mockingbird" in my English class and I agreed to make a cheap Nightvale knockoff with a friend of mine on wattpad. I'm having a ton of fun with it and, overall, my life is going pretty good right now! Also, @Darkness Ascendant, thank you. You go through so much and stay strong, you create such beautiful art, and when you tell stories about even the darkest of times, hope can be found laces throughout it, your such a positive influence in the lives of those around you; don't let anyone tell you otherwise! @TwiLyghtSansSparkles, your writing is amazing! It catches and keeps tight hold of my attention in ways I've seen few authors replicate. You're an amazing writer, and an amazing person; if you've got an idea that you think works, I'll support you as long as I am able. Good luck, both of you; I look forward to seeing what you're futures bring!

1. Aman the sexy beast. 2. The wolf itself, really likes orgies (might be a cool guy idk...I certainly like him. Greek Mythology ftw) 3. A bit blue methinks, and seriously, Stickpage XD haven't played any of those games since I was...8? 4. Brandon o_O, probably 9 years old 5. Ender five? like Ender's game? like Endermen? like Ender Wiggin? well anyway he's ending quick. aaah nvm, after checking their forum...probably 9 as well. Also is 5. 6. he has numbers in his name. 'nuff said. Also. Maths. ew 7. Luute, Lutey lutey lute.lutes are cool. 8....scissors? actually a p cool forum 9. Cool a voice-actor fan. And pokemon! 10. lol 11.Team Liquid is some cs go rust right? esports in general. Probably 12 as well 12.Game of thrones. nice. fun rp I bet 13. interesting, keep an eye on him 14. He lies pettigrew. 15. Cool. NSM could stand for so many things...

I've always pictured in my head that when someone goes to see the Nightwatcher they enter a sort of grove. With trees everywhere and it being twilight 24/7. Then the person goes up to a reeeealllyyy old oak tree, and the Nightwatchers voice comes from all around the forrest, as she is the forrest. And the person keeps seeing a dark shadow flint in between the trees as the Nightwatcher speaks.

I would like to point out that in the Cosmere "seeing the future" and "predicting the future" are two different things. Apart from the Vorin superstition that all foreseeing is evil, Voinbinders are always said to have tried to divine or prefect the future. This is (locally) a power of Odium, and to a lesser extent Cultivation, but something Honor isn't any good at. This is most evident in Dalinar's visions, where Honor could see that the Everstorm would come but wasn't able to predict when, so he had to leave pre-recorded visions with the Stormfather to be delivered at the appropriate time. I think a Truthwatcher's ability to see the future is like Honor's, they can see the general "shape" and major events like the Everstorm but can't tell when or how likely unless it is unavoidable. Renarin's countdown doesn't seem to start until the Everstorm is already basically started(Listeners have decided to join with voidspren and it's only a matter of time), so it's more a warning of what's going on now then a prediction of the future. I don't think that the timing or Renarin's actions are the results of an outside influence, but the heavily invested nature of the Highstorm turning his foresight from a "whisper" into a "shout" causing him to be overwhelmed and react with compulsive behavior.

Alas it seems as though I will have to drop out of this game. It also seems like I won't be able to play SE for the foreseeable future, 3 years at the minimum. Well. It's a shame really, I used to just play to burn time, but lately I've actually attempted to get into the whole analysis thing and craps, slowly sure, but I was getting there. And now I don't get to play for the next three years hmph. Well, it's been a fun run you guys, been a blast playing with y'all, hope that I get to do this again sometime (Just hope nothing has changed too much >>) This isn't a suicide note I'll pop in every now and again, this isn't a goodbye. Nor is it a contingency message. I know that my other notes have sounded like suicide notes and crap...and some of you have been concerned about me. But seriously, don't worry about me. I'll pull through, with or without you all. I always do. I'm not being cocky or anything, I guess this is my Kaladin moment, I've been strung up for the Stormfather's judgement heh. I never had an Honor Chasm moment thank god, but trust me. I'll be back. I'll open my eyes after the storm. I always do.

I do think it's mental illness, and no that's not an excuse, but you have to understand the way that mental illness functions. About a year ago a story hit the news about a father who nearly murdered his daughter. He was described as an exceptionally loving father, who wrote songs for her and played them for her on his guitar. He was schizophrenic and had taken his meds religiously for years. For some reason they stopped working, and while the mother and daughter were napping he picked up his daughter, threw her out of the window and went outside and nearly beat her to death. When he was arrested he was trying to explain that he had to send his little girl to the sky. He's now in a mental health facility and for his sake I hope he never has to face what he did, because honestly how could anyone live with that? Now I don't think the Heralds are that severe obviously, but the function of mental illness clouds the ability to distinguish belief from reality. Nale's complete lack of emotion shows that there is more going on than simple denial. Being confronted by everything in a way that cannot be explained away by his perceived reality caused him to face what he's done, and it also caused an emotional outpouring. As good as that realization is, it's also dangerous. He's going to be very fragile mentally. Part of him is going to want to continue on as normal, and the other part is going to reject that. He's going to be at war with himself and unsure of what to trust as real. Nale is going to be erratic and dangerous. His past behavior obviously cannot be swept away and excused, but his level of actual responsibility for his actions is not a cut and dry answer. Mental illness never is. It's complicated and confusing and completely unfair. The people suffering are victims just as much as those they harm.

I think you are too hard with them. They last as long as they could and when they reached the critical point, they left. For them neither the Death is an option, probably they would try the suicide if possibile. This is from their point of view. If we Simply look at their result, thanks to their action, Roshar managed to have the longest safe timeframe from the Shards' arrive. Sure they hide their action, but we don't know the reason...maybe they have a good reason for doing It.

I don't know if they "deserve" anything good, but I think it's kind of hard to blame them, too. I mean, they basically suffered and sacrificed time and again, and eventually they just couldn't handle it anymore. (I haven't read Edgedancer yet, so I can't comment on that, but I'm not sure I'd expect anything good to come to them in the future, either.) I'm not sure this is a perfect analogy, but...it's a little bit like resorting to cannibalism after being lost at sea (or stranded in a snowy mountain or something. No other food available). You don't do it week one (hopefully no one's dead yet, but maybe some are). Not week two, either. You make it through week three, but by now you're really hungry. Maybe you hold out through week four, too...but eventually you give in. What would be deplorable at the beginning becomes more understandable as time wears on without hope of rescue. I imagine it's the same for the Heralds, too. What would be deplorable after the first Desolation, or the second, or the third, becomes...harder to judge after the twentieth or the fortieth. Don't judge someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes.

Hello from Cole I have been on 17th shard for a month or two now. I have asked a lot of questions but never really made anything of my own. Now that I've began my first real theory, I decided to say high to everyone. I've read every Cosmere book, Alcatraz vs. The evil Librarians, The Reckoners, and The Rithmatist. I have loved every one of them and I can't wait for Oathbringer. I really have no friends who read Sanderson but I am getting some hooked so I have more people to talk to about it. I'm glad to meet so many people who share my passion That's all I guess...

That's great, @StrikerEZ! Congrats

I think this mostly depends on the nature of the Honorblades. As we now know, Spren are the Shardblades themselves. What we do not know is if this holds true for the Honorblades. If they are connected directly to a Spren, or Honor himself(before he was "killed"), then I don't think that the Stormfather would permit Dalinar to wield it. Syl might be more yielding, however I doubt she would like it. If they are merely solidified forms of investiture however, then I see no reason why he couldn't keep the weapon, but honestly, I don't really think that we will be seeing nearly as much aggressive action from Dalinar in the future, as he is becoming more of a political leader of the new order, as opposed to a military general, and so he will not have as much need of a weapon of this caliber. For him, it may just become an exceptionally deadly paperweight. Better if it were given to someone on the front line.

In that case, Aman

Guys.....we family. *hugs you all*

Pirates of the Carribean 5 is being released this year, until the title 'Dead Men Tell No Tales'. Which is a cool title; it fits with the pirate naming convention they have. ... if you live in the US. Or in Japan. Because everywhere else, it is being called Pirates of the Carribean: Salazar's Revenge, which I actually had to spit take and check to see if I was being punk'd. Because seriously, that is almost the prototypical bad movie sequel name. It doesn't fit with the previous film convention, it introduces a new character in the title as if he's a big deal and promises his "Revenge" when he's never appeared before. I'm surprised they didn't fit some of the other generic film titles, like "Apocalypse" or "Gensis" in there somewhere. I am so hyped for Pirates of the Carribean: Genesis of Salazar's Revengapocalypse.

So this was posted to one of the Facebook groups I participate in...

Quick Mod Note: Y'all are doing a good job of self moderating (making my job easy), but yes, double posting and running threads off topic are frowned upon. Thanks, everyone, for helping to keep the thread tidy. I don't think we derailed too much in here! Now then, as theory poster, I don't know if I ever discussed resonances re: Renarin. I'm... pretty unconvinced that the future thing is a resonance. Again, it just doesn't seem to be on par with other resonances. They don't match up. Resonances seem like little perks or quirks of each order, which kind of make them unique or help them out. I mean, Windrunners get more squires, Lightweavers get good memories, and Truthwatchers get all-consuming and utterly uncontrollable visions of the future, which entirely take over their body? It just doesn't line up, for me. We're talking about very different classes of things here.

Greetings one and all! We are proud to announce the Grand Opening of the first Cosmere University!!! We are the first interplanetary university in the cosmere and admit (nearly) all setient applicants, even if you're a skaa or a darkeyes! With a glorious view of the cosmos and infrequent attacks on the campus, we garuntee a blissful learning enviroment like no other! Here are some of our classes and professors: The Economics of Allomancy, taught by Professor Dockson Cosmere Biology. This Class is split into different sections: Greatshells and their kin, Mistwraiths, and Cremlings Leadership and You: The definitive guide on leadership, taught by Professors Elend Venture, Dalinar Kholin, and Raoden Politics: An Immortal Perspective, taught by Professor Blushweaver. Antilogic 101, taught by Professor Wayne The Textiles of War: Wartime Economics, taught by Professors Sebarial and Dockson Cosmere 101: A Brief Guide to Our Universe, taught by Headmaster Hoid The Art of Banter, taught by professors Lightsong, Shallan Davar, and guest lectures by Headmaster Hoid Religious Studies, taught by Professor Sazed Destruction 101, Taught by Professors Nightblood and Szeth Linguistics 300: Accents and Impersonations, taught by Professor Wayne Sociology 500: Inter-Shard World Communications Culinary 70: Horneater Cuisine, taught by Professor Numuhukumakiaki'aialunamor Psychology 600: Lifeless Art 60: Drawing and Composition, Taught by Professors Shallan Davar and Ben McSweeney Creative Writing, taught by Professor Brandon Sanderson Some of our courses are specialized for talented students. They include the following: Emotional Allomancy: It's a Riot!, taught by Professor Breeze Landrian Physical Allomancy 1: Effective Pewter Use, Taught by Professor Hammond Physical Allomancy 2: The Usefulness of Tin, taught by Professor Spook Gravitation and Physics, taught by Professors Szeth and Kaladin Push and Pull: The Physics of Steel and Iron, taught by Professors Kelsier and Vin Aon Geometry, taught by Professor Raoden Awakening for Losers Beginners, taught by Professor Vasher Worldsinging, Taught by Headmaster Hoid and Professor Sigzil The Art of Lightweaving, taught by Professor Shallan Davar Eating Rocks: The Science of Soulcasting, taught by Professor Jasnah Kholin Worldhopping, taught by Headmaster Hoid and Professors Galladon and Demoux Domination: a guide to being an evil overlord, taught by Professor Rashek and the 17th Shard Staff We also encourage new students to join our dueling team! We hope you make the choice to join our beloved alumni and look forward to seeing you soon! (Please feel free to make your own suggestions for classes and staff)

That Stanza actually has its own thread, where the "land that was warm" has seen some specific discussion: I'm personally on the side of Parshendi being Worldhoppers within Greater Roshar (though probably native to Roshar) back before the Desolations, and encountering Voidspren in the Cognitive Realm of Braize (which is... very warm, by most in-book accounts).

I think I'll get to read this book before I get to read another Rothfuss book.

Notice I said "unlikely" not "impossible" because in the great schema really a few things are 100% impossible. Some weirdness may always happen with the Cosmere's inner rules. So for example to try to twist your theory a bit: Ambition died in an unknown Place. Probably not on a Planet...For some reason Odium choose to not strike down the freshman Dead Vessel (too tired or Ambition runned away in a Place where another Shard was and Odium could sustain another Battle or again Odium's mercy). So we have a Cognitive Shadow in that Place (because Ambition's Vessel chose to remain). Now if we assume Ambition stayed a lot of time in Therenody, we could ipotizate his connection to Therenody allows him to return there. Now we have Ambition's cognitive Shadow on Therenody. Unless he manage to recover a decent amount of power there. It would be only a Ghost. Also as a Ghost (if we assume It was a jerk or have something aganist local people). He starter to influence people (the madmen through their Soul's crack) to start an actual social calamity. This social calamity is the Evil (something that could happen also without magical interference). Who Force the Scouts to leave Homeland for the Forests of Hell. As you can see. This is not impossible, but I Need to make a good Number of speculations and Realmatic hypotesis only to make It possible. Notice also It is hard to understand Why the Evil didn't follow the Scouts. Maybe It's a physical manace and the Sea is a real obstacle. Maybe It's Cognitive in nature and the Evil is afraid of the Shades (I think a Shade could infect another Cognitive Shadow...It is a Nice question for Brandon). Lastly, this is a Place of discussion and speculation. Don't be afraid of expose your idea, but don't be fossilizzate in them either. Just to make you laught, in my signature, there is a old theory of mine about the Evil ;-)

This theory is unlikely. I explain myself Better: - Ambition & Odium fighted also on Therenody's system. But the actual killing blow happened somewhere else. - Indeed It's possible Ambition's Vessel could remain as Cognitive Shadow but: (1) Probabily Odium Will Simply crush him/her (2) this Shadow Will be not a relevant entity. Just someone Ghost, unable to influence directly the physical...If you read SH. Our Ambition's Vessel Shadow Will be like the SH's Main character (at least for half of the book) Don't make your knowledge of the Stormfather tricks you. Tanavast's Shadow merged with an already present "powerful spren" (the rider of the storm). He maybe gained some margin from the Shadow but the actual Power was already there. Little recap: In the end if Ambition's Vessel remained as Cognitive Shadow It would be not in Therenody and He Will be not a powerful entity at all.

I didn't like the characters as much. They feel....flat. And they felt similar to Wax and Wayne. But I liked the plot very much. I had suspicions about Davis being a dupe in another Snapshot, but I did not expect Davis planning to kill Chaz at all. The Brandonbot never fails to deliver plot twists. I do hope to see more of this world, it's one of the most interesting worlds among his works. Is this a Core Possibility? (omg is Rithmatist one?)

The Queen dies in the next book and Elhokar and the lopen's mom become an item

So, two competing interpretations possible. Version 1: Boon: Evi => Shshshshshhh. Curse => Renarin's health [*] Version 2: Boon: Something that might help Renarin with his disease [**]. Curse: Evi ==> Shshshshshsh. [*] Most of the other curses we saw, I think, were mental in nature: things of perception, whereas the boons could've been anything. This supports the idea that Shshshsh is the curse part of the deal. [**] Sending a spren to bond Renarin may be Nightwatcher's way of healing the boy (hey, it seems to have worked, no?). Truthwatching appears to be on the Cultivation's side of the double eye, so there. This might also explain why Glys is a boy - if this is a special deal from Nightwatcher, she may have selected someone, rather than relying on the standard boy-girl pairing (which reminds me a lot of Philip Pullman's daemons - wow - I get to bring him up twice in a row in these threads (-: ). Also might explain the visions. As an aside, I am much more receptive to the idea that this (Renarin's visions that is) is Cultivation's influence above and beyond the standard KR package, than to the idea that this is Odium.

Calling the Crackpot theory now: Nale was in league with Treledees. The Pahn Kahl Rebellion was an inside job. Shardblades can't cut steel beams.

Established facts There will be a 15 year gap between Book 5 & 6 - WoB Mistborn Era 2 takes place during this gap - Coppermind Chronology Chapter epitaphs have clues for future events Oathpact once bound Odium to the Rosharian system, but it's questionable whether or not the Heralds broke the pact Speculation Honor's Shadow / Stormfather, or at least Dalinar's Visions, are being partially influenced or co-opted by Odium. (iirc, A bridgeman guard catches a glimpse of a voidspren outside either during or right after one of Dalinar's visions.) Specifically, the idea of challenging Odium via a fight of champions is Odium's ace-in-the-hole / escape plan Book 5 will contain the choosing of champions; Kaladin or Dalinar becomes humanity's champion but Odium pulls a fast one and designates a newborn baby as his champion, thus the following two death rattles combined: "I hold the suckling child [Odium Champion] in my hands , a knife at his throat, and know that all who live wish me to let the blade slip. Spill its blood upon the ground, over my hands, and with it gain us further breath to draw.[Humanity wants to kill the champion to end or delay the desolation / defeat Odium] So the night will reign , for the choice of honor is life " Dalinar or Kaladin's oaths would never allow them to kill an innocent child "for the choice of honor is life". Assuming the shardiac champion system is similar to that of humans, Odium and KR couldn't take action while the champion battle is undecided thus resulting in a stalemate of sorts. Odiums survives / his preexisting influence continues [the night will reign]. Since KR won't or can't take direct action, Odium heads to Scadrial to attack Harmony (the red encroachment Harmony shows Wax). The 15-year gap allows this child to grow to an age where they could serve as a protagonist, antagonist, or other important character in the second half of Stormlight.

via Imgflip Meme Maker

*clears throat* I believe someone called for the fandom monster? This seems like the perfect thread for me... See, the most fun kinds of horrfying and tragic AUs are those which are closest to canon, the ones that could almost be plausible. And oh are there some wonderful ideas we could toss around... It's funny. Kogi and I ended up coming down almost exactly the same way on an Evil!Shallan. I'm unsurprised. Kogi and I have very similar thoughts on a lot of things... Shallan See, Shallan is almost on the verge of villiany herself. She's an accomplished liar, involved in the underground, and she's broken in ways that even she has difficulty admitting. She tells herself that she's doing what she has to in order to survive, in order to protect her family, in order to save the world. She shows herself willing to sacrifice those ideas of right and wrong when she steals from Jasnah, putting her needs above her morality. As Pattern keeps showing her more and more scenes from her past, forcing her to remember, to relive, she has a harder and harder time pretending she isn't a monster. She blames him -- irrationally, she knows -- but blames him nonetheless. If it wasn’t for him, she wouldn’t be a Radiant. Her mother wouldn’t be dead at her hand. None of this would have happened. Pattern does as he must, showing her the truths, making her confront them but it drives her further and further away from him. She keeps up the illusion of the girl with the lighthearted wit, but it is an illusion nonetheless. Inside, the truths of her past are making her colder and colder. Pattern accepts this as a matter of course. He was told time and time again of the cruelty of humans. As Shallan begins treating him less like a person and more like a tool, he accepts his role with a suffering endurance. This is the price he knew he would have to pay in order to come to the physical realm. Things seemed nice for a while, but those days are long gone. Shallan speaks to him when she needs a sword or a lock picked or a code broken, and he obeys quietly, waiting for the day when she will inevitably kill him and find the revenge she seeks. The only other person who sees this hardening in Shallan is Mraize, who not only recognizes it, but encourages it. He marvels at the talent of his little knife, as she accepts that which she was always meant to be. He knows that he is winning her over as Veil becomes the reality and the girl known as Shallan becomes a mask for her to wear, a part for her to play. She joined as a way to betray the Ghostbloods, but their reasoning has wormed its way into her, and Mraize’s honeyed explanations and persuasions – so at odds with this broken face – are making her compromise, bit by bit, until she is well and truly theirs. It isn’t to protect her brothers anymore, it isn’t because she wants to find out about them anymore. She continues following their orders because she know longer knows what she is without them. The first time Mraize asks her to kill, she can’t even feel shocked. Only a hollow reminder that it will not be her first time. Nor even her second or her third. The images of her mother, of the lover, of Tyn rise to the surface of her mind. That which was once so carefully locked away Pattern has pried open and let free. There is no blood with a Shardblade. Pattern stays perfectly clean, as though he has no part in the things she does, as though her sins cannot stain him. She resents him for that as well. When the time comes to go through with the act however, the memory which fills her mind is not that of her mother or of Tyn, but of the man who never raised a hand to her, who took the blame for her first murder. She always thought Balat was the one who would emulate their father, but Shallan finds him within herself, even as she thinks back to kneeling on the ground beside him, a soft song on her lips, and a sparkling silver chain slowly twisted tighter and tighter after the poison could not end it. After something like that, what more could Mraize’s orders do to stain her soul? She feels only the slightest bit of remorse when she hears the name, a bare nod to the fondness she once felt. Tyn could not finish her mission, but Veil has proved herself more competent than Tyn ever was. Jasnah Kholin must not be allowed to continue. The Elsecaller interferes with their work. ---- Maxal, as is unsurpising to everyone, we disagree on Renarin's characterization. See, the thread isn't necessarily good characters being evil... so much as it is protagonists becoming antagonists, right? So, how about antagonist Renarin, hmm? Let's give that a try. Renarin – Because I Enjoy Making Myself Cry The ardents were correct: seeing the future is a terrible curse. Renarin has learned to be alone when the highstorm hits. His father always preferred to have those close to him help keep him from hurting himself when his visions came, but Renarin’s visions are those best suffered alone. Dalinar was not aware of himself when he saw the messages from the Almighty; he left his body behind. Renarin was always trapped, horribly aware as the control of his body was taken from him. He screams as the vision takes him, collapsing to the floor, his fingers seeking out the charcoal in his pocket. He learned to always carry something with which to write. The broken fingernails and blood-streaked fingers had taught him quickly that when the visions came, the glyphs would be written one way or another. He suffers through it, enduring the terrible images of what is to come, praying to the Almighty to release him from this horrible nightmare. His hands move of their own accord, scrawling glyphs into the floor. He feels tears run down his face but cannot do anything to wipe them away. It will be over soon, he hopes. He prays. But in the moment, it seems endless. Those images, those horrible truths he is forced to watch. They cannot be real. This cannot be the future. And yet, he knows with more certainty than he knows his own name that the things he sees will come to pass. Kaladin comes to find him after the storm passes and the vision fades. The former bridgeman rushes over as he finds Renarin trembling on the floor, clutching his head. The charcoal piece has been flung as far as possible from him, his first action after regaining control of himself. As Kaladin draws near however, Renarin cries out, trying to push himself away. “Renarin,” Kaladin says carefully. “The storm is passed. Are you still in a vision?” Renarin can only shake his head, still trying to put distance between himself and Kaladin, but feeling too weak to get away. He’s going to see, he’s going to know, it’s going to happen… Kaladin hesitates, not wanting to upset him, then sees the glyphs laid out in shaky handwriting around the shaking prince. Bridge Four, Leader, Death. Bridge Four, Leader, Death. Bridge Four, Leader, Death. “Is this… me?” Kaladin asks carefully, taking another slow step forward. He knows Renarin isn’t in a vision anymore, but something is terribly wrong, and it’s Kaladin’s job to help make it right. Renarin can only nod before loses control of himself for the second time in one hour, this time to sobs rather than images. At some point he realizes Kaladin’s arms are around him, his hands rubbing smooth, calming circles on Renarin’s back. “It’s okay, it’s okay,” Kaladin says again and again, and though Renarin knows they aren’t true, they help. He doesn’t know what is happening exactly. Is Kaladin his bodyguard, and he the lighteyed prince? Is Kaladin his superior officer, and he a still-new member of Bridge Four? Are they peers, two Knights Radiant of equal standing? Or have they reached the point where the roles and ranks and rules no longer even matter? “It’s me,” Renarin whispers, still holding on to Kaladin like a lifeline in the storm. “It has to be me.” Kaladin stiffens, though to his credit, he doesn’t let go. His voice catches slightly as he asks, “Are you sure? Is there any other way?” Renarin shakes his head slightly. “If I don’t… all is lost. Everything, Kaladin.” The two stay silent for a while, before Kaladin finds his voice again. “When?” “I don’t know,” Renarin mumbles. “Soon. Maybe a few weeks.” Kaladin considers that for a moment, and Renarin isn’t entirely sure how he will react. Will he be mad? Try to stop Renarin from going through with it? Will he try to kill Renarin before it could happen? “The others will blame you,” Kaladin says, sounding somewhat distant. Focusing on what would happen to Renarin afterward as a way to avoid thinking about it, perhaps. “You might have to run away. They might chase after you.” “They will,” Renarin says hollowly. “I saw that too.” --- He knows as soon as the moment comes. A sick lurching sense of déjà vu overtakes him. It’s like watching a stormwall out on a flat plain. Nowhere to hide, no way to fight back. Nothing to do as that inevitable destruction bears closer until it is upon you. They’re in the midst of a small fight, nothing Bridge Four and the Kholin shardbearers can’t handle, but Renarin knows. He steps back, pulling himself away from the fighting. “K-kaladin!” His voice breaks over the name. Kaladin turns toward him, looking to see if he’s been hurt or something, but the look on Renarin’s face tells him enough. For once, Renarin wishes Kaladin isn’t the one who can always understand him. The weight of understanding settling across Kaladin’s expression seems almost more painful than the idea of what is about to happen. Renarin finds that he’s holding a knife. He doesn’t remember picking it up but he must have sometime in the battle. In a way he’s thankful for that. This way he doesn’t have to force Glys to be a part of this. His hand trebles as he looks down, the lights reflecting off the blade shaking and flashing. Kaladin calls for the men to hold the line as he steps out as well, letting Adolin take over command. Renarin’s brother looks back to see if they need him as well, but Kaladin waves him back. As Kaladin approaches, Renarin takes a step back, wanting to throw the knife as far from himself, wanting to tell Kaladin to run away, knowing that if he does, all will be lost. He’s seen what will happen, he knows there’s no way out. Everything is happening exactly as he saw. “It’s now?” Kaladin asks quietly. Renarin nods. “There’s no other way?” Renarin shakes his head. Something wet slides down his cheek as he does so. “Kaladin, I can’t. I can’t do this…” Kaladin takes hold of his wrist, stilling the knife’s trembling. “You’ve already said you have to. I’m not afraid to die, Renarin. If the choice is between me and the world, I know which choice I would pick.” “I don’t…” “Yes, you do,” Kaladin says. “We both do.” He raises Renarin’s hand, placing the knife right above the embroidered crest on his uniform. “Right here. Push straight in, right between the ribs and to the heart, then pull it back out. It’ll be quick. I’ll barely feel it. Take my stormlight, you’ll need it to run.” Renarin can feel the moment press closer and closer. When he hesitates, Kaladin pinches his arm sharply, and Renarin reflexively gasps, pulling in the stormlight Kaladin was carrying. Adolin notices them, sees Renarin holding a knife to Kaladin’s chest. “Renarin! What are you—“ The moment hits. His grip tightens on the knife as he feels the choice he needs to make. Kaladin nods, just once. The knife goes in.